Installing a flat screen TV - how to get wiring to it? - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 04-01-2010, 08:59 PM   #15
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Name: Darnelle
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Yep, I use those outlet splitters, too, sometimes. Don't know what they are rated for, but should be okay with a little TV.

I would caution against splicing any cord. Housing codes don't allow it because of the risk of fire. Don't know what the codes are on a TT, but if such a setup did cause a fire your insurance might say "Too bad, but we're not covering that." Finances aside, however small the risk might be, personally I wouldn't take the gamble with my family. Better to run the player cord out through a hole drilled in the bottom of the cabinet, then into the exposed (not under fabric or pinched between cabinet and wall) extension cord. Also, use the shortest extension cord for your needs. A coiled cord can generate more heat than a fully extended cord.


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Old 04-02-2010, 01:06 AM   #16
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The cords are stretched out and not coiled and the connection is in a box. You know those little blue ones they sell in the electric department of the hardware store. Not pinched between the cabinet and wall. I squashed the carpet and bubble insulation so the cord ran between the cabinet and wall with no pressure applied, nice and lose. But, thanks for the advice.

No splicing.....hum......seems to me that all my interior lights are spliced with wire nuts, the porch light and I don't recall what else.
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Old 04-02-2010, 11:16 AM   #17
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No splicing.....hum......seems to me that all my interior lights are spliced with wire nuts, the porch light and I don't recall what else.
Hi Joy,

Splicing is when the metal wires in an electric line or cord are connected directly to each other without the use of boxes or wire nuts or other approved connections. For example, when my friend accidentally cut through the cord on my new circular saw (!) I spliced the two ends back together. This is an okay way to repair a tool, just not an okay way to wire a home or TT.

Wire nuts are the proper way to attach a line to a light or outlet, or even to another line, if the work is contained in an electrical box. I'm now thinking your player's cord has been put into an electrical box, along with the power cord from the closest outlet, and all the wires are connected there with wire nuts? That would be similar to how the fluorescent light in my garage is wired (hard wired), except player cords are not designed to be used that way. Still, your setup should be perfectly safe, just don't know what your insurance might say about it. Perhaps someone in FGRV has some more input here?

In all of this I'm referring to 110v(120v) power. I'm guessing all or almost all your lights are 12 volt. Those lights have wires poking out the back and they are connected to power with wire nuts or crimp connectors. I've never seen a 12 volt light that had a box to house the connections. In my Scamp those connections are all exposed, i.e. none are hidden under ensolite or fur, but are visible along the walls in cabinets and storage compartments. I want to add a 12v LED ceiling light above my dinette, but have not researched the recommended way to hide the connections. If it is safe, I will use insulated crimp connectors and hide them in the ceiling material. 12v is much safer and easier to work with than 110v, but there is still the potential for fires if done wrong. However, unlike a car, there is little metal in a 'glass so arcing is less of a possibility.

So in summary, have a great camping season! Your work sounds safe and so do your lights.
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Old 04-03-2010, 10:27 AM   #18
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Darnell,

I put the connections, whether I call them splicing or not, in the little blue box because the are in the overhead cabinet which I put things in and get things out of. I don't want anything causing a problem with the connection so the connection is covered up.

The wiring in my Scamp which goes along the outer wall is behind the insulation and carpeting. Therefore covered up and stuff in the cabinets won't cause a problem. The wiring connections in the overhead cabinets for the lights are behind an extra removable piece of fiberglass. This all came direct from the factory.

Now I added a light on the closet wall and tapped into the wiring that goes to the porch light. Since the connections are in the closet where clothes, and other stuff is stored, again I put a blue electrical box over the connection.

I'm sorry but I don't see the problem with covering an electrical connection whether it be AC or DC. Wouldn't it be worse to accidentally have a connection come loose from the things you're taking in and out of a cabinet then causing a problem ie, fire.

Why would putting connections in an electrical box be a problem for insurance. All the light switches, plugs etc in my home are in electrical boxes........
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Old 04-03-2010, 01:45 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by Collins English Dictionary
splice [splaɪs]
vb (tr)
1. to join (two ropes) by intertwining the strands
2. to join up the trimmed ends of (two pieces of wire, film, magnetic tape, etc.) with solder or an adhesive material
Joy,
Is your connection which is inside an electrical box easily accessible for maintenance and/or repair?
I think that would make it acceptable. A splice run beneath the "rat fur" and not accessible would not be acceptable.
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Old 04-04-2010, 01:00 AM   #20
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Exactly, splicing is the main concern. Connections are not the same thing. Using a wire-nut is a connection, whether in a box or not -- 110v requires a box, 12v does not.

