What Could Possibly Go Wrong?

[Bruce H]

Loaded trailer weight of front trailer 6500 lbs. Loaded trailer weight of rear trailer 650 lbs. Tongue length of rear trailer 10 ft. Body length of rear trailer 8 ft. Second hitch ball located under front trailer 3 ft forward of rear bumper. Brakes on both trailers. Overall length 60 ft 4 inches. What could possibly go wrong?

[David Tilston]

In Alberta, (Canada) this would be fine in the eyes of the traffic cop. In fact, I saw a uber mondo grande fifth wheel trailer towing a 2/3 as large cargo trailer.

I'd hate to try to back it up.

[Carol H]

Wouldn't make it past a traffic cop in BC - only one trailer can be towed at a time.

[Thomas G.]

I'd pay money to see him back it up.

[Raz]

Originally Posted by Thomas G.

I'd pay money to see him back it up.

And then parallel park it.....

[Carol H]

Originally Posted by P. Raz

And then parallel park it.....

Dont forget he has to do it with only 6" to spare

[BCDave]

Originally Posted by Thomas G.

I'd pay money to see him back it up.

I've seen guys who can do that - and back the whole thing around a corner, too! (I'm not one of the ones who can, but....)

[Carol H]

Originally Posted by David Tilston

In Alberta, (Canada) this would be fine in the eyes of the traffic cop. In fact, I saw a uber mondo grande fifth wheel trailer towing a 2/3 as large cargo trailer.

Actually David it would not make it past a cop in Alberta either. Just read here on page 10 that in Alberta a second trailer can only be towed behind the first if the first one is a fifth wheel - which is what you saw.

[Ron in BC]

Every province and state seems to have differing rules about 2nd trailers etc. So it would be a real minefield to travel with that setup.

But what gets me is the second ball located 3' forward of the bumper. Presumably that means under the 1st trailer. If so, what would happen when the back end of the trailer went downwards? Wouldn't the tongue of the rear trailer get bent?
Ron

[David Tilston]

Originally Posted by Ron in BC

Wouldn't the tongue of the rear trailer get bent?
Ron

Traffic laws you can break. The laws of physics are more difficult to flaunt.

[Bruce H]

Ok here is the story: I thought about this for a couple of years and finally decided to go ahead and do it. I had a couple of motivators. One is I want to be able to transport a light aluminum flat bottom boat as well as the camper for fishing trips. This trailer will accomodate that. The other is I had been planing a trip to the Bonneville Salt Flats for the annual speed trials and I wanted to transport some items to have for that, namely an EasyUp canopy, an elevated observing seat (hunting stand) the large cooler and some lawn chairs. The small trailer serves several purposes. One is I can transport the ATV on it. The other is it is light enough that I can also pull it with the ATV. At Bonneville you camp approximately 10 miles from the track. They do not let you stay out on the salt at night. I did not want to drive my truck or pull my camper out onto the salt. There are moist areas and the salt flies up and coats the undercarriage of vehicles. It is virtually impossible to get it all off. There is also a possibility of getting stuck. The Salt Flats is after all a lake bed with a crust of salt over deep soft mud. A lot of people do drive a lot of expensive vehicles out there but I am not one of them. I rode the ATV and pulled the trailer with the above mentioned items each day. You have to have some sort of sun shade out there.

I checked to be sure I was in compliance with the towing laws in each state I traveled through. I left Missouri on August 1st and traveled through Kansas and into Colorado. I camped in the mountains near Silverton, Colorado for a few days and rode the Alpine Loop trails with the ATV. I then traveled out of Colorado and accross Utah to Bonneville. I arrived there on August 8th. I left on August 17th and traveled to the Rye Patch Lake in western Nevada. I was preparing to stay there for three or four days when my portable generator caught fire and damaged my ATV and truck. I decided to cut my trip short and return to Missouri. I took I-80 from there back accross Nevada, Utah, Wyoming and Nebraska then down through the corner of Iowa and into Missouri. The total trip was 3550 miles. My regular highway speed was 62 mph. When I went through Salt Lake City the first time traffic was heavy and moving at 78 mph in all lanes. Trying to conflict with that by going 15 mph slower would have resulted in an accident. The double trailer setup pulled great, absolutely no problems or fishtailing. The reason for the 10 ft tongue in the second trailer is to stabilize it. The reason for setting the ball under the trailer 3 feet is to get it closer to the front trailer axles to reduce the overhang and further stabilize the rig. My engineering proved correct. And just so everyone knows I can back the rig.

Pictures below are Wolf Creek Pass, Maggie Gulch Forest Service Campground in Colorado, My observing setup at Bonneville and a race car at Bonneville.

