Sold my huge rig.. FG tough enough for Off Road 4x4 and stored outside?

[rebar]

Hello everyone, new here..

Iv sold everything..
I sold my 24' toyhauler mainly because it's to big for little ole me, and I need to get far away from the noisy crowded camp grounds.
I also just sold my cummins 5 speed E350 van, mainly because it didn't fit under my 7x16 garage door. It's also not the 4x4 I should have bought to drive up fire roads in colorado. I love remote colorado by the way. But dont care for the crowded tourist areas..

So now I'm sitting here with a pile of cash but not sure on what camper to look for. I buy used things, not new.

I bought the featherlite (traveled to Texas) because it was made from aluminum and rot resistant and believe me, it leaked everywhere! I'm considering a FG Burro I found for sale close to me thinking it's also rot resistant.
But is Fiberglass construction a good choice for wash board dirt roads which could shake the filling out of your teeth? And is fiberglass construction a good choice when you don't have a garage to store it in?

Thanks!

[TomandCallie]

Mike, you might be looking for a truck camper. Mount on the bed of a 4wd truck and you're good to go!

[vintageracer]

Originally Posted by rebar

Hello everyone, new here..

But is Fiberglass construction a good choice for wash board dirt roads which could shake the filling out of your teeth? And is fiberglass construction a good choice when you don't have a garage to store it in?

Thanks!

Yes fiberglass can be a good construction material for the shell. The problem with many fiberglass shell trailers is the flimsy frame they have underneath the shell AND the elevator bolts they use to mount the shell to the frame.

As fiberglass trailers age the flimsy frames installed under the shell can rust along with the elevator bolts that connect the shell to the frame. NONE of the fiberglass trailers were designed for off-road use. Having said that there are folks who have modified their trailers for off-road use with success. At a minimum you would need to raise the trailer for more clearance (Axle change). New wheels and tires. Stiffen the frame with additional cross-members, replace the elevator bolts and then deal with any other issues associated with a fiberglass trailer IF you purchase the trailer used.

Do a search on the site for a modified for off-road use 19 foot 5th wheel Scamp trailer. there are pictures here on the site somewhere.

Yes you can make a fiberglass trailer work well for off-road use however YOU are going to have to make the necessary modifications yourself to accomplish your goal of owning an off-road capable fiberglass trailer as none of the fiberglass trailer manufacturer's have addressed this market.

Try this website for lot's a great ideas and conversions as Expedition Portal may be more suited to what your ultimate goal may be:

https://expeditionportal.com/

http://forum.expeditionportal.com/fo...dition-Campers

[Civilguy]

Mike,

It sounds like you should talk to this guy:

http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...tml#post659291

[Raspy]

One of the reasons I bought my Oliver was that it was clearly much better for off-road than my previous Toy Hauler.

No pipes underneath, very strong frame and double wall construction of the body with moulded in cabinets instead of riveted on cabinets, etc. No wooden floor just screwed to the frame.

Tandem axle trailers are also better in rough conditions because they will drag on the ground less and the equalizer suspension steps over bumps instead of bouncing over them. You can air-down to soften the ride over the rocky surface.

But long mies of heavy vibration that would "knock the fillings out of your teeth" is never a good thing. Slow down and enjoy the surroundings. If you want to drive fast, set your truck up as a Baja racer and leave the trailer at home.

[Tom 72]

You won't see many 40-50 year old stick built trailers still road worthy. There's a surprising percentage of fiberglass units still in service.
I live in Colorado and have ATV'd a lot. I absolutely would consider fiberglass superior but not indestructable.
Simply set up the RV as a base camp in the National Forest to boondock, and go from there.

[rebar]

Originally Posted by TomandCallie

Mike, you might be looking for a truck camper. Mount on the bed of a 4wd truck and you're good to go!

Yes thank you, I'm looking at full size trucks but after you install a big top heavy camper, its very tall and not the most nimble 4x4 out there. Removing and leaving the camper at the camp site on jacks is a possibility.. But the spot would have to be pretty flat and Colorado doesn't have many of those in remote areas. On the other hand.. Your camper is riding on better suspension, which wouldn't shake the camper as much as a light weight trailer with small tires would.

Originally Posted by vintageracer

Yes fiberglass can be a good construction material for the shell. The problem with many fiberglass shell trailers is the flimsy frame they have underneath the shell AND the elevator bolts they use to mount the shell to the frame.
As fiberglass trailers age the flimsy frames installed under the shell can rust along with the elevator bolts that connect the shell to the frame. NONE of the fiberglass trailers were designed for off-road use. Having said that there are folks who have modified their trailers for off-road use with success. At a minimum you would need to raise the trailer for more clearance (Axle change). New wheels and tires. Stiffen the frame with additional cross-members, replace the elevator bolts and then deal with any other issues associated with a fiberglass trailer IF you purchase the trailer used.

