Possible to run without 12v?

[Joe MacDonald]

You can get a small 3 way fridge for 1/2 the price of your power unit, on gas it would require minimal 12v power for the controls, and that could be made up by solar.
Then you would have propane for the furnace ( if original it doesn't need power) and for the stove( also doesn't require power).
just another thought.
Joe

[John in Santa Cruz]

those Yeti things are *NOT* generators. they are BATTERIES. Calling them generators is about as useful as calling a bicycle a truck.

if you're going to run a fridge off a 1400WH battery pack, you'd better have at least 200 watts of solar, probably twice that, and better not be camping in a shady forest, or on a cloudy day.

[thrifty bill]

I think this thread has definitely proven it's possible to avoid spending $80 on a heavy battery and spending $2000 on a heavy battery pack instead, plus more for a solar set up.

I lifted my 50 pound battery once, to install it.

[Steve L.]

Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz

those Yeti things are *NOT* generators. they are BATTERIES. Calling them generators is about as useful as calling a bicycle a truck.

Thank you for commenting about that, I found it very annoying as well. Sort of that new age mumbo jumbo where if they rename something it changes it somehow. They are energy storage devices, i.e. batteries, not generators.

[Wackyrooster]

$80 on heavy battery, $400+ on proper converter box, $500 extra minimum on the 2way fridge. Not too far off a yeti. And I do agree that it is not a generator - well actually it is if hooked to solar power since it has the internal circuitry necessary to convert solar panels to charge a battery.

Appreciate your opinions - but here is my plan, which I am open to debate on:

Heavy gauge plug (thinking 10 gauge min) for 110v shore power
110v Fuse box with 2x15A gfci fuses
12/2 outdoor wire for all inside power runs
1st 15a GFCI fuse circuit runs LED lighting plus receptacle for 1.8A fridge (200w with quick)
2nd 15a GFCi fuse runs 2 inside and 1 outdoor receptacle

Anyone see any glaring issues?

Thanks again for letting me be a part of this community - love the constructive comments and criticism.

[gordon2]

Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz

those Yeti things are *NOT* generators. they are BATTERIES. Calling them generators is about as useful as calling a bicycle a truck....

The manufacturer calls them Power Stations but also does refer to them as "a plug and-play generator" in the manual. They sell them alone of packaged with solar panels. When paired with solar panels they are in fact power generators. Apparently the OP was planning on solar panels:

Originally Posted by Wackyrooster

...I dont see why I couldnt travel with a Lithium Power Generator like a Goalzero Yeti ... They ....can be recharged with solar panels. ...

So I have no issue with the term generator in that case.

Even without the panel(s) they are much more than just a battery, if for no other reason than having a built-in inverter.

PS. Dont interrupt my comments as an endorsement. I think the Yeti power stations are not the best use of money.

PSS... You know I just had to see if there was a bicycle that was a truck...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lmr70rQYJBA

[Jon Vermilye]

Originally Posted by Wackyrooster

$80 on heavy battery, $400+ on proper converter box, $500 extra minimum on the 2way fridge. Not too far off a yeti. And I do agree that it is not a generator - well actually it is if hooked to solar power since it has the internal circuitry necessary to convert solar panels to charge a battery.

Appreciate your opinions - but here is my plan, which I am open to debate on:

Heavy gauge plug (thinking 10 gauge min) for 110v shore power
110v Fuse box with 2x15A gfci fuses
12/2 outdoor wire for all inside power runs
1st 15a GFCI fuse circuit runs LED lighting plus receptacle for 1.8A fridge (200w with quick)
2nd 15a GFCi fuse runs 2 inside and 1 outdoor receptacle

Anyone see any glaring issues?

Thanks again for letting me be a part of this community - love the constructive comments and criticism.

A couple of comments.

You should be using a breaker box rather than a fuse box. I suspect that was the plan & I'm being picky on terminology, but there is no such thing as a GFCI fuse.

You can save some $ by using standard 15 amp breakers & GFCI receptacles. Place a GFCI receptacle as the first receptacle in the chain, and use the protected output of the receptacle to feed the rest.

There in no advantage to using UF (outdoor) wire. Standard NM (Romex) is much easier to use, costs less, and is NEC approved for trailer wiring.

