Hi I am a proud new ower of a 1980 Scamp - Fiberglass RV
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Old 08-22-2013, 09:03 PM   #1
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Name: Nathan
Trailer: 1980 Scamp
Michigan
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Hi I am a proud new ower of a 1980 Scamp

Its a work in progress. I currently have it up on saw horses. I have to replace the wood floor and do some frame welding. I have a few points I am stuck on.

1. The best way to remove the front and back floor from the fiberglass walls.

2. What to do with the elephant skin. Can I paint it? what kind of paint? what do you do to the ugly joint seams along it? or can I buy it and what does a roll typically cost ?

3. What should I seal the exterior Grade plywood with ?

Im sorry for the barrage of questions off the bat.
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Old 08-22-2013, 10:55 PM   #2
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Its a work in progress. I currently have it up on saw horses. I have to replace the wood floor and do some frame welding. I have a few points I am stuck on.

1. The best way to remove the front and back floor from the fiberglass walls.

2. What to do with the elephant skin. Can I paint it? what kind of paint? what do you do to the ugly joint seams along it? or can I buy it and what does a roll typically cost ?

3. What should I seal the exterior Grade plywood with ?

Im sorry for the barrage of questions off the bat.
to FGRV Nathan,

You will be better off if you slow down and come up with a game plan. Replace one section of floor at a time. You should eventually have to drop the frame, so plan that into your schedule. How is your axle?

The elephant skin is called ensolite. You will use latex caulking and seam tape, possibly paint if needed.

It is best to search each item separately and come up with your own ideas. Tom will pipe in and tell you how to search. It looks as though you have a good grasp on what needs to be done.
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Old 08-23-2013, 12:16 AM   #3
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The seam tape from scamp is known for it's lack of ability to stick for long. I used 3m 77 spray on adhesive on the wall along the seam then stuck the tape on after letting the adhesive tack up, seemed to work pretty well. Google scamp store, it's under trims. 2 rolls is plenty.

People have reported finding other suppliers of the tape that is of higher quality than that sold by Scamp. Maybe one of them will post a link to a source.

Others have gone with a caulk and dab with wet sponge to blend in the seam.

You would be surprised at how well that elephant hide wall covering cleans up given some elbow grease, cleaning solution, and plenty of rinse water. You have to clean it and rinse it really well to paint. When done cleaning stand back look it over and decide if you need to take on a painting project. Or not.

Not sure exactly what you mean about best way to remove walls from floor? The walls are attached to the floor using fiberglass cloth and resin. You have to cut it, and then sand the bottom of the walls to prep for new application.

You might want to think about all you plan to do, then break it down into steps. Post threads on the specific steps. Frame repair and floor replacement as a distinct thread from seam tape or painting. There are several people here who have done a body off frame and floor replacement, have posted lots of information and will pitch in if the thread is on that subject.

Use the search, the Site Search Google search from the menu drop down, not the regular forum search, you will probably find lots of pictures and information on frame/floor work. First item, second page includes a youtube video.

http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/m...mp+frame&sa=Go

Good luck on bringing your baby back to the world of camping!
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Old 08-23-2013, 04:41 AM   #4
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Hi Nathan, to FiberglassRV, we're glad you're here

There's lots of kind and helpful people here on the forums, with lots of good information in the archives.

I'd suggest, when you run into an issue to post one problem per thread in the Problem Solving forum. It sure helps with search and keeps all the answers from getting tangled up.

No need to rush, expecting answers for everything. We'll be here for as long as you need us and, please post pictures as you move through the rehab. We love pics!
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Old 08-23-2013, 06:37 AM   #5
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..........Tom will pipe in and tell you how to search. ....
OK, here is the magic key:
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Old 08-23-2013, 06:49 AM   #6
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Name: Nathan
Trailer: 1980 Scamp
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Roy in TO

Why will I have to drop the frame ?
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:04 AM   #7
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Roy in TO

Why will I have to drop the frame ?
Not Roy but I'll answer. Fiberglass and welding don't mix. Or, for general maintenance in checking for rust, cracks or the axel.

The tongue broke off my 77' 13' Trillium yesterday (while pulling it on the Interstate -no damage, no one hurt) . So, I'll be one of those people in here urging people to really give the frame a good going over!

AND -
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:09 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by natem View Post
I have to replace the wood floor and do some frame welding.
Quote:
Originally Posted by natem View Post
Why will I have to drop the frame ?
It makes the top 2 items easier and you will end up with better results. Some key search terms are "body off" and "drop frame" or "frame removal".
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Old 08-23-2013, 11:23 AM   #9
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Name: Nathan
Trailer: 1980 Scamp
Michigan
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Originally Posted by Roy in TO View Post
to FGRV Nathan,

You will be better off if you slow down and come up with a game plan. Replace one section of floor at a time. You should eventually have to drop the frame, so plan that into your schedule. How is your axle?