Do a search on the site for a modified for off-road use 19 foot 5th wheel Scamp trailer. there are pictures here on the site somewhere.

Yes you can make a fiberglass trailer work well for off-road use however YOU are going to have to make the necessary modifications yourself to accomplish your goal of owning an off-road capable fiberglass trailer as none of the fiberglass trailer manufacturer's have address this market.

Try this website for lot's a great ideas and conversions as this site may be more suited to what you ultimate goal may be:

https://expeditionportal.com/

Expedition Campers - Expedition Portal

Thanks for the tip on flimsy frames and rusty elevator bolts holding the camper on.. I borrowed and towed a newer scamp to yellow stone 25 years ago and we did drive some rough dirt roads with it. When we got back I noticed stress cracks in the outside jel coat. Is this common and does it raise any concerns about the structural integrity of the camper? And nobody really addressed my left outside in the elements question.. How much does UV affect the integrity of the fiberglass shell? And can freezing temperatures and water play havoc on fiberglass shells more than aluminum?

Originally Posted by Civilguy

Mike,
It sounds like you should talk to this guy:
http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...tml#post659291

Thanks for the lead Civilguy.

Originally Posted by Raspy

One of the reasons I bought my Oliver was that it was clearly much better for off-road than my previous Toy Hauler.
No pipes underneath, very strong frame and double wall construction of the body with moulded in cabinets instead of riveted on cabinets, etc. No wooden floor just screwed to the frame.
Tandem axle trailers are also better in rough conditions because they will drag on the ground less and the equalizer suspension steps over bumps instead of bouncing over them. You can air-down to soften the ride over the rocky surface.
But long miles of heavy vibration that would "knock the fillings out of your teeth" is never a good thing. Slow down and enjoy the surroundings. If you want to drive fast, set your truck up as a Baja racer and leave the trailer at home.

Thanks Raspy. The Oliver's look very nice, but where/how do you truck your toys now?

And I have to respectfully disagree with your statement about tandem axles off road.. Iv read torsion Tandem axles should never be used off road because even driving off a curb can overload one or both of the axles. Parking, or pulling it unlevel can damage them placing more weight on one of the axles than it was designed to carry. I don't want anything large enough that requires two axles anyway.

The "knock the fillings out of your teeth" comment was something my girl friend and I laugh about. We were coming down a colorado dirt road, which are completely different than dirt roads here in iowa, and came around a corner to see very shallow ripples across the entire road, almost like ripples in sand. They were only a inch deep but it was like we hit a sheet of ice as we shuddered across them sideways. I will admit I don't drive slow because we only have a 10 day time window away from work. But that experience I will never forget and it would have shaken any thing held together with screws or rivets apart.

Originally Posted by Tom 72

You won't see many 40-50 year old stick built trailers still road worthy. There's a surprising percentage of fiberglass units still in service.
I live in Colorado and have ATV'd a lot. I absolutely would consider fiberglass superior but not indestructible.
Simply set up the RV as a base camp in the National Forest to boondock, and go from there.

Thanks Tom. I love your state btw..
The last time I camped at a free camp ground in colorado, a real live mariachi band started playing in my neighbors site after dark.. Granted it was a friday, but really? lol In hindsight I should have gotten out of bed, made a drink and joined the party..

I just really need to be able to get away for some peace and quiet, and if I want conversation.. I can always pack it up and come back down the mountain.

My problem is that I want to bring my DRZ400s along. Without it, I could get by with a 4.0 cherokee. But that extra 300 lbs and the associated tools and equipment that's needed probably puts me into a V8 SUV or 1/2 ton truck.

[TomandCallie]

The Livin' Lite makes a good off-road pop up that might be worth looking at: https://www.livinlite.com/products/q...-tent-campers/

[Franswa]

the thing about stickies and aluminium frame walled trailers is they have a lot of seams....vibration is the killer here, especially since everybody is clamoring for lighter and lighter trailers.....molded fiberglass is structurally superior and can take a lot more vibration/jarring...there are no joints to come loose...let water in

not all FG trailers are built the same...I can only speak about one brand. I own a BF and I think it would suit the use you describe...up to a point. The advantage of such a rig as opposed to a truck camper is you can drop the trailer off and REALLY go exploring if that's what you're into. I drive a lot of rough logging roads and other than breaking a spring (and replacing both with heavier duty units) I have not had any problems with things breaking or coming loose.

