Actual Fuel Economy

[Raz]

I'm not sure why but I have not had the ethanol problems others report with my small engines. Since most are 2 cycle perhaps there is something in the oil to compensate? My old Troy Bilt tiller does sput and stutter on occasion. I figured that's just old age. .

[charlsara]

Originally Posted by Raz

I'm not sure why but I have not had the ethanol problems others report with my small engines. Since most are 2 cycle perhaps there is something in the oil to compensate? My old Troy Bilt tiller does sput and stutter on occasion. I figured that's just old age. .

I used to run ethanol in mine. After running them about two years I had to replace carburetors in a weed eater and a chain saw. They were gummed with a white substance.

[ZachO]

Originally Posted by Borrego Dave

Pressing the like button, I've had problems with it also.

Exactly, this is the topic we aren't supposed to discuss here, but is the problem. Government. I appreciate much of what the gov does but of course like all of us, it gets a lot of things wrong, too.

We have the majority of our farmland producing grain for animal feed and industry instead of human feed, as our population grows. We have the government subsidizing crops. They all but forced farmers to grow large and produce only one crop or just a few crops. "Get big or get out". Any of you who grew up on farms or knew farmers will know about this. They were pushed to go industrial-scale and specialize in a small number of crops. Now there are too many of those crops. Rather than pay farmers to try to go back to diverse crops or trying to actually fix the problem, they're forcing the surplus grains on the market in the form of things like ethanol in our fuel; corn syrup in our food (there's a reason it's so cheap).

This isn't conspiracy theory or "big brother" paranoia, this is fact, though of course like anything, "it's complicated". It's an attempt to solve a problem without addressing the actual problem, because that would take more work. Easier to pay farmers to keep producing the grain that's already saturating the market, make it cheap so it's easier to find outlets for it (corn syrup, ethanol etc), rather than go back to square one and grow vegetables for people to eat. A whole industry would need to change in order for that happen. Easier to just pay farmers, and find a market for corn.

[Jon Vermilye]

Originally Posted by rbryan

Bruce, Ethanol is a pet peeve of mine. It harms engines and has less energy per molecule. I won't even go into the corn for fuel vs corn for food argument, or the government subsidies we all pay for.

I wish ethanol would just go away. I have to travel 30 miles to a little small engine repair shop just to find ethanol free gasoline for my mowers, chain saws, pressure washer, etc. And, that ethanol free gas costs me over $6 per gallon. The only alternative is to take a road trip to Oklahoma to stock up, where lots of stations are ethanol free.

Or use it as an excuse to make a trip to Alaska. All fuel in AK is ethanol free...

[Bruce H]

Ethanol was foisted upon us by politics and we don't want to discuss politics here because it is unpleasant and the moderators will shut the thread down (as they should).

I started this thread to discuss fuel economy while towing with different tow vehicles and different weight trailers. I am very interested in the experiences of others as I can pick up useful tips for myself.

Leaving the politics out of it; Ethanol DOES affect fuel economy. And, as an aside, it has detrimental effects on some engines. It would be well for each of us to gain an accurate understanding of those issues.

With regard to the effect on engines; I am aware of information contained in the following links which deal with he effect on aircraft engines. I know RV tow vehicles are not aircraft but I believe some of the same principles apply.

Ethanol Fuel Testing | Ethanol in Gas

https://www.easa.europa.eu/system/fi...08-6-light.pdf

The last link is a 262 page pdf summary of a study done by a European government agency. I can save you the trouble of reading all 262 pages and summarize it like this:

If you put ethanol in your airplane it will fall out of the sky and hit the ground.

In the case of aircraft, politics gets subordinated to reality.

[charlsara]

Originally Posted by Bruce H

Ethanol was foisted upon us by politics and we don't want to discuss politics here because it is unpleasant and the moderators will shut the thread down (as they should).

I started this thread to discuss fuel economy while towing with different tow vehicles and different weight trailers. I am very interested in the experiences of others as I can pick up useful tips for myself.

Leaving the politics out of it; Ethanol DOES affect fuel economy. And, as an aside, it has detrimental effects on some engines. It would be well for each of us to gain an accurate understanding of those issues.

With regard to the effect on engines; I am aware of information contained in the following links which deal with he effect on aircraft engines. I know RV tow vehicles are not aircraft but I believe some of the same principles apply.

Ethanol Fuel Testing | Ethanol in Gas

https://www.easa.europa.eu/system/fi...08-6-light.pdf

The last link is a 262 page pdf summary of a study done by a European government agency. I can save you the trouble of reading all 262 pages and summarize it like this:

If you put ethanol in your airplane it will fall out of the sky and hit the ground.

In the case of aircraft, politics gets subordinated to reality.

That"s putting it plainly!!!

[k0wtz]

we have driven a lot in Europe every time we go 8.00 a gal minimum! Not very many huge p/ups there but lots of Mercedes pulling campers go figure?

anyway cameras on the highway have forced everyone to slow down it is actually less speeding there than here. we were on i70 yesterday lots of people driving 80 to 90 but gas 2.39 here on average.

oh farmers here are no longer 1 crop a year farmers in the Midwest now they grow wheat harvest that then plan beans. Believe it or not they get crop insurance on those beans if they get them in in time!

bob

[jen b]

I happen to bring american cheese along on most trips with my Burro. It adds a certain je ne sais quoi to scrambled eggs!

[Mike Magee]

My brother in law has a farm. They milk a couple hundred holsteins. My sister says they had a really bad year in crops; fields that normally produce 150 bushels per acre of corn came in at 30 bushels or less.

[Defenestrator]

Pulling a 19' Escape, we get 14-16MPG so far in a 2015 Highlander, mostly around 60MPH. I imagine the new version with direct injection and an 8-speed transmission would do 1-2MPG better.

[John Linck]

Originally Posted by thrifty bill

Ethanol in US fuels exist for one reason only: government mandate. If the mandate ever is eliminated, ethanol in fuel will disappear as well.

Blame the ag lobby and their farm state congress critters. Prices for corn jumped with the mandate. Now with more acres planted prices are back down. Farmers work harder, use more chemicals and end up with less money. Go figure.

Meanwhile our lakes get greener and not in a good way.

John

This Wisconsin lake at Governor Dodge State Park looks pretty, but you probably wouldn't want to swim in the green slime. Thanks farm runoff.

[k0wtz]

wow our farmers here in Mo. seem to be ok they keep building their own huge grain storage bins I mean huge!!


bob

[steve dunham]

Originally Posted by John Linck

Blame the ag lobby and their farm state congress critters. Prices for corn jumped with the mandate. Now with more acres planted prices are back down. Farmers work harder, use more chemicals and end up with less money. Go figure.

Meanwhile our lakes get greener and not in a good way.

John

This Wisconsin lake at Governor Dodge State Park looks pretty, but you probably wouldn't want to swim in the green slime. Thanks farm runoff.

Gov Dodge is a great State Park , we have camped there many times.
The drinking water at Perrot SP in Wisconsin has high nitrate levels and the water taps and bathrooms are marked warning people with children about the problem.
According to what I was told there are two main contributors to the nitrate problem 1) Corn Farming - Fertilizers 2) The mining of fracking sand - screwing up the water table and the removal of sand for filtration.
The State of Wisconsin has made little or no effort to mitigate these issues . In an era of profit trumps pollution, this is the end result ( No pun intended)
Wisconsin's answer at Perrot was to install a new well and when that didn't work , put up more & larger warning signs.
It's the same approach Wisconsin uses when restrooms don't work,
put up an " OUT OF ORDER " sign . PROBLEM SOLVED