Any experience with Ford Escape 2.0L?

[Jon in AZ]

They may be thinking of boat trailers, not travel trailers, which have surge brakes and do not require a brake line. In the end, I don't think they are fully committed to the towing market for smaller vehicles. They'd rather have you step up a more profitable truck or large SUV. And why should they be? How many Escapes do you see on the road pulling anything bigger than a small fishing boat or utility trailer?

[GirlGone]

So I guess boat owners outweigh RV owners ?

[Bobbie Mayer]

Amazon just opened a car research (so far) center. I took a look. You can search by all kinds of things, including towing capability. Unfortunately, it starts as "Up to 5000 lbs.". So the smaller amounts are all (uselessly) lumped together. Anyway, my point is that they don't even realize there is a market for vehicles towing less than 5000 lbs.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by GirlGone

So I guess boat owners outweigh RV owners ?

Probably not overall, but given the restrictions- under 3500 pounds and under 30 square feet- I'd say boats, yes.

[Raz]

Snow mobile trailers, utility trailers, etc. Whether an Escape or any other small SUV will work really depends on where you plan to tow. As I said earlier, I pulled my Trillium with a Subaru Forester. From here to a state park. Fine. Trying to merge onto the New Jersey Turnpike. Not so good. What's interesting is many try towing with there daily drive only to discover that it just doesn't work for them. We have folks that will tell you they do it with no problem. But they are not you.

[Radar1]

Originally Posted by GirlGone

Every state in the US ,with the exception of maybe 2 or 3, require brakes on any tow over 3000 lbs. ( I think that's correct)
Why would Ford Escape not include a 7 pin ?
Even staying under the 2000# limit ,I wouldn't be able to pull out of my driveway !
Why sell something that can when it's illegal to .

You only need a 7 pin connector for electric brakes. U-Haul trailers can weigh much more than 3500 lbs and only use a four way connector because they use surge brakes.
Our camper in England had surge brakes, like most European campers.
Until recently, trucks didn't come with electric brake controllers either (many still don't) so having a 7 pin connector doesn't necessary mean that there is a brake controller even connected to it.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by Radar1

...having a 7 pin connector doesn't necessary mean that there is a brake controller even connected to it.

No, but it ought to mean that it's pre-wired for one. That was the case in my 2011 Pilot.

[redbarron55]

Manufacturers would rather sell a high markup SUV or Truck to people who want to tow and the "wisdom" indicated that is the only way to go.
Chrysler sells the Town and Country and now the Pacifica with 3500 lb tow hitch and wiring harness with the 7 pin plug and the brake controller wire to the front as a less than $1000 package that includes heavy duty cooling etc and higher rated Alternator etc.
The packages do not include the actual brake controller that I can find, but I installed my P3 in my T&C yesterday and tested towing the 16' Heavy Scamp up and down the highway and it did pretty good.
It looks like towing will be in the 16 - 18 mpg range.
The Pentastar V6 is the only 6 cylinder engine that Chrysler sells and is rated ~283 hp and ~270 ft lbs of torque. If you buy a truck with the V6 this is what will be in it!
The VW Diesel pulls as good with it's 270 ft lbs of torque and gives 25 28 mpg, but the larger longer T&C is a little more steady, but not much.
The weak point in a minivan (at least a Chrysler) is the transmission. This particular engine seems to be solid and the temperatures look good right at the thermostat temp.
I think that if someone wants to tow with a smaller vehicle than a full sized truck these small trailers are the ticket!
My minivan seems to tow as well as any thing I have towed with recently and it seems to handle it well.
We did not buy the Ford Escape or the Edge, because we ( mostly my wife) didn't care for the way the car drove and also the lack of power compared to the VW.
The T&C she likes the handling better than the Fords and the Toyota and Honda vans, so here we are.
We wanted to get newer cars with fewer miles when we sold the VWs back to VW and the lack of good Diesel alternatives put us into the T&C and the lower mpg and fuel cost per gallon RUG fuel.

[steve dunham]

Automakers are in the business of building vehicle that they can sell at a profit. Most people do not or have no plans on towing anything . The average buyer is more concerned with price ,styling ,dependability , comfort and fuel mileage than towing ability. Why would any automaker spend the capital designing their whole vehicle fleet for towing . With the upgraded CAFE standards they are trying to make their vehicles as light as possible to gain more MPG
The automakers are building cars / SUV'S that the majority of the market wants and at a price that they will accept.
The fact that the automakers may generate more profit from the sales of trucks is not some machavelian plot , its' called free enterprise.
If you look at the many polls on many fiberglass trailer website , the majority of FG owners tow with a truck.
Why should every vehicle they build be built for towing ?

[redbarron55]

Automaker build what will sell.
In Europe where there are few pickup style trucks the cars are used for towing and the VW are highly rated. The market forces there reinforce towing with cars.
Here the trucks sell.
I see most of them here in Alabama going back and forth to work with just the driver and sometimes with a boat and utility trailers with 4 wheelers etc.
Rarely a small trailer.
Very often with very large trailers and they look much more out of scale than my VW towing a Scamp!.
But luckily there are choices for those of us who would prefer to not drive a pickup truck. Of course for a long time minivans were classified as trucks to evade parts of the emissions and safety rules, but I don't think that is still true.
That Canadian Cat at CanAm RV likes the cars, especially the Chrysler 300 with the hemi.
His theory is the stiffer suspension and lower center of gravity is a big plus.
I think that these jacked up pickups I see everywhere are probably a step backwards, but I am old and out of step with the young Turks, so there.
To each his own.
We used to tow with trucks that had a lot less horsepower than the cars of today and the cars have better cooling and handling as well.
If the cars are given a tow rating they SHOULD have passed the same criterion ans the trucks and should be safe and capable. I have never had a problem keeping up with the VW Diesel and limit the speed to 65 due to respect for the tire limits.
If you feel safer towing in a truck at 75 with a ball hitch then the least safe thing in the rig is the driver.

