scrambled egg

[gerald rush]

hi all.
we just got back from an 1800 mile trip with the new to us 1987 16' scamp, all went well for the first 1200 miles, the scamp pulled really well, I really could not tell the difference between it and the 13 foot burro we had before. we were finishing our trip on the Blue Ridge Parkway and had just gotten off the parkway to go to Blowing Rock, NC. I pulled into a parking area just off the highway and went over some pot holes in the road, we heard a sickening crunch and saw the the nose of the trailer scooting in the dirt and the hitch was bent up and was pushing the battery and gas bottle into the front of the trailer, it was still attached to the truck and I was able to stop before any more damage occured. My first impression was "now what?" 400 miles away from home and this disaster. but in retrospect I realized just how fortunate and blessed we were by it not happening on the parkway where there are narrow lanes and dropoffs of several hundred feet on the side. to make a long story short we were able to find an honest and reliable tow truck operator and welder at the blowing rock BP station. Mark stayed after closing to get us patched up and on the road again at a very fair price. the previous owner had sanded and painted the frame and it LOOKED great, but ther must have been rust from the inside that allowed the frame to let go like that. so my advice to those who purchase older eggs is to check the frames very carefully and even reenforce them before the first trip regards, Gerald

[Lee Hillsgrove]

Ouch...

How did the body fare where the gas tanks and battery were pushed back?

[gerald rush]

Ouch...

How did the body fare where the gas tanks and battery were pushed back?

Remarkably as soon as the A frame was pulled back in position the body popped back into shape as before. the only damage was to the sewer line holder on the front which cracked beyond repair. I think that being able to stop quickly after the break helped minimize the damage

[Doug Mager]

Sorry in deed to hear of your disaster but you DO realize just how lucky you are!
The Trailer God musta been watchin over ya

[jack maloney]

This isn't the first report I've seen of frame welds breaking at the A-joint. For some makes of egg, it seems to be a common problem. Caveat emptor!

[gerald rush]

This isn't the first report I've seen of frame welds breaking at the A-joint. For some makes of egg, it seems to be a common problem. Caveat emptor!

Yes Jack, it does happen, I just got off the phone with the scamp factory, they indicated that some of the older ones had a lighter gauge frames and if not properly cared for they could rust and crack. they did say that if the frames were reenforced with angle at the point they exit the trailer body they would be ok, which is what we did and I feel comfortable that it won't happen again. I would suggest to owners of older eggs to do some preventive maintenance and have those angles welded on. It should not cost much and would be worth an untold amount of peace of mind and safety. regards, gerald

[jack maloney]

I just got off the phone with the scamp factory, they indicated that some of the older ones had a lighter gauge frames and if not properly cared for they could rust and crack.

Typical factory answer - "if it breaks, it's your fault." Couldn't possibly be a faulty weld, or metal fatigue, or a design flaw, could it? If your egg's hitch is on an A welded onto the frame , being "properly cared for" may not be enough - checking those welds, and maybe adding some reinforcement, could save you some grief!

[Brian B-P]

Is the A-frame welded on to a Scamp? In older Trilliums, 13' Bolers, the current Escape 17, and various other designs the main frame tubes are the A-frame, after bending towards each other - and usually up as well - at the front. The bend point is the weak area, presumably due to high stress and some questionable bending on the old ones.

The Escape 17 frames I have seen are very nicely bent; I would not be worried about them. The Outlook variation on the Trillium 1300 has a step up at the base of the tongue made with separate pieces of tubing overlapped and welded, rather than bending up; I don't know if this is to reduce manufacturing cost, or for reliability.

My Boler's manual calls for the owner to check, and touch up as necessary, the paint on the frame to avoid corrosion damage. I was discussing frame design with a cargo trailer manufacturer, and he said that they did not use box section frames on longer trailers (over something like 12 or 14 feet) because there were problems (in various brands of cargo trailer) with the frames rusting out from the inside. He and I agreed that this was likely the result of moisture trapped in the closed sections during construction. With a egg using a bent tube frame, towed nose slightly down, the bend points would be the low point and would collect water internally, in addition to the water which sits on top due to the "dent" at the bend.

To be fair to Scamp, Gerald's trailer is twenty years old... most cars have gone to the scrapyard long before that.

[pjanits]

Gerald,

glad no further damage was done. My Burro sometime in it's past had the same thing happen as evidences by the bent frame areas at the "A" bends.

But It was repaired via angle iron and welding long before I got it and I would look everywhere else for trouble before that weld breaks.

You should be fine now.

[Mike Watters]

Typical factory answer - "if it breaks, it's your fault." Couldn't possibly be a faulty weld, or metal fatigue, or a design flaw, could it? If your egg's hitch is on an A welded onto the frame , being "properly cared for" may not be enough - checking those welds, and maybe adding some reinforcement, could save you some grief!

Weak point on the frame or not - if it lasts 20 years or more before failing, can we really describe it as a design flaw?

