Question on AC panel in power center

[ZachO]

I'm running my fridge on AC, but don't trust my battery charger not to fry my battery. So I've just been using the fridge plug, directly into an extension cord.

But I have access to AC power...so it's nice to flip everything on now and then. So far I've just been unplugging the fridge from the cord, plugging it back into the trailer, then plugging the cord into the main power plug for the camper.

This really isn't much of a hassle, but it would still be really nice to not have to switch back & forth.

So my question is whether I can power AC appliances/outlets, without the charger and converter kicking on. I thought I could...I have two AC breakers, one for "110" and one for "converter". When I flip the converter switch, the converter and battery charger come on.

So I thought I was good today. I flipped the 110 breaker on, and left the converter off. But when I got back at lunch, it was clear my fridge was not running. So two questions...does that seem right? If not, how do I test the AC 110 breaker? I know enough about testing 12V stuff, but don't know how to test the AC side, and don't see access to the breaker the way I could just pull a DC fuse.

I can see that it's possible that I can run the converter and charger without running the AC stuff, but not the other way around. But it would sure be nice if they could each run independently.

[Darwin Maring]

Does your fridge also run off of 12VDC?
You can install a battery disconnect switch on the negative terminal of the battery.

[mszabo]

Just unplug the converter.

[ZachO]

Ah, I see where you guys are coming from. Just take the battery out of the equation? My fridge will run on DC, but that shouldn't matter for what I'm attempting, right?

That will definitely work. In the meantime...I think I answered my own question. I know that the AC breaker for 110 is fine, because when both breakers are flipped, the fridge definitely runs. But it apparently won't run unless the converter/charger are running.

I'm not looking at my trailer right now so excuse me for the ignorant question, but how do I unplug the converter? So far as I know, it's controlled by the breaker. I already know the AC stuff won't work if I flip the converter breaker.

[mszabo]

Follow the black cord coming out of the converter. Should plug into an outlet somewhere.
Could be hard wired but, won't cross that bridge now.

[ZachO]

Ah ok. I assumed it was hard-wired but I'll check when I get back home.

Thanks.

If nothing else, a quick disconnect for the battery is something that can come in handy for a lot of other reasons, so it's a pretty good idea either way. If I get motivated enough I could have that done today...

[mszabo]

Just take the charge wire off the battery will work also.

[ZachO]

I agree, but at that point just doing what I've been doing is easier- moving the extension cord back & forth from the fridge over to the main trailer plug. To get at the battery I have to take the propane/battery cover off, then get a wrench and take a nut off a terminal.

I'm going to order a battery disconnect switch and wire it into the inside of the trailer. If anyone has advice or a switch they really like or really hate, I'm open.

Thanks!

[Franswa]

I took a bunch of pictures of my panel before I reworked my electrical system....you have a 91...mine is a 97....there should only be minor differences if any....

shore power cord comes in...large black(hot), white(neutral) and green (ground) wires

hot goes to main breaker....beside it is a 15A breaker that powers the converter/charger and all the coach plugs (except one...see further below)

my trailer had AC at some point and it was removed....that is the abandoned wires not connected to anything and twisted in the foreground....from the factory the hot wire would have been connected to the red 20A breaker

the last 15A breaker on the right is seperate and only powers one plug above the kitchen meant to have a microwave plugged into it (high power demand item I guess... hence the seperate breaker)

conclusion: in mine the first 15A blue breaker on the left powered the converter/charger AND all coach plugs....to make sure you could plug a lightbulb in the free plug of your fridge compartment receptacle and operate the breakers.....

[Franswa]

on the switch....I found a simple, small switch at an auto supply place and it's rated to 50A !!!! (the run to the battery is short, the wire is smallish....big bulky battery disconnect switches are meant for large size wires as there is no telling how far the battery will be...they cover all bases)

the caution is this.....I know my fridge needs 12V input to run on propane....and I'm not sure if it uses/needs that as well on AC power....you should check...disconnect battery and plug fridge in.....if the fridge goes on "check" (panel light on front of fridge) it needs to see some 12V to operate the control board....

let us know what you find out

[Franswa]

too funny...went outside to my trailer and threw my battery switch to off....panel lights on front of fridge went out......yep, my fridge needs some 12V input to run...even on AC power.....now WE know......

[ZachO]

Thanks! I'll read your posts in depth later.

My fridge is one of the older ones which requires zero 12V power to run on propane.

[J Ron]

Just keep water level up in battery and all should be well. Float voltage on a lead acid 12V battery is 13.2 to 13.6.

[Joe Romas]

Zach0

Never mind, I thought Franswa's pictures were yours
Joe

[stevebaz]

Why not upgrade the charging section in you panel so it can do its own thing.
Might look into one of these.

4600 Series Upgrade or Replacement Power Converters

[ZachO]

Because it's expensive.

It's been on my camper to-do list since I bought it, but hasn't made its way far enough up the priority list. It'll happen at some point, but I can't justify spending the money right now.

It can be a bit of a hassle, but I get along fine with the current setup, so until I either start making a lot more money or something happens with my power center to force me to do it sooner, it's just going to have to wait.

Until just three weeks ago, I was very, very rarely plugged in. So it was never an issue. But my current setup has me in the driveway of a house, so it's only just now an issue. And this, too, is temporary.

[Franswa]

your post/question shows up on my email but is gone from here (??)

A picture is worth a thousand words. The GREEN 30 amp breaker is the main breaker. It turns the other three circuit breakers off. What I can't see clearly is where the BLACK wire from the lower left section, the DC section, goes in the top left section. But if it were on a breaker by it's self you could simply turn that breaker, the converter's charging section section off. But then your 12 lights and devices would run off the battery so you would need to switch it on every couple of days as the battery's charge goes down. What is the disconnected circuit? Joe

yeah it's difficult to see....look again the black (hot) wire from the converter/charger section had a label stuck to it (white paper visible) TWO wires were fed into that first 15A (blue) breaker....the converter/charger AND all AC plugs except the one for microwave (last breaker on the right)

the disconnected circuit is/was the air conditioner...it was removed by a previous owner....not much call for one of those where I live/travel

I'm not sure if connecting the converter/charger to it's own breaker to turn it on or off at will would work...or introduce some other issue....there is a relay in there with a blue and red wires coming out of it... the red wire went to the pos. block behind the board (not visible in picture)....the first three DC circuits (closest to the pos. and neg. posts on the board) are always fed from the battery to supply "filtered" power for radios and such items that would hum if supplied with power direct from the converter.....

I'm not sure how the relay works....as I was deleting the converter/charger altogether....I disconnected the red wire and I cut off the blue wire and fed it into the pos. block.... now power comes from the batteries all the time...when plugged in to shore power the charger comes on on it's own (it's on it's own, new plug under the seat)...I can turn it off with the breaker (red breaker) whenever I want

Phew!...I'm done.. hope that covers it

[Franswa]

I can't remember exactly where the red wire from converter was connected behind the board....it could have been connected some other post......I'm old eh?....

[Joe Romas]

Franswa.

When I typed the reply I thought I was looking at Zach0's pictures instead of yours. Once I discovered my mistake I deleted the text.
Zacj0's threads get complicated and long

When I updated my 6325 with a PD4600 it works like your arrangement. That is all 12 volt consumers run off the battery and the PD 4600 is just a fancy 4 step battery charger.
We both did basically the same thing just took different roads.

Joe

[ZachO]

Hey now!