[GirlGone]

[QUOTE=redbarron55;615954]Manufacturers would rather sell a high markup SUV or Truck to people who want to tow and the "wisdom" indicated that is the only way to go.
Chrysler sells the Town and Country and now the Pacifica with 3500 lb tow hitch and wiring harness with the 7 pin plug and the brake controller wire to the front as a less than $1000 package that includes heavy duty cooling etc and higher rated Alternator etc.

But here again, we have a vehicle with only a 40-foot frontal area ! So even the smallest Scamp would out measure that.

[redbarron55]

My Scamp is about 6' wide and 6.5' tall and not flat. If it were flat that eo u led be 36 sq ft. But it is assuredly not flat so the equivalent area would be less.
The T&C is wider than the Scamp and a little shorter.
My guess and careful calculations indicate that I will tow with it no matter.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Fiberglass RV mobile app

[GirlGone]

I haven't purchased yet ...The specs show the 2017 Scamp is 6.8 w by 7.6 h .
Am I taking the wrong measurement for calculating frontal area ?

[steve dunham]

Originally Posted by GirlGone

I haven't purchased yet ...The specs show the 2017 Scamp is 6.8 w by 7.6 h .
Am I taking the wrong measurement for calculating frontal area ?

NO, your numbers are correct . Your calculation for frontal area may be different than others because you are using the actual measurement. If you would just guess you can come up with the answer you want that will fit your desired outcome.

[redbarron55]

Two things:
1 the scamp is not a flat plate, it is fairly well rounded
2. The height you are talking about is from the ground to the top.
What counts is the size of the trailer.
My Scamp has about 6.3 clearance inside so rounding up to 6.5 feet.
So maybe that comes to 44 square feet and perhaps a Ford F150 cannot tow one?
I think that the tow ratings are flatplate equivalent and Airstreams and Fiberglass trailers are slicker than those square boxes.
However if you don't feel like whatever you choose will or won't do then so be it.
Personally I have no qualms towing my Scamp with my T&C rated 3500 lbs
The width of the van is 6'6" and height is 5' 8" for a frontal area is around 37 square feet. With a drag coefficient of .33 this has the equivalent flat plate area of 37 square feet / .33 or 12.12 square feet.
The same thing applies to other streamlined shapes.
At any rate doubling the speed squares the power required to move the shape.
If you want to use an Escape to tow don't get a square front trailer, get a fiberglass or Airstream trailer.
If you want to test the limits then use the industry standard

I have seen many European cars and SUVs dragging these things all around the country , especially up the Davis Dam road.
Is the Cargomaster a tougher pull than a Scamp?
You bet it is.
Many here have towed Scamps with small cars and SUV, and Minivans.
If you are not comfortable with that then by all means don't do it.
There is a difference in the shape and that difference makes a difference.
Personally I think that most of my Scamp is behind my 37 square feet of the van and is "drafting" most of the time. The MPG reading is over 20+ MPG at 65 mph on level ground.
My VW TDI averages over 28 MPG towing that same Scamp.
Neither have shown any tendency to add heat to the system in excess of what the added cooler will handle.
I havent done it yet with the Van, but I have towed through the Hill Country of Texas in over 110*F with no heating problems.
Some will only be happy with a Truck and then I am happy for them.
I don't care to drive a truck, so I don't.

[steve dunham]

Facts are not opinions and opinions are not necessarily fact.
It seems that when some one does not like the facts or the rules or a law they can always find a way to rationalize why it does not apply to them. It's a free country so do as you wish but at least have the fortitude to take responsibility if something goes wrong
I know that I don't know everything and when I get to an area where I have no knowledge I ask someone trained / skilled in that field.

[oldsteve]

When we were first looking at all the FG trailers we had a 2008 escape. This was rated at 200hp and 3500 tow limit. We had hitch and wiring installed and thought we were about to go,until that is we test drove a Scamp 16 and then a small Rpod. The Scamp was ok but you knew it was there, it would need some type of load leveling /anti sway system and I'm not sure I would feel comfortable going up and down a hill in Colorado. It also took its time getting up to speed. The rpod was so light at the hitch the sway was out of control. We didn't like the quality of the build either. The point , there is a point at least for me is that I want to feel I am in control and not just surviving a moment. The later model Escape may be a lot different but I never felt safe in mine under towing conditions. When we finally decided to go with a new Casita we bought a Chev Silverado a v6 at that 285hp. It does the job makes you feel safe and climbs and goes down the Colorado mountains all the while you feel under control.

[redbarron55]

Well I guess it has been proven that you cannot tow a small Fiberglass RV with a a smaller RV or car, but rather you must have a fairly good sized truck.
Sorry for misleading you all.

[frank_a]

Steve, what year truck and do you know it's rated towing capacity?

Frank

Originally Posted by oldsteve

When we finally decided to go with a new Casita we bought a Chev Silverado a v6 at that 285hp. It does the job makes you feel safe and climbs and goes down the Colorado mountains all the while you feel under control.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by redbarron55

Well I guess it has been proven that you cannot tow a small Fiberglass RV with a a smaller RV or car, but rather you must have a fairly good sized truck.
Sorry for misleading you all.

10 years of towing my Scamp13D with a Ford Escape. The Escape is well matched to the task in all conditions and terrain.
Of course I also have a good sized truck which is easily up to the task.(Ranger shortbox)
As for the not so good sized ones? (AKA full sized, or oversized)
I'm sure they can do it as well,but why?