The elephant skin is called ensolite. You will use latex caulking and seam tape, possibly paint if needed.

It is best to search each item separately and come up with your own ideas. Tom will pipe in and tell you how to search. It looks as though you have a good grasp on what needs to be done.

I was told when I bought the camper that the axle was aligned last year when the new tires were installed. I know its not a factory axle as it is a 4 bolt with electric brakes. How would I tell if the axle was bad ?

Thanks for the help
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Old 08-23-2013, 02:45 PM   #10
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Pretty sure 4 bolt is the standard axle configuration. Others with wider experience may know specifics of your year.

Post #16 of this page http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...e-60483-2.html describes how to figure out the "orginal" up or down angle of the axle arm. Compare original angle to current angle of arm.

If it started life with arm at 10 degree down angle and now arm is above frame it's getting worn. It's the rubber inside the axle that the arm twists against that provides a suspension. Rubber wears out arm gets pushed higher by weight of trailer.

If sitting on the ground with weight of trailer on wheels your wheel well cuts across the middle of the top half of the rim rather than the rubber of the tire I would suspect it's worn.

Worn out is more relative. Lot of worn axles on the road, if the tires are not hitting the top of the wheel well going over bumps or tires are not wearing really fast it's not a crisis.

Not sure how one aligns axle? Bracket welded to frame, axle bolted to bracket. Unless there are slots or something instead of holes?
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Old 08-23-2013, 03:27 PM   #11
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OMG: In the pic of it up in the air, the wheels are well up into the wheel wells, indicating a sagging axle. I imagine on the ground, unless they are limited by mechanical stops already, that they will go up even further.

As mentioned, there are no "Alignment" adjustments as everything is usually welded in place.

But all bets would be that, if it's an original axle (some had brakes, some had the brakes added afterwards), it will have sagged (as shown) until the wheels are well up in the wheel wells.

In that case the only possible "adjustment" is a new axle as the rubber torsion pieces inside the axle tube are compressed due to age.

The good news, it's a lot easier (and cheaper) to fix with the coach off the frame.



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Old 08-23-2013, 03:59 PM   #12
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OMG: In the pic of it up in the air, the wheels are well up into the wheel wells, indicating a sagging axle. I imagine on the ground, unless they are limited by mechanical stops already, that they will go up even further.....
I also wondered about that, as it presents in the picture it's up in the well a bit but not as bad as some... does the rubber hold the wheel up under no load as well down under load? Or does compression act to allow more "sag" in either situation?

Only mechanical stop on a Scamp axle that I have heard of is the tire hitting the wheel well.

That tire is showing about as much (no load) as I was told to expect from a new 22.5 degree down angle axle on my 13 foot sitting on the ground. About 2 inch difference between no load and load for a new axle.

I guess the real question for the OP is how much higher does the tire move up in the wheel well when sitting on the ground?

Oh and one important thing, much easier to replace axle with coach off but whatever you do don't weld the axle or brackets from above, really hard to grind those welds off with coach and floor back on to replace axle if bracket or axle is ever damaged.
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Old 08-23-2013, 05:13 PM   #13
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Name: Nathan
Trailer: 1980 Scamp
Michigan
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I took a picture of the axle. I am going to replace it.
I have not had any luck in locating one yet.

Bah my phone put the image upside down.
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Old 08-23-2013, 05:59 PM   #14
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Scamp can provide you exactly what you need. OR, you can try Red Neck Trailer Supplies, BUT YOU have to supply ALL the measurements because the axle will be built to YOUR specs: Redneck Trailer Supplies - 20 National Branch Locations

You can also buy direct from Dexter (they'll give you a local vendor), but there again YOU have to supply the specs.

Good luck!
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Old 08-23-2013, 06:11 PM   #15
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Dexter or Al-Ko axles.

Couple of recent threads on the subject of axle replacement.
http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f72/scamp-axle-leading-vs-trailing-60297.html

http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f72/scamp-13-axle-60483.html

Axles are available that will fit, you may have to measure and order from factory, possibly do (or have done) a little custom work to cut down one end of the standard bracket or use a side mount bracket kit to mount brackets in slightly different location which changes the distance between the axle brackets just a bit.