Joy: Also, wire is designed based on its use. Lines of 110v wire and lines of 12v wire can be under ensolite or wall fabric. Extension cords and cords running out of appliances, radios, etc. were not designed to be used this way. All electric wires generate heat to one degree or another. 12v and 110v wire are designed to be enclosed in walls (think of your insulated walls in your home) or otherwise trapped in small spaces (think of all the 12v wire under the dash of your vehicle). Cover a cord with insulation, fabric, carpet, etc. and the heat around the cord is trapped instead of dissipating into the air. A cord heated beyond its design capabilities can result in a fire.

So, if I understand your situation correctly (I'm thinking the problem is with terms, not your wiring): Yes, you are perfectly safe and correct to put all your 110v wire-nut connections in a box. Yes, you can cover your 110 volt wire with insulation and carpeting. Yes, you can be confident that everything done at the factory was proper and safe.

What you never want to do in your camper is 1) splice, and 2)use a cord (what pokes out of your player) when wire (the white, flat, multi-wire stuff) is what you need.

Where the problem comes in concerning your insurance is you cut off the plug on the cord of your player and connected the cord directly to 110v wire. It doesn't matter that you did this in a box and with wire nuts. It does not matter that it is likely safe (I don't know for sure). What might matter to your insurance company is that you used a cord in a manner in which it was not designed. You in essence "hard-wired" your player and there are rules for that, too. Also, if any of your extension cord is under the carpeting, again, extension cords are not designed to be used that way and would be a violation of code -- and thus, your insurance company might refuse to pay a claim for damage related to this use.

For me personally, my biggest concern when I build, repair, or remodel anything is "Is this safe for my family?" Following wiring codes is the safest way to go.

Whew! Am I any clearer or am I just complicating things!?
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Old 04-04-2010, 01:33 PM   #21
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Joy,
Is your connection which is inside an electrical box easily accessible for maintenance and/or repair?
I think that would make it acceptable. A splice run beneath the "rat fur" and not accessible would not be acceptable.

Yes, easily accessible. The box is taped down over the connection simply to keep stored items from bumping the wires connected with wire nuts. I'd rather that than have the connections come apart. The same with the connection for my light I added to the closet wall as the connection is inside the closet.

Sorry, but I see no hazard in doing this, nothing but safety in covering up the connections that could come apart by items that go in and out of the cabinets.

The factory connections (wire nuts) in Scamps are layed around the trailer exterior walls with the carpeting and insulation down the wall over them. The connection for the overhead fan was found under the insulation and carpeting near the edge of the fan.


I'm done with this guys.

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Old 06-20-2011, 01:54 PM   #22
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The nec does not specify the number of outlets per 15 amp circuit in residential work . Circuits for residential general lighting ( 15 amp ) are based on 3 watts per square ft calculated load. You can place 10, or 11 or 12 current consuming openings on a 15 amp circuit. A single appliance should not exceed 50% of the branch circuit rating , so a 9.5 amp microwave should be on a 15 amp circuit by itself. The intended load is the main factor for determining number and rating of circuits.
The continuos load (3 hours or more) limits the load to 80% of circuit rating so you could not put a 20 amp continuos load on a 20 amp circuit
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Old 06-20-2011, 03:42 PM   #23
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One of the neat things about most new electronics is that they draw significantly less power than the previous generation. For example, our LCD TV draws 38 Watts max.

We now have 9 AC outlets in our Scamp wired on four 15 amp breakers. Typically there are two boxes on a run from the breaker box, 4 plugs per circuit breaker. We do have one box with six plugs.

Our Scamp presently has only one significant power user, an electric heater. Everything else that uses a lot of power like a hair dryer or toaster are on for very short periods. Our coffee pot is only 600 watts and our electric water heater hot rodd is 400 watts.

If we get bold and add an Air Conditioner it will draw no more than 5 amps.

It amazes me how little power the trailer uses compared to our home. This month we used almost 700 kwhs; we use about 150 watts when we're camping in the coldest month when we have power. This is even more dramatic when you factor in the trailer uses electricity for heating and hot water. At home we use natural gas for heating and hot water.

Just musing,

Norm
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Old 06-20-2011, 03:58 PM   #24
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I would not cut an extension cord and splice it onto another appliance and then cover with carpet. This is how fires can start. Just like at home, running an extension under a rug, becomes a fire hazard. The prior owner of my Egg had little electrical experience so he spliced a plug onto a piece of 14 gauge wire and would plug it in when he wanted the outside outlet, to which he ran the 14/3 wire and attached to the outlet. Electrical codes should be followed in an rv just like at home. I would hate to think of selling an rv with improper wiring and then having the new owner experience an electrical fire.
One needs to run proper sized 14/3 for 15 amp and 12/3 for 20 amp circuits. Connections should be made inside approved electrical boxes and wires should be twisted together and wire caps and then tape. RV wiring is subject to a lot more vibration and you do not want that connection to come apart. Follow codes and you should not have any issues.
Another option here is to use 12v tv with built in dvd. Most new tv's are 12v with 120/12v adapters.
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