If the thing was a couple years old, lightly used and barely off the warrantee (or still supposedly covered like our Dodge van was SUPPOSED to be... ) - I'd see a reason to gripe then.

Course - this might also explain why the older ones weighed less (according to the old spec sheets).

mkw

[Brian B-P]

I think Mike has a good point: vehicles in general (not just RVs) are escalating in weight, despite improved materials and technology. Some of that is just raw size, and much is additional features (appliances, etc), but I think a meaningful contribution is due to upgrading components to resolve weaknesses which have been found through experience. I have read of a few trailer frame replacements, and they generally include larger or thicker steel main frame sections and more (or more substantial) cross-members.

[Herb P]

I think it's probably also important to note that vehicles are designed/engineered/tested/etc and have to meet certain requirements like keeping people from getting squished like bugs in a head-on collision... RV's on the other hand are built to be cheap and light and cheap and quick to manufacture and finally, cheap.

So while a truck frame is engineered, a trailer frame is slapped together.

[jack maloney]

Weak point on the frame or not - if it lasts 20 years or more before failing, can we really describe it as a design flaw?

IMHO, yes. As Brian B-P put it:- "The bend point is the weak area, presumably due to high stress..." There have been numerous breaks in this area reported on FGRV forum, which to me suggests that hitches on an A-frame are a potential design problem in an otherwise relatively bulletproof egg. Bent or welded, these things take a lot of torsional stress; examine them carefully, and if in doubt - reinforce!

[Per Walthinsen]

If the frame doesn't look up to the job it becomes even more important to make sure the tongue weight is well within bounds.
I suspect excessive tongue weight is reponsible for a significant percentage of failures, and not just static load but also the added stress when you hit bad roads, dips, and potholes.

[jack maloney]

Per makes a very good point. I'm always a bit sceptical of owner 'modifications' that add big tool boxes, batteries, grills, extra LP tanks, etc., onto a trailer hitch A-frame. In the past, RV mfrs. competed to reduce trailer weight (and price), and some frames were slimmed down close to the margins of safety.

[Alf S.]

Hi: Is this a good reason to do an annual frame test???visual as well as hammer... I plan on adding an application of Krown undercoating... 1 aerosol can is all it will take I'm sure...Is this a good idea??? comments please!!! Alf S. North shore of Lake Erie

[Joseph Olajos]

Hi: Is this a good reason to do an annual frame test???visual as well as hammer... I plan on adding an application of Krown undercoating... 1 aerosol can is all it will take I'm sure...Is this a good idea??? comments please!!! Alf S. North shore of Lake Erie

Just spraying the frame on its EXTERIOR may not be enough protection, as some of the earlier comments indicated rust can progress from the INSIDE of the frame tubing.Last year, to address that issue, I took our '73 Trillium in to the local Krown Rustprroofing shop, and had them thread those thin spray wands inside the frame, starting at its only accessible opening...at the hitch, and sprayed the full length of the frame, right to the back bumper; and, yes, they also did the inside of the square bumper tube, after they popped out one of the end plugs.
I've also had the frame strengthened up front with welded gussets, in the area of those bends just ahead of the bolts that secure the shell to the frame.
Hopefully, I'm much safer now from frame failures, than I was before.

Joe/Peterborough

[MyronL]

After reading this thread I just got real concerned about my old '81 and went under there to take a close look at the bend in my trailer frame that leads to the hitch end. Might be getting paranoid but that framing box felt too thin at the pinch. Now I'm thinking I should get that bend reinforced. Sure don't need any rude road surprises.

Anyone got any pictures of the reinforcement they had done? I would like to see them.

[gerald rush]

After reading this thread I just got real concerned about my old '81 and went under there to take a close look at the bend in my trailer frame that leads to the hitch end. Might be getting paranoid but that framing box felt too thin at the pinch. Now I'm thinking I should get that bend reinforced. Sure don't need any rude road surprises.

Anyone got any pictures of the reinforcement they had done? I would like to see them.

Hi Myron,

I dont have any pics right now but the fix on my scamp consisted of a piece of angle
about 18 to 20 inches long welded to each side of the frame (one angle per side) centered at the bend .
If it is a deep bend you may have to v cut the angle to get the proper bend. It was a simple fix which should last another 20 years the angle is welded across the top
bottom and sides to eliminate any moisture entrapment. care must be taken not to ignite the fiberglass or the floor while welding.
I have seen straps welded to the sides of the frames as well but I think the angle is a stronger fix.
regards Gerald
ps
an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. It doesent help to think I should have done it when you are away from home and the frame gives up the ghost. I was fortunate that there was no other damage to me or others but, it could have been much worse.

[MyronL]

Thanks, G. re: PS...True words. Been there.

Was the piece welded on the inner side or on the outer side of the frame profile? Inside meaning it cannot be seen from the road, Outer side meaning it could, and I assume either way the angle "L" lapped and got welded to side and bottom of the frame box, right?