I use mine over rough terrain to get somewhere...not for "sport" so the rougher it gets the slower I go. What destroys trailers is potholes and washboard and sometimes those can't be avoided...you're doing 50 k on a gravel road and all of a sudden they appear before you have time to slow down....all you can do is cringe...LOL

While a truck camper can just drive down any old goat path...a truck and trailer has to worry about the possibility that there might not be anywhere to get turned around ....I've had to unhook 2-3 times to get out of a jam...and plenty more times "fought like hell"/stuffed the trailer in the trees to get turned around. My TV has a VERY tight turning radius and my trailer is single axle (which helps as well)....still I did a lot of walking the first few years to go check out the road ahead....I now have a folding electric bicycle that works real well for that...

I left my trailer uncovered one winter...just to see...it cleaned up...but that's a lot of work....I cover it now (normal tarp down to the belly band)

Happy trails

[thrifty bill]

Originally Posted by rebar

Burro I found for sale close to me thinking it's also rot resistant.
But is Fiberglass construction a good choice for wash board dirt roads which could shake the filling out of your teeth? And is fiberglass construction a good choice when you don't have a garage to store it in?

Thanks!

I would not test a 30 to 40 year old FG trailer on dirt roads that could shake the fillings out of your teeth.

As pointed out earlier, the frames were not designed for such abuse, and after 30 years, definitely not.

In addition, the axles of many trailers that old are worn out, and many use torsion style in place of a suspension (the torsion portion tends to get worn out).

Serious off road, you are talking Sprinter four wheel drive conversion van, definitely not cheap, and won't fit under your garage door.


Old FG molded trailers are certainly more durable than their stick built cousins, but thats in normal use. IMO, I think the molded body is more durable, but not the entire package. If anything, the suspension and frames might be less rugged (when pushed hard). I'd consider taking my Escape up the Alcan, which is mostly paved except for the multiple short construction zones. But I wouldn't take it up the Dalton Highway. For that, I would rent a jeep in Fairbanks and drive up and back, staying overnight in Prudhoe Bay.


Example of broken Burro frame:
http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...air-32586.html

[Franswa]

your five year old Escape would handle it just fine I bet....LOTS of traffic on that road...that usually = smooth in my book....(and you can drive the whole thing on google maps to see for yourself)

[thrifty bill]

That road picture from 2011 looks very nice. I rode it in 2014 on my motorcycle. It had rained several days straight, so the road was bad, really bad. 6 inches to a foot of mud on top of the gravel. No control whatsoever. A 16 wheeler had slid off the road earlier that day. I ended up turning around. I am ready for a rematch!

[Raspy]

rebar,

The Olivers don't have torsion axles, they are equalized leaf spring axles with shocks that work well over uneven surfaces. The trailer weighs about 4,800 lbs all watered and geared up. Mine has two 3500 lb axles, but some have two 5200 lb axles. Anywhere you can drag the trailer it will go without axle damage. They also have four batteries that are mounted over the axles to get the weight off the tongue.

I tow with a full size Ram, so if I want to take the quad, it can ride in the truck bed. But normally, I have a camper shell on the truck and that's where all the gear goes. Then the trailer uncluttered.

It is really nice to be able to leave the trailer and camp behind, and go exploring with the truck. Something that was not possible with my earlier pop-up camper.

[buff30]

I am in the progress or putting Timbren axle less suspension with a built in 4" lift on my 1987 Scamp 19. Looking at running LT 225/75 R16 all terrain tires. I am reinforcing the frame a little. I plan to take it on forest roads. Hope it works out. This is a picture of the old axle. I will post a picture of the in a few weeks.

[rebar]

Originally Posted by thrifty bill

Serious off road, you are talking Sprinter four wheel drive conversion van, definitely not cheap, and won't fit under your garage door.

I better clarify.. No serious off road for me. I just want to be able to drive the forest roads in colorado with 4x4. My main problem last visit was my Van was only ONE wheel drive. If I had a 4x4, I may have kept my toyhauler and lived with the fact it needs to stay in the camp ground.. But I'm starting with a clean slate now.

Originally Posted by buff30

I am in the progress or putting Timbren axle less suspension with a built in 4" lift on my 1987 Scamp 19. Looking at running LT 225/75 R16 all terrain tires. I am reinforcing the frame a little. I plan to take it on forest roads. Hope it works out. This is a picture of the old axle. I will post a picture of the in a few weeks.

That is such a cool old school setup Gene! Love it! I want to see more please.

I have also been looking for a short fifth wheel.. But wonder about clearance between the truck bed and the trailer when negotiating off road terrain.

I did find a 13' burro close to me which has been sitting for years. Thinking about buying, removing the shell and beefing up or replacing the frame axle and wheels.

[Alf S.]

