How long will battery last... - Page 3 - Fiberglass RV


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 07-26-2015, 12:17 PM   #29
Senior Member
 
Name: Gordon
Trailer: 2015 Scamp (16 Std Layout 4) with '15 Toyota Sienna LE Tug
North Carolina
Posts: 1,886
I have a Scamp on order WITHOUT the furnace because I was planning on using a small electric heater on shore power and a Wave heater when not on shore power...
HOWEVER you have got me rethinking the benefits of the stock furnace with solar power added to keep the battery going..
I'm on the fence now if anyone wants to help me decide.. I only have a few weeks left to finalize the order.
__________________

__________________
gordon2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-26-2015, 12:24 PM   #30
Senior Member
 
Name: Francois
Trailer: Bigfoot
British Columbia
Posts: 973
Registry
yep, I resemble that (Carol)...

same sort of use/experience with heat as Carol.....portables/no power units do have to be stored somewhere (drawback) I have an AC heater (thermostat with several different "modes" of use) that I have to deal with already in that respect...wouldn't want another one

also agree with the "whopping 45W" panel ...for the use described it'll keep up nicely most of the time.....if somebody, not knowing nothing about it wanted to get into solar and started researching it (you could spend a lifetime doing that!!! great hobby BTW) they'd be better off to just go get a 40W with controller and go camping I figure...cheap...wait for sales... happens all the time
__________________

__________________
Franswa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-26-2015, 03:04 PM   #31
Senior Member
 
Carol H's Avatar
 
Name: Carol
Trailer: 22' Airstream Formerly 16' Scamp
British Columbia
Posts: 11,731
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by gordon2 View Post
I have a Scamp on order WITHOUT the furnace because I was planning on using a small electric heater on shore power and a Wave heater when not on shore power...
HOWEVER you have got me rethinking the benefits of the stock furnace with solar power added to keep the battery going..
I'm on the fence now if anyone wants to help me decide.. I only have a few weeks left to finalize the order.
Do you ever plan to camp with young children or pets that could possible reach up - either by jumping on the bed and or simple reach up to the counter it sits on? If so forget the portable heater. I have camped with children and dogs and know all to well how crowded on a rainy day the trailer can get. Sometimes it feels real crowded with just two adults in it! Have had dogs sleep safely near the scamp stock heater many times. The cover on the stock furnace does not get hot enough to burn anyone who brushes up against it. On the other hand the Wave can burn and you need to be careful not to run it anywhere near curtains, sheets or fabric furniture or where it may get knocked over.

The Olympian Wave 3 Catalytic heater is also for use "in vented areas" only. The built in heater is vented to the outside already so no worries there.

Other thing to remember is the Wave heater burns on propane so you will need to pack with you a number of portable propane cylinders which are not the cheapest things to use and you need to find a safe place to store them while traveling so they are not rolling/banging around.

Nothing wrong with owning a small electric heater for those times you are plugged in. I use one and know many others that do as well, your paying for power so why not use it ;-) If you get the right electric heater there should be no concerns over being burned should it be accidentally knocked over.
Carol H is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-26-2015, 04:33 PM   #32
Senior Member
 
Name: Gordon
Trailer: 2015 Scamp (16 Std Layout 4) with '15 Toyota Sienna LE Tug
North Carolina
Posts: 1,886
Carol, you bring up a number of good points and almost have me convinced. However you also leave out a few good points and have one thing wrong.

Danger of knocking over the Wave heater.. good point. I found it works well on the counter but you are right, that is something to consider. It can be mounted permanently but then you have to make sure there are sufficient clearances.

Venting.. Well I vent anyway because of condensation, except maybe not much at all with electric heater. (Yes, it is first choice when your paying for shore power).

Burning propane.. it has a hose connection and does not use the little wasteful bottles (like other portable heaters do). I have a quick connect on mine that was the same as the stove in my pop-up and would run a propane line with quick connect in the Scamp.. so it all runs off the main tank(s).

New points: I am pretty sure that the Wave is MUCH more efficient than the furnace. I need to firm up the numbers but I think you get a lot more heat out of the Wave for the same amount of gas.

It is Catalytic heat, and some people don't like that.