If you plan to use #10 for your shore power connection, it would make sense to use a 30 amp plug since most campgrounds include one at the pedestal. If you do, you will need a 30 amp main in the breaker box. In most converters, this is done by back feeding a 30 amp breaker in the box so you don't necessarily need to find a breaker box with a separate main breaker. Be sure to add a separate ground buss. The neutral & ground cannot be combined in a trailer. It is treated as a sub panel. If you don't, you will not be able to plug into a GFCI pedestal, and will not meet NEC rules.

Lastly, I wish you luck with the Yeti. I do feel a standard RV system makes more sense, and for the same capacity, will be less expensive, but the Yeti does come as a package which might be an advantage for some.

[thrifty bill]

Originally Posted by Wackyrooster

$80 on heavy battery, $400+ on proper converter box, $500 extra minimum on the 2way fridge. Not too far off a yeti. And I do agree that it is not a generator - well actually it is if hooked to solar power since it has the internal circuitry necessary to convert solar panels to charge a battery.

$400 + for a proper converter box? I paid $129 delivered (US) for my PD 4135 power center, which besides a converter has breaker spots for incoming and outgoing 120V AC, and a fuse panel for my 12V circuits and a smart charger for my battery. So its well beyond a converter.

Plain converters can be had for about $30.

[JonRaw]

Originally Posted by Wackyrooster

$80 on heavy battery, $400+ on proper converter box, $500 extra minimum on the 2way fridge. Not too far off a yeti. And I do agree that it is not a generator - well actually it is if hooked to solar power since it has the internal circuitry necessary to convert solar panels to charge a battery.

Appreciate your opinions - but here is my plan, which I am open to debate on:

Heavy gauge plug (thinking 10 gauge min) for 110v shore power
110v Fuse box with 2x15A gfci fuses
12/2 outdoor wire for all inside power runs
1st 15a GFCI fuse circuit runs LED lighting plus receptacle for 1.8A fridge (200w with quick)
2nd 15a GFCi fuse runs 2 inside and 1 outdoor receptacle

Anyone see any glaring issues?

Thanks again for letting me be a part of this community - love the constructive comments and criticism.

I don't feel qualified to comment on your wiring plan so I won't, but

I still wouldn't call the Goal Zero Yeti a generator. The solar panel may be considered the generator but the Yeti is just what it says. It's a power station, or a battery, converter, and inverter combination. I attach a solar panel to the battery in my travel trailer. Does it change it to a generator? Nah.


Also according to the specs, the Yeti 400 has a 33ah battery. You'd be surprised how short of a time that will actually last. Also check out the recharge times on that 33ah battery (from the Goalzero page

Recharge from the sun by connecting a compatible solar panel. Charge time is dependent on the size of the solar panel. The Boulder 100 Briefcase will fully recharge the Yeti 400 in about 8-16 hours.

Plug it into the wall. Fully recharges in about 5 hours
Recharge from your car 12V adapter in about 13 hours.

The Boulder 100 briefcase mentioned is also going to set you back another $250-$300 and weights another 20lbs.


Editing to add:
The Yeti 1000 has a 96ah battery and the following charge times:

Recharge from the sun by connecting a compatible solar panel. Charge time is dependent on the size of the solar panel. The Boulder 200 Briefcase will fully recharge the Yeti 1000 Lithium in about 10-20 hours.
Plug it into the wall. Fully recharges in 4 hours using the [Yeti Fast Charge 25 Amp Power Supply](https://www.goalzero.com/shop/yeti-a...-power-supply/) or in 18 hours using included power supply. Plug it into the wall. Fully recharges in 4 hours using the Yeti Fast Charge 25 Amp Power Supply or in 18 hours using included power supply.
The Goal Zero Yeti 1000 Lithium can be charged in 9 - 18 hours by plugging into your vehicle's 12V outlet using the [Goal Zero Yeti Lithium 12V Car Charging Cable](https://www.goalzero.com/shop/cords-...harging-cable/). NOTE: Do not attempt to charge your Yeti Lithium from a 12V source using any other cable. Doing so may cause damage to the unit. The Goal Zero Yeti 1000 Lithium can be charged in 9 - 18 hours by plugging into your vehicle's 12V outlet using the Goal Zero Yeti Lithium 12V Car Charging Cable. NOTE: Do not attempt to charge your Yeti Lithium from a 12V source using any other cable. Doing so may cause damage to the unit.

The Yeti fast charge costs another $125 and the 200 solar panel another $500. I thought about getting one of the Goal Zero Yeti power centers and talked to the sales people at REI. The biggest complaint they said they have heard is how long they take to recharge.

