Towing Capacity Question

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz

why are the scamp 16's lighter than a similarly equipped casita 16? they are both the same approximate size, with similar features... I mean, I can certainly understand a basic (no bath) 16 being lighter htan a deluxe 17, or whatever.

The Trailer Weights in the Real World thread suggests that Casita 16's may be heavier, but there are so few in the database it's hard to be sure.

Two thoughts... (1) As you note, there is a lot more variability among Scamp 16's because Scamp has a much shorter list of standard features and a long list of options. Except for rare standard models, Casita 16's tend to be pretty similar and fully equipped. (2) Casita 16's also have a fully encapsulated fiberglass floor and a full fiberglass bath enclosure. More weight there.

Based on the real-world weight thread (and attempting to guess which Scamp 16's are full bath units) my rough guess is a Casita 16SD with A/C & awning comes off the production line a couple of hundred pounds heavier than a Scamp 16 standard layout 6 with similar options.

In the context of the OP's question, though, the weight difference between a similarly-equipped Scamp 16 and Casita 17 is significant, on the order of 500-600 pounds. And of course there is the high tongue weight of the Casita 17 due to the axle placement farther rearward. I think that's what Carl meant by the "see-saw" effect. Good for stability. Bad for smaller tow vehicles.

[Wayne Collins]

Engineers are a conservative bunch. They deal in Factors of Safety.
So, it they say your TV has a 3500 lb towing capacity, that is some percentage LESS than the MAXIMUM, and allows for all the variations in conditions you are likely to encounter.

[Phil E]

That's helpful. Thanks, Carl!

[Phil E]

Thanks!

[nancyrnfit]

Originally Posted by ColoradoSwany

Our 2005 16’ Scamp weighed about 2350 pounds loaded. The first season we owned it, we towed with a Mazda MPV with a 3,000 pound capacity. It did ok, not great. Replaced Mazda with a 5,000 pound rated Highlander and barely noticed the Scamp. I’ve noted many posts over the last few years that commented on the heavy tongue weight of Casitas. That can be an issue with some tugs. My opinion, worthless as it may be, is that your vehicle would do adequately or maybe just fine with a Scamp, but would likely be marginal with a Casita. There is a web site that is something like “real world fiberglass rv weights” that gives several examples of real weights of molded fiberglass trailers of different owners. There are links to it on this gorum if you do a search.

Agree...our 2004 16 foot Scamp, fully loaded, comes in around 2300 lbs.

We just checked tongue weight, came in at something over 300 lbs (don't quite remember).
We tow with a 2015 Honda Pilot, rated at 4500 tow weight. It is fine, for the most part. We can tell we are towing and we lose about 4 mpg doing so.
When we tow with my husband's Ford F250, it's like nothing is back there. We also towed with a "tow ready" 2011 Toyota Sienna, and it did fine, like the Pilot.
WE did just add a sway bar. The Pilot does not recommend a weight distribution hitch.

In my reading, in general, if you are going to tow something that is over half the weight of your TV, then a WD hitch is recommended.
Lots of good info on etrailer.com, as well.


Good luck!

[John in Santa Cruz]

Originally Posted by nancyrnfit

...In my reading, in general, if you are going to tow something that is over half the weight of your TV, then a WD hitch is recommended.

Indeed, even my 2002 F250 diesel, rated for 12500 lb hitch tow (or 13500 5th wheel), says to use a WDH for trailers above 5000 lbs. This truck has a 6800 lb curb weight, and a 8800 lb GVWR (and a 20,000 lb GCWR).

[Mike Magee]

A Casita 17 deluxe (front bath) is almost sure to be too heavy on the hitch. Other Casitas could be ok for a 3500/350 tow limit.

Scamp 16s are balanced such that they tend to be even lighter on the tongue... sometimes even a bit too light, and needing some extra gear loaded up front.

[Phil E]

Thanks, Mike. That's a good summary. I think so long as we have our Kia Sorrento v6 we're confined to opting for a Scamp 16'. All the comments in this thread have been helpful.

[thrifty bill]

"Loved" the advice my newb friends got from the local RV dealer. Dealer told them he was the "expert" on tow rating, so they should disregard Ford's ratings.

I showed him the sticker on his door from Ford, and asked what credentials the RV guy had that were better than Ford's engineers/designers.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by thrifty bill

"Loved" the advice my newb friends got from the local RV dealer. Dealer told them he was the "expert" on tow rating, so they should disregard Ford's ratings.

I showed him the sticker on his door from Ford, and asked what credentials the RV guy had that were better than Ford's engineers/designers.

Best advice is to study enough to at least know whom to trust and which advice is good. Educate yourself and take responsibility, and yes that means "expert advice" should be considered, even if it comes from the manufacturer.

[John in Santa Cruz]

RV salesmen remind me of a bit character in the old Leisure Suit Larry computer game series, the guy wore a loud plaid suit, and constantly waved his arms around while talking a mile a minute trying to sell random stuff to you (nearly always a bad idea to interact with in the game, as he was a time waster).

[Phil E]

I had almost ruled out the Casita entirely due to tow weight differences compared to the Scamp, but it occurred to me that I had compared the 16' Scamp with the 17' Casita. I'm not sure why I hadn't considered the possibility of a 16' Casita. That would be more like comparing apples to apples. Can anyone help me with some of the pluses and minuses of a Casita 16' with a Scamp 16'?

[Carl Pa]

The Casita interior head room is less then 6' or something close to that, if you are under that height, or don't mind bending your head some, then your good to go. Also keep in mind that most of the time you are sitting down anyway. That few inches in height, make the world of difference in the appearance of space. Good luck, Carl

[John in Santa Cruz]

whats the head room in a Scamp 16? as Carl says, the Casita 16 is about 5'11"... I'm 6' tall and have to slouch a little to stand up in it. The Casita 17 are taller (6'2" or so? not sure).

When we were first shopping, we mostly saw Scamp 13's that didn't have baths, and Casita 16 and 17's that did.

[Mike Magee]

I pulled out my 8 year old brochure... Scamp 16 is 6'3" interior height. Old, pre-fire models may be less, not sure.

Scamp's aisle is a bit wider (cabinets a bit more shallow). This plus the height difference make the Scamp feel perceptually more spacious inside.

Scamp has a wood bottom. Casita has molded fiberglass bottom with wood subfloor inside it. Since splashing water from rain and puddles does not dwell on the Scamp's wood for long, the absence of FG underneath is not a significant minus. Just different ways of doing it.

Scamp lines the walls with short-nap fabric ("rat fur"). Casita lines walls with higher-nap carpet. A different look, otherwise not much difference in function.


Most Scamp 16s (used) make up to a more narrow 48" bed, IIRC, but new ones can be ordered with a 54" wide space. Casita layouts give you more options on bed sizes.


I'd say, go with the one you like better (looks, price, floor plan, reputation, gut feel, etc.).

[addean]

It is hard to compare Casita vs Scamp weight on both web sites. You need to pick a floor plan or plans for both brands, add the options you want, then let both factory’s to tell you the weight. Example: Casita, std model AC is optional but on Deluxe model they are standard. Scamp, AC is a option on all floor plans. There other examples. What is the weight difference between floor plans. My wood interior added 400 pounds. A lot of us have weighed our trailer at public scales and know what the actual trailer weight is, either empty or loaded.