The Wave requires NO electric so its still a good back up. If you kill your battery you can still stay warm. If the furnace is your only heat source then once you lose electric power, you have no heat.

I would never run the Wave unattended. I might run the furnace unattended or while sleeping but only if I were desperate (that's just personal preference and no justification is offered).

There is no free lunch.. each has benefits and limitations.. Since I have the Wave already I guess it will be a backup if I get the furnace.

Edit: Another point..
Catalytic heaters (Wave, etc) will become inefficient if the catalytic surface is contaminated. I keep mine covered when not in use. Of course force air furnaces need maintenance also.. so that is a tie.
__________________
gordon2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-26-2015, 08:35 PM   #33
Senior Member
 
rdickens's Avatar
 
Name: Ray
Trailer: 2017 Scamp 16 Deluxe
Missouri
Posts: 504
NPower Crystalline solar panels are available from Northern Tool. (Crystalline panels supposedly generate more power from less area than the amorphous solar panels)

I recently used a 12 watt crystalline panel and small solar controller to maintain a Group 27 battery while dry camping for 8 days.
I was only using Fantastic Fan (mostly at night), LED lighting at night, and electric water pump.
I mounted the panel, with bungee cords, on the propped up gravel shield of our Scamp13.
(Total cost for panel and controller was under $60.)

While the 12 watt panel was "adequate" for my needs, I would probably upgrade to the 35 watt panel for powering additional loads (i.e. a furnace, etc.) That cost would be about about $150.

Northern Tool also has larger wattage crystalline panels and the required larger solar controllers, but the prices do go up accordingly.

Good luck! And, of course, YMMV. 😉

Ray


Sent from my iPad using Fiberglass RV
__________________
rdickens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2015, 06:14 AM   #34
Senior Member
 
rdickens's Avatar
 
Name: Ray
Trailer: 2017 Scamp 16 Deluxe
Missouri
Posts: 504
Since Dawn expressed the interest in solar power, this is the setup that I used with the crystalline solar panel and controller from Northern Tool.

http://m.northerntool.com/products/s...?hotline=false

http://m.northerntool.com/products/s...?hotline=false

For the furnace, you might want this panel (or even something larger?):


http://m.northerntool.com/products/s...?hotline=false

Good luck!

Ray

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Fiberglass RV mobile app
Attached Thumbnails
1437995369599.jpg   1437995412426.jpg  

__________________
rdickens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2015, 09:28 AM   #35
Member
 
Name: Dawn
Trailer: Scamp
New York
Posts: 69
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdickens View Post
Since Dawn expressed the interest in solar power, this is the setup that I used with the crystalline solar panel and controller from Northern Tool.

Portable Generators, Pressure Washers, Power Tools, Welders | Northern Tool + Equipment

Portable Generators, Pressure Washers, Power Tools, Welders | Northern Tool + Equipment

For the furnace, you might want this panel (or even something larger?):


Portable Generators, Pressure Washers, Power Tools, Welders | Northern Tool + Equipment

Good luck!

Ray

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Fiberglass RV mobile app
Ray,
Thank you SO much for this info!! I didn't even know where to start. So this is great. Is it as simple as it seems? Is there just a direct connect to the battery?? Also, does time of year affect how much energy you create? As far as I've understood, energy can still be generated with cloud cover?
__________________
NedMac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2015, 09:47 AM   #36
Senior Member
 
Bob Miller's Avatar
 
Name: Bob
Trailer: 1973 Hunter Compact II
California
Posts: 7,912
Your links don't take us to a specific item.


But, that said, your pic is of a 12 watt panel that is, basically, a 1 amp trickle charger for your battery. Most that use solar panels for maintaining batteries opt for at least 60 to 100 watts of output.
__________________
Bob Miller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2015, 10:12 AM   #37
Senior Member
 
Name: Gordon
Trailer: 2015 Scamp (16 Std Layout 4) with '15 Toyota Sienna LE Tug
North Carolina
Posts: 1,886
Dawn, I recommend this link* for really doing your homework if you want to get a solar system you are happy with while not spending more money than you need to. I say that because every rig is different, everyone's power usage is different, and if you don't get the right system you might not be happy with it. It's a lot to learn and I am just at Solar-101 in my education. I hope folks will give you some examples of what works for them and its similar to your situation to also help guide your decisions.