[David Tilston]

Bruce,

When we had a cargo plat form on our Safari mini van, it dragged several times going in and out of gas stations. How did you avoid bending the tongue on the rear trailer?

[Hambone]

in Minnesota not allowed
MINNESOTA: Maximum RV width 102 in.; maximum motorhome length 45 ft; maximum trailer length 45 ft; maximum RV height 13.5 ft.; maximum lengths for two/three combination 75/70 ft. (Three-vehicle combo must be a fifth-wheel trailer, maximum length 28 ft. + watercraft, ATV, motorcycle or snowmobile). Riding allowed in travel trailers, fifth-wheel trailers and truck campers. RV Safety Requirements: Over 3,000 lbs.: trailer brakes, two safety chains, glass mirror and hitch to safety stands. Over 6,000 lbs.: breakaway switch also. Driving Laws: Headlights on during rain, sleet, snow or hail. Right turn on red is allowed, unless posted otherwise. At least two riders required for carpool lane. Mobile police scanners not allowed. More Information: Minnesota State Patrol, 444 Cedar St., Suite 130, St. Paul MN 55101-5130. Emergency number: 911.
In Missouri maybe depending on length
MISSOURI: Maximum RV width 102 in.; maximum motorhome length 45 ft.; maximum trailer length not specified; maximum RV height 14 ft. (if more than 10 miles from designated highway, width 8 ft.; height 13.5 ft.); maximum combined length for two- or three- vehicle combination 65 ft. (55 ft. if more than 10 miles from a primary or designated highway). Riding allowed in truck campers, fifth-wheel trailers and travel trailers. Overnight parking in rest areas is allowed where posted. RV Safety Requirements: Trailers over 3,000 lbs.: trailer brakes and breakaway switch recommended. Safety chains required for bumper hitches. Driving Laws: Right turn on red allowed unless posted otherwise. Wipers on/headlights on recommended. More Information: Missouri State Highway Patrol, Commercial Vehicle Enforcement Div., P.O. Box 568, Jefferson City MO 65102; (573) 526-6128. Road/highway information (800) 222-6400. Emergency number: 911 or *55 on cellular phones.

[Carol H]

A quick look here suggest that the set up would be very restrictive as to where you can legally take it.

In Canada it appears it would only be legal in one Province and in the US it looks like there are about 21 States that would not allow it - assuming the website is correct in its info that is & my fast count was correct.

[Bruce H]

Originally Posted by David Tilston

Bruce, When we had a cargo plat form on our Safari mini van, it dragged several times going in and out of gas stations. How did you avoid bending the tongue on the rear trailer?

Believe me I had those concerns. When I was designing this setup I knew I wanted to set the ball under the rear of the front trailer closer to the axles to reduce the "whip" that tow vehicle overhang gives a trailer. I also know that the shorter the tongue is in a trailer the more the severity of that whip is magnified. That is one reason I chose to lengthen the second trailer tongue the extent I did. I was not sure just how far under the front trailer I could put it before I would encounter the problem you mention so I did a lot of measuring and calculating. There is 22 inches of clearance under the rear bumper of the Bigfoot on a level road. I set the height of the 10' 3x3 tongue at 8 inches above the road and 11 inches below the bumper of the trailer. I checked these measurements, clearances and angles with the 10' tongue before I bolted it to the second trailer. There is an additional 4 1/2' of length from the front of the second trailer body to the axle making the total pivot length 14 1/2' You could raise the trailer wheels 53" off the (level) ground before the tongue would make contact with the under side of the bumper. I carefully approached and positioned the trailers in some uneven driveways near my home and checked the clearances before I started out. During my trip I avoided a few excessively steep or uneven driveways. I crossed the less steep and uneven ones at a diagonal angle. The tongue never made contact with the "tow trailer" or dragged the ground anytime during the entire 3550 mile trip. I do have to watch where I am going and I would not want the tongue any farther under the front trailer. Here is a picture of the trailer with the longer tongue hooked to my ATV at the Bonneville Salt Flats. I will take some better pictures and post them.

[Bruce H]

Additional photos. I pulled this setup on a hunting trip this fall. The weight of the aluminum trailer is 360 lbs. The weight if the ATV is 850 lbs. I am not sure what the "tongue weight" is but it is not much. I pulled it 55 miles over curvy, hilly, secondary asphalt roads. The speed was between 35 and 60 mph. It pulled fine.

[cpaharley2008]

looks like you are moving!!

[Francesca Knowles]

Originally Posted by Bruce H

. And just so everyone knows I can back the rig.

This I'd have to see to believe...well, for more than a few feet straight back, anyway.

Francesca