[Len S]

Lots of very good information and much false information
My Points;
1) are you a certified electrical contractor with appropriate license to do the wiring ?
2) Some provinces may not allow changes in the original design of the wiring installation on trailers; repairs yes but not changes.
3) Decent solar panels will charge on a cloudy day ; the difference between your cheap and pricier , quality, panels.
4) Even your small ac run bar fridges take a large amount of power for startup , while running the power is much lower. If it has a 12v compressor motor it can work but those are very expensive.
5) Have never seen electric brakes on the 1300 trillium and similar trailers. In most cases I believe provincial regulations are about 2500 lbs and heavier.
6) Unless high end inverters ; cheap ones do not produce 110-120 full wave AC . The cheap ones provide a clipped sign wave and may not work well for some applications. Take a good AC meter and measure the ASC voltage open and under load to check. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

Just some points to consider and may have missed other incorrect info.

[thrifty bill]

Interesting provincal brake requirements, here in NC brakes are required for 1000 pounds or more. Which basically means any FG trailer. Lots of variation state to state in the USA. Hopefully Canada provinces are more consistent? NC limit may be the strictest anywhere.

Are provinces sending out inspectors to ensure no changes?

[Len S]

Originally Posted by tractors1

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned that without a 12V battery, there will be no emergency braking when the trailer and tow go down separate paths after parting ways............

You might add this only applies to those trailers that have electric brakes.

[Raspy]

Originally Posted by tractors1

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned that without a 12V battery, there will be no emergency braking when the trailer and tow go down separate paths after parting ways............

Trailers that have electric brakes, but no battery for domestic lighting, appliances, etc, still require a battery dedicated to emergency braking with a breakaway switch. This is how it's done on cargo and utility trailers.

"No 12 volts", still requires 12 volts for driving lights too.

The idea of "no 12 volts", I would interpret as meaning none for domestic use, but stil there of driving lights and for emergency braking. Surge brakes could eliminate the need for any battery, and then the driving lights would be powered by the tug. Still 12v wiring though.

[steve67]

Nothing prevents us from installing (or having someone install) electric brakes on a trailer. My 1300 Boler came with them and a friend installed them on their 1300 Trillium.
Oh, and you don't have to be a "licensed electrician" to work on your own stuff, but if you don't know what your doing you may want to use one.

[Raspy]

Originally Posted by steve67

you don't have to be a "licensed electrician" to work on your own stuff,

Exactly.

[Len S]

Originally Posted by thrifty bill

Interesting provincal brake requirements, here in NC brakes are required for 1000 pounds or more. Which basically means any FG trailer. Lots of variation state to state in the USA. Hopefully Canada provinces are more consistent? NC limit may be the strictest anywhere.

Are provinces sending out inspectors to ensure no changes?

Yes, was reading some of the NC laws and my take was the towing vehicle must be at least 4000 lbs plus a whole lot of other regs , some good ; some way over the top. Wondering if these are the laws for NC registered
trailers or anyone from outside the state traveling though ?
There could be slight variations of motor vehicle regulation , including trailers that could be a bit different from province to province but for the most part pretty close. The governing part is ; what province the vehicle is licensed in , I believe.
Several years ago we were up in Alaska and saw a trailer (28footer)from one of our Eastern provinces ; parked next to us that had no battery installed as the owner asked if it was ok to infringe a bit on our spot so he could link to his truck battery for power. Dumb A.s

[Len S]

Originally Posted by steve67

Nothing prevents us from installing (or having someone install) electric brakes on a trailer. My 1300 Boler came with them and a friend installed them on their 1300 Trillium.
Oh, and you don't have to be a "licensed electrician" to work on your own stuff, but if you don't know what your doing you may want to use one.

No problem with low voltage 12 v but I was talking about 110-120 AC. Please read it all...
When you start mucking around with changes to higher voltage rewiring in a licensed vehicle that was designed a certain way by the manufacturer then that is another matter. Check that out with your local governing agency.
Changing out a light socket on lug in terminal but not replacing or altering HV wiring.

[Jon Vermilye]

Originally Posted by thrifty bill

Interesting provincal brake requirements, here in NC brakes are required for 1000 pounds or more. Which basically means any FG trailer. Lots of variation state to state in the USA. Hopefully Canada provinces are more consistent? NC limit may be the strictest anywhere.

Are provinces sending out inspectors to ensure no changes?

NY also requires brakes on any trailer over 1000 pounds.