Check out those two threads, it will connect you with pictures and what others have done. But if the price is not bad I would really think about dealing direct with scamp as Donna D suggests. Shipping can be expensive from that location, might want to put the money in the gas tank and just go pick axle up, get a chance to see the factory and pick up other parts.
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:45 PM   #16
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Name: Nathan
Trailer: 1980 Scamp
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When I called scamp earlier this week I asked about an axle for my 1980 he said '' we never made a 4 bolt with brakes so I cant help you.'' What I do know is it is welded in place and is a 4 bolt with 2 -1/4" square tube and is 49 -1/2 " outer support rail to outer support rail. It also appears to be a leading axle ? The little arm is facing the tounge of the trailer. The custom order form on redneck trailer has me a bit confounded.
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:26 PM   #17
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When I called scamp earlier this week I asked about an axle for my 1980 he said '' we never made a 4 bolt with brakes so I cant help you.'' What I do know is it is welded in place and is a 4 bolt with 2 -1/4" square tube and is 49 -1/2 " outer support rail to outer support rail. It also appears to be a leading axle ? The little arm is facing the tounge of the trailer. The custom order form on redneck trailer has me a bit confounded.
Dexter is known for having a helpful sales staff. They will also take and run the "non-standard" request past their engineers to make sure they can build it.

Here is a link to the Dexter guide to measuring an axle. http://l.b5z.net/i/u/6149609/f/Axle_Measurement.pdf

A leading arm is just a trailing arm turned around BUT the brakes have to be switched to opposite sides because brakes are "left" and "right" and they end up on the wrong side when axle is turned around. I think Dexter will build it with brakes to be a leading arm if informed. I think it is called a "Reverse Orientation" in that diagram of brackets. Notice how the long side of the bracket that comes down to the axle is on the outside of the frame, not the inside, looking from the wheel of your camper you see a solid plate, not the axle sticking through a plate on the other side of the frame.

Look at the picture of the torsion axle, note how the bracket is longer toward the arm, yours is the opposite so... measure your bracket, length, height, width, AND how much of that length is on the front and rear side of the axle.

Scamp has that side cut short so it can weld to the metal frame where the floor drops. So measure your axle bracket.

Diagram your bracket, and axle measurements call either Dexter or Al-Ko and arrange to fax your diagram down for a quote. It will be a dialog, you give them some information, they ask some questions, you clarify. Eventually you work out all the details. You don't have to know everything up front.

I just ordered an axle from Al-Ko but I'm paying a local shop that builds and repairs trailers to handle that dialog with manufacturer and do the install. They are experts and the install is only about $200 You might want to go that route. They measure makes sure your axle fits and is installed by experts.

Al-Ko would NOT make a leading arm with brakes at a low articulation (angle) I ordered 22.5 degree down and that angle they will put brakes on. A leading arm 0 degree they would not, don't know about the 10 degree down angle that is between those two.

Worse case you will need to cut one end of the axle bracket short and square to match up with where your floor drops and the original is welded to that drop frame. You just don't want the end of the bracket you cut off to be the "long" side, you want that long side to remain so you can weld it to the main frame.

Scamp may not have made it with brakes but brakes can be added after the fact, they are part of the hub not the axle itself. They just assumed (maybe correctly maybe not) that it was not one of theirs originally.
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Old 08-24-2013, 11:55 AM   #18
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Yep, Getting the right axle from Scamp will be a little expensive, BUT..... getting the wrong axle elsewhere will become very expensive..... Go to the source... but call, don't bother sending an eMail... (lol)



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Old 08-27-2013, 04:53 PM   #19
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Name: RogerDat
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I stopped by the place that I ordered my axle through. There was two hold ups. Both might apply to your purchase.

1). This particular configuration no longer has a part number, so Al-Ko had to create a new part number.

2). 4 bolt brake hubs, they don't stock them, would have to purchase some and needed to find a price.

#1 is dealt with, part number now exists to describe this bracket and leading arm configuration.

#2 turns out the man doing the work can get the 4 bolt brake hubs cheaper than Al-Ko so axle will be built with brakes but no hubs, saving me money.

If you PM me (click on name in post and select private message) I can work out a way for you to contact the place and you can get a price and order one if you desire. You will probably save on shipping since instead of common carrier shipping (axle is too heavy for FedEx) they will pick it up on one of their runs down to the factory. You can pick it up from them.

Really only need two dimensions since bracket configuration and dimension is known. Measurement of hub face to hub face and frame to frame.

I should mention that bracket puts axle 1" closer to frame but the 22.5 down angle adds 3.25 inches from what I have now even with the 1" off the bracket, and tire will still have clearance to wheel well under shock load travel listed for this axle.

Essentially bracket is not sticking down so far, should be less torque on the welds. Bracket should be stronger.

It's somewhat doubtful that they will install axle, they will do repairs but are not keen on doing RV work. But they would be a source for the axle. They measure = it will fit.
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