Originally Posted by rebar

I better clarify.. No serious off road for me. I just want to be able to drive the forest roads in colorado with 4x4. My main problem last visit was my Van was only ONE wheel drive. If I had a 4x4, I may have kept my toyhauler and lived with the fact it needs to stay in the camp ground.. But I'm starting with a clean slate now.



That is such a cool old school setup Gene! Love it! I want to see more please.

I have also been looking for a short fifth wheel.. But wonder about clearance between the truck bed and the trailer when negotiating off road terrain.

I did find a 13' burro close to me which has been sitting for years. Thinking about buying, removing the shell and beefing up or replacing the frame axle and wheels.

Hi: rebar... Here's a pic of our rig. 4X4 Nissan and Escape 5.0TA is a great combo!!! We don't off road but I'm sure we could.
Alf S. North shore of Lake Erie

[Jimp]

Good grief, just buy a good 4 wheeler pickup for your bike & a good tent .

[Bigfoot25]

We own a 2016 25' Bigfoot that we bought in June 2015. It has dual axels mounted with leaf springs and shocks. We take it just about anywhere our 4x4 Tundra will go. Last year on its shakedown cruise, we took it to Alaska, including a trip over the 40 mile long Top Of The World Highway, a nasty rutted, potholed and washboarded road in eastern Alaska. Our trailer did great. Now we're nearing the end of our journey to the east, including Newfoundland and Nova Scotia. Anyone who has been to Newfoundland will attest to the ruggedness of many roads there - potholes, frost heave, and settled bridge approaches.

The trailer came with 3500lb axles, both of which bent on the Alaskan journey. We replaced the entire suspension system in Whitehorse, Yukon Territory on our way back from Alaska. We were fortunate that a super welder and RV axle specialist is located in Whitehorse. He claims to replace 300-400 RV axles a year. He made his own jig and builds his own axles. We had him build and install 6000lb axles on our Bigfoot (3" Dia. axle tubes 1/4" wall thickness), new 5-leaf leaf springs (stock was 4 leaf), 6-bolt hubs (stock were 5-bolt) and 12" brakes (stock were 10"). I had to remount the shocks myself because he doesn't believe in shocks on an RV. We ain't had no axle problems since.

The fiberglass body is doing fine. No cracking. We do wax it with a high quality fiberglass wax every 6 months. We do not store the trailer inside. We are full time RVers livin' in our Bigfoot. No chalking of the fiberglass yet, and we're confident that we can prevent this as long was we wash and wax it regularly.

I'm going to examine the body connections to the frame after reading some of these posts. As for the frame, it is very strong in my opinion. A knowledgeable frame person once looked at it and said, "That's a strong frame." He was looking at the frame after he saw our four 360amp-hr deep cycle batteries, 100lbs each, mounted on the tongue.

Other than the axles, we have had no problems with our Bigfoot. We bought it and designed our solar power system to go boondocking anywhere we want.

[Raspy]

Bigfoot,

That's a great story! "doesn't believe in shocks", "bent both axles". Love it.

How much does your trailer weigh?

If I ever have any problems with my axles, I'll immediately upgrade them to the 5200 lb model with the 12" brakes. The bigger bearings would also be comforting. One good thing about the 3500 lb model is that if there is some kind of extreme overload of some kind, they will yield instead of just snapping off.

When you went to the five leaf spring packs, did the ride stiffen up, or did it bounce more? Did you think it was bottoming out with the original springs? Severe bottoming is a likely reason the axles bent, if that is what was going on.

What tires are you running? We've got load range E, 16" truck tires. I'm convinced these are the best for hot weather or rocky roads.

Sounds like you are really getting full value out of your trailer. Hope to make a similar trip in our Oliver in a couple of years.

[rebar]

Originally Posted by Bigfoot25

We own a 2016 25' Bigfoot We take it just about anywhere our 4x4 Tundra will go.
Other than the axles, we have had no problems with our Bigfoot. We bought it and designed our solar power system to go boondocking anywhere we want.

Wow you guys really beat the snot out of that trailer and I now have more respect for leaf springs in two axles configuration. The axle damage proves that very few trailers are designed for offroad. I don't think I would be very happy had I bought that trailer new and hope Bigfoot compensated you in some way.

Originally Posted by Raspy

Bigfoot,

That's a great story! "doesn't believe in shocks", "bent both axles". Love it.

Yeah crazy..

I'm surprised I haven't read anything about gel coat hair line cracks around here because the scamp I borrowed was full of them after I used it. I wonder if I bent the axle?

I'm leaning towards building a small camper or buying a used custom made one as store bought just doesn't seem to cut it. Or a older stick built for the appliances and completely rebuild with steel.

Iv got my sights set on a 1998 cummins 4x4 5 speed as well.