* This site is a little heavy on the self-advertising but still a well written primer for the solar layman.
__________________
gordon2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2015, 10:57 AM   #38
Senior Member
 
Name: Bob
Trailer: Escape 5.0 TA
W. Mass
Posts: 436
Just an example... we used to get 1-1.5 nights out of a single battery, so we added a 2nd. We could then make it through a weekend, a long weekend if it wasn't below freezing. Would suggest you do the same.

Have a 160 watt roof mount solar panel, it can recharge a single battery from 50% to full during the summer sun, I've been told to figure about half that in the winter sun. 50% works out to about 50 amps, about what one uses in cold weather. To me buying a small (sub 100 watt) solar panel is a waste if you want to camp in the cold and run the heater all night .

You can get a bigger panel, for $200+ that will help, but even that is questionable. With 2 batteries you might go 3 or 4 nights as such. Figuring you could go 2 or 3 without solar, and the panel would give back about a nights worth for every 2 you keep it in the sun. This is a good one, but expensive. There are cheaper ones out there. And yes, it is simple to use, just keep it pointed at the sun and connected to the battery leads. Note, they are fairly heavy the bigger you go. My brother picked up a 160 watt suitcase, it's about 40 lbs. and was about $300.

http://www.amazon.com/Go-Power-GP-PS.../dp/B009MIPH4K

You could also go the small generator route, that's what we did with the old trailer that had 2 group 24 12v batteries.

Or camp somewhere with electric and bring a cube heater.
__________________
Bob & Deb
padlin00 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2015, 10:58 AM   #39
Senior Member
 
Name: Francois
Trailer: Bigfoot
British Columbia
Posts: 973
Registry
yep, 12 watts is small alright

will keep the battery up while in storage with everything off but that's about it....

I use 40W panels that come with 7A controllers...(Coleman brand bought at Canadian Tire on sale....125 bucks each on sale).....in my research I found that the 40W panel in full sun will produce no more than 3A.....the 7A controller supplied could accomodate two 40W panels.....( max 6A in perfect conditions)

the AC charger I use charges the batteries at 6A (maximum setting) and it takes it a LONG time to top up the batteries completely after a trip....like 12-18 hours...that was after using only one, deployable panel some of the time last summer

this tells me that a 40W deployable will extend your battery life while camping (if you're not a power hog) but will probably not replace all the power you use....unless you are parked in one spot for several days with the panel out all day

that's why I got a second one installed permanently on the roof....I usually move every day...my TV does not send power to the coach....I don't seem to move far every day so this would not be a big factor for me I figure...the 40W on the roof I got for those times during the day, on the road where you end up parked somewhere for long periods (mall or some other attraction)

so far I've only used both panels together parked at home (about 6A just like my AC charger) and that yielded another important consideration: the difference between a flat panel and one that is angled perfectly to the sun is astounding....in my little experiment it was huge...like the perfectly angled one produced almost twice as much voltage (measured before controller) as the flat one....so that 6A figure only happened for some time before and after noon...if at all

YMMV....this is all just what I have observed
Attached Thumbnails
sp9b.jpg   spnew2.jpg  

sig8.jpg  
__________________
Franswa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2015, 11:17 AM   #40
Senior Member
 
Byron Kinnaman's Avatar
 
Name: Byron
Trailer: 2006 Scamp 13' towed with a 2005 Dodge Dakota 4.7l Magnum W/full tow package (over kill)
Oregon
Posts: 6,309
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by padlin00 View Post
Just an example... we used to get 1-1.5 nights out of a single battery, so we added a 2nd. We could then make it through a weekend, a long weekend if it wasn't below freezing. Would suggest you do the same.

Have a 160 watt roof mount solar panel, it can recharge a single battery from 50% to full during the summer sun, I've been told to figure about half that in the winter sun. 50% works out to about 50 amps, about what one uses in cold weather. To me buying a small (sub 100 watt) solar panel is a waste if you want to camp in the cold and run the heater all night .

