110V trips the GFI on my garage? - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 08-23-2013, 06:59 PM   #15
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My experience with Gfi's is that any high load or a motor is going to trip it, and it gets weaker with every trip. I was changing them several times a year in my garage, put regular outlets in, no trouble.
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:06 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by steve dunham View Post
Your description of tripping 3 different circuits led me to believe you were tripping 3 different circuit breakers . It is difficult to diagnose a problem when the description is ambiguous . Tripping 4 different GFCIs is not the same as tripping 1 GFCI and 3 circuit breakers . Different types of GFCIs have different trip levels . and the length of the wiring run from the GFCI breaker in your panel to your outside receptacle plus a long run of extension cord to your trailer can introduce a capacitive current that causes a false tripping of the GFCI

Sorry about the confusion, only the GFI's were tripped. (two in my garage and one on the exterior of the house and each one is on its own circuit)

When I plug the camper in to a receptacle inside the house that does not have a GFI on the circuit everything works fine.

I am sure there is nothing wrong with my house wiring, I had the house built 17 years ago and since then I have had several campers that used all these receptacles without a problem including much longer extension cords than I am using now.
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:15 PM   #17
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It is possible your camper is not grounded, similar to using a portable generator at a campground and you have a EMS system installed inside your camper, it will not allow the current to flow to the camper because the generator is not grounded.
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:19 PM   #18
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Jim, a GFCI (Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter) protects against faults which connect the hot line (and in some cases even the neutral line) to ground. As far as I know, having no ground at all wouldn't be a problem.
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:28 PM   #19
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Gfci

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jared J View Post
My experience with Gfi's is that any high load or a motor is going to trip it, and it gets weaker with every trip. I was changing them several times a year in my garage, put regular outlets in, no trouble.
GFCI"S are mandatory for "ALL" 120 VAC receptacles installed in garages (Exemptions for freezers and garage door openers were removed 6 years ago) . In my 40 years as an electrician I have replaced less than a dozen GFCI receptacles because of failure and almost all of the failures were the low end, home improvement store, Chinese GFI receptacles. Suggesting that the solution to the problem is removing the GFI is foolish and dangerous . Laying under a vehicle on a damp concrete garage floor with a 120 VAC tool in your hand and no GFCI protection is a recipe for disaster . If proposed code changes go through homes will soon have total GFI and arc fault protection . If you read the IAEI articles on home electrocutions your opinion may change
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:39 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
It is possible your camper is not grounded, similar to using a portable generator at a campground and you have a EMS system installed inside your camper, it will not allow the current to flow to the camper because the generator is not grounded.
You can provide GFI protection to two wire ungrounded circuits such as 2 wire romex , BX ,Knob & tube. You need to identify the outlets which are GFI protected with stickers that state "GFI protected NO equipment ground provided" GFI or ARC fault protection does not eliminate any of the grounding requirements of Art 250 of the NEC . You can not legally replace existing two wire receptacles with 3 wire grounding receptacles but you can replace them with GFI receptacles
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Old 08-23-2013, 09:14 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by steve dunham View Post

GFCI"S are mandatory for "ALL" 120 VAC receptacles installed in garages (Exemptions for freezers and garage door openers were removed 6 years ago) . In my 40 years as an electrician I have replaced less than a dozen GFCI receptacles because of failure and almost all of the failures were the low end, home improvement store, Chinese GFI receptacles. Suggesting that the solution to the problem is removing the GFI is foolish and dangerous . Laying under a vehicle on a damp concrete garage floor with a 120 VAC tool in your hand and no GFCI protection is a recipe for disaster . If proposed code changes go through homes will soon have total GFI and arc fault protection . If you read the IAEI articles on home electrocutions your opinion may change
I didn't suggest he do anything, just stated what worked for me. I've replaced more than a dozen of them on my own. They don't like the table saw, steel saw, 1 1/2hp drill press, etc. They will usually start them, but if you load them down, there goes the outlet.

I agree it would be dumb to lay on a damp floor with a power tool, but I would never think of doing it, gfi or not.

I used leviton and century.
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:30 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
Jim, a GFCI (Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter) protects against faults which connect the hot line (and in some cases even the neutral line) to ground. As far as I know, having no ground at all wouldn't be a problem.

OOPS you probably need to dig a bit deeper Brian.
GFI works by comparing the current in the hot leg vs the current in neutral leg. Any differences and the it trips. I'm not sure what the current difference is to cause the device to trip, but it's quite small.
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:48 PM   #23
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GFCI Ratings

A Leviton 15 amp 125 volt commercial grade , heavy duty, GFCI receptacle
(Model # 7599) is only rated for "1/2 HP" Your drill is 1 1/2 HP or 3 times the rating of the GFCI . Current rating and Horsepower rating are not the same thing . The trade rule is to take the full load current ( FLA) of the motor and double it to arrive at the size of the controlling device , IE a 1/2 HP 125 volt motor drawing 9 amps ( FLA). ( Tables Art 430 NEC) would require a 20 amp rated switch. The problem stems from a misapplication of the product (GFCI) not with the product. Shop equipment such as yours must often be wired to commercial standards not to residential standards. Most homeowners do not own large commercial power tools --stationery or portable
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:59 PM   #24
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OOPS you probably need to dig a bit deeper Brian.
GFI works by comparing the current in the hot leg vs the current in neutral leg. Any differences and the it trips. I'm not sure what the current difference is to cause the device to trip, but it's quite small.
The difference can be 3 ma or 5 ma or 10 ma or 20 ma . It depends on whether you are protecting someone in a coronary care unit of a hospital or protecting a heat tape in a metal gutter . There are different classes of protection Most GFCI receptacles are 5ma
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Old 08-23-2013, 11:06 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by steve dunham View Post
The difference can be 3 ma or 5 ma or 10 ma or 20 ma . It depends on whether you are protecting someone in a coronary care unit of a hospital or protecting a heat tape in a metal gutter . There are different classes of protection Most GFCI receptacles are 5ma
Thanks Steve. I was pretty sure it was in that range.
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Old 08-23-2013, 11:19 PM   #26
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Just spit balling but I have a 77 Scamp and the original fluorescent light has a two prong ungrounded plug on it. Could having that on the circuit cause a problem for the GFI plug? Only thing I could plug into it was the phone charger.

It is nice to now have an explanation from an expert of why my 12" miter saw always trips my GFI by the deck. In the past I always had to go with saw was "to powerful" which did impress the younger grand kids.
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Old 08-23-2013, 11:33 PM   #27
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Cool something to try

Plug your rig in the non GFI plug and then plug one of these into the outlets in the Scamp:

Search Results for*receptacle tester*at The Home Depot

If this shows a fault it tells you what kind of fault and then you know where to start looking, if there is a problem with your rig.

You may want to check your house wiring with the receptacle checker before checking your rig. I find a good rule of thumb when dealing with someone else's work, is "trust, but check."

I bought one of these after reading that someone fried their rigs electrics by plugging into a miswired plug. Now, I ALWAYS check the plug before plugging my rig into it, even if I have returned to a park after a couple days. One never knows what happened in the meantime.
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Old 08-24-2013, 01:01 AM   #28
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Thanks for the suggestions Roger.
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