You can get a bigger panel, for $200+ that will help, but even that is questionable. With 2 batteries you might go 3 or 4 nights as such. Figuring you could go 2 or 3 without solar, and the panel would give back about a nights worth for every 2 you keep it in the sun. This is a good one, but expensive. There are cheaper ones out there. And yes, it is simple to use, just keep it pointed at the sun and connected to the battery leads. Note, they are fairly heavy the bigger you go. My brother picked up a 160 watt suitcase, it's about 40 lbs. and was about $300.

http://www.amazon.com/Go-Power-GP-PS.../dp/B009MIPH4K

You could also go the small generator route, that's what we did with the old trailer that had 2 group 24 12v batteries.

Or camp somewhere with electric and bring a cube heater.

1 to 1.5 nights before running your battery down. I wonder what all you're running. A big TV lots of hours. incandescent lamps all on, long showers so the water pump runs a lot, electric toaster?

This is one end of the spectrum I'm at the other end, with out the need of heat I can go a couple of months without recharging my battery. How that be? First we live most of the time outside. I changed all lights to low power lights mostly LEDs. I don't have Television, water pump, or any other power needs except when it's cold enough to run the furnace. Typically when the weather gets down near freezing at night I have to recharge my battery about every 4 or 5 days.

It's your choice to buy lots of batteries and solar panels or one battery one small (50 - 100 Watt) solar panel, use a lot of battery or very little battery or somewhere in between.

The more battery and solar panel you have the bigger the initial cost, and the more you have to fuss with things. Some people like to fuss with things a lot some like to simply watch the water roll over the rocks or the grass grow.
__________________
Byron & Anne enjoying the everyday Saturday thing.
Byron Kinnaman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2015, 11:43 AM   #41
Senior Member
 
Name: Bob
Trailer: Escape 5.0 TA
W. Mass
Posts: 436
Byron, have yet to have a tv in a trailer. In the example we had an 18' Hybrid, with tenting on 2 sides.

May well take more heat then your 13' on a cold night, or the OP's for that matter.
No LED lighting back then and when it's freezing out we spend more time indoors.

I've encountered many folks that run down their battery before the weekend is over. Getting 4 or 5 nights out of a single battery as you do is exceptional, that's about what we could do in warmer weather.

Here's what I had measured once upon a time.
Item Ahr
LP + Radio 0.18
Refrigerator 0.32
Bath Fan low 1.49
Night Lights 0.03
Range Light 0.62
Ceiling Light (single Bulb) 1.37
Converter 0.20
Water Pump 4.52
Furnace 2.82
__________________
Bob & Deb
padlin00 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-27-2015, 11:43 AM   #42
Senior Member
 
Name: Gordon
Trailer: 2015 Scamp (16 Std Layout 4) with '15 Toyota Sienna LE Tug
North Carolina
Posts: 1,886
How to save 30% on Solar power for your RV:

See:
Solar Investment Tax Credit | Miscellaneous Pages (Tax Credit, Privacy Policy, etc.)

AND

DSIRE

Of course claiming an FBGT as a residence might be a gray area so YMMV! Talk to your tax advisor and do not assume anything from this posting. See page four of this IRS publication.

This is something I hope to take advantage of next year!

--------
PS... we have already seen, in the above posts, a wide range of power consumption, and as it follows, solar charging requirements. This underscores the need to getting the system properly sized to your needs, usage patterns, even where and how often you set up camp.
__________________

__________________
gordon2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
battery, scamp


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
12VDC/120 VAC Flat Screen on WOOT.COM - Won't Last Long..... Bob Miller Problem Solving | Owners Helping Owners 0 09-24-2012 09:44 AM
how long does this propane tank last? john warren General Chat 13 08-30-2012 01:58 PM
How long does a 5 gallon propane tank last? Perry J Problem Solving | Owners Helping Owners 6 09-20-2010 04:22 PM
'09s last hou-rah (last one at The Fort) Doug Mager Ft. Langley B.C. Rallies 5 10-18-2009 11:21 AM
How long can it last? Lainey General Chat 5 11-03-2008 03:28 AM

» Upcoming Events
No events scheduled in
the next 465 days.
» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:16 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.