Turn 5th wheel scamp into towed trailer

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

Floyd, did you ask Frank about the tongue weight of his set-up? From the "Trailer Weights" database, the average hitch weight of a regular Scamp 19 in OEM configuration is around 500-600 pounds. What did he pull it with? Weight-bearing or weight-distributing hitch?

Last I saw He was towing with a Dodge truck, not a dually but surely capable.

I have seen and admired this mod but I haven't made an intense study of it, however...
Since the two hitches are roughly on the same vertical plane and the new configuration is tandem axle It would reasonable to assume that the tongue weight would be somewhat less or about the same as stock, even with the cage adapter.
I am confident that this was taken into consideration in the design phase.

[Westcliffe01]

Remarkable as it may seem, many people build their own trailers from scratch or from plans in books like the "Glen L travel trailer plans" see https://www.glen-l.com/campers/trailers.html

Apparently few of them produce something unsafe and get sued as a result or the plans would have been withdrawn from sale decades ago. It seems there is a popular narative today that suggests that we are all incapable of doing anything and need to leave it up to the experts. This goes for building your home in Australia and NZ where homes are overpriced by several times their value but apparently this does not motivate anyone to build it themselves.....

[floyd]

There is someone on here who lost an axle on his 5er.
It would likely make the perfect project for a mod like Frank's!

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Westcliffe01

Remarkable as it may seem, many people build their own trailers from scratch or from plans in books like the "Glen L travel trailer plans" see https://www.glen-l.com/campers/trailers.html

Apparently few of them produce something unsafe and get sued as a result or the plans would have been withdrawn from sale decades ago. It seems there is a popular narative today that suggests that we are all incapable of doing anything and need to leave it up to the experts. This goes for building your home in Australia and NZ where homes are overpriced by several times their value but apparently this does not motivate anyone to build it themselves.....

AMEN!!

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by floyd

I hardily disagree.
If what you say is true there would not be a single street rod ever built.

We'll have to politely agree to disagree. I'm not talking about a one-off street rod, but a small manufacturing plant selling to the population.

But, I do know manufacturers who build street rod frames and if an individual was to make changes to the frame where the rod would fly, the manufacturer would disavow any knowledge of the modification. Kinda like Scamp does when it comes to this modification AND the ones where folks change the kinda-sorta-5th_wheel-gooseneck-hitch to a proper king pin. Scamp (Evelands) won't discuss that either. Although they will say folks have done it. And we know they have because some are members of this forum.

[Jon in AZ]

500-600 pounds of tongue weight on a weight-bearing receiver hitch is a marginal set-up (or worse) for a light-duty truck. By the time you add a topper and some cargo in the bed, you have an overloaded rear axle.

Did a little quick searching, and it looks like even some heavy-duty trucks may specify a weight-distributing hitch for those kinds of tongue weights. I doubt you could use WDH with Frank's set-up because there is not a solid rail connecting the hitch to the axle.

Caution advised!

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Donna D.

We'll have to politely agree to disagree. I'm not talking about a one-off street rod, but a small manufacturing plant selling to the population.

But, I do know manufacturers who build street rod frames and if an individual was to make changes to the frame where the rod would fly, the manufacturer would disavow any knowledge of the modification. Kinda like Scamp does when it comes to this modification AND the ones where folks change the kinda-sorta-5th_wheel-gooseneck-hitch to a proper king pin. Scamp (Evelands) won't discuss that either. Although they will say folks have done it. And we know they have because some are members of this forum.

We were talking about a one-off convertible Scamp though.
I'm not talking about people who build kit cars and call them streetrods either.

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by floyd

I'm not talking about people who build kit cars and call them streetrods either.

Me either. I don't even know those kind of builders.

[C&G in FL]

Originally Posted by Wayne Collins

Although we keep using "Fifth Wheel" for the 19 ft Scamp. It is really a Gooseneck hitch system, because it mounts to a ball in the bed of a truck.

I disagree. It is neither a gooseneck hitch nor a 5th wheel hitch. It is a proprietary hitching system. A gooseneck hitch has the ball at the floor level of the bed of the truck (which the Scamp 19 does not use) and a gooseneck trailer has a long, vertical coupler assembly which resembles a goose's neck. A 5th wheel has a king pin, not a coupler. Unlike a 5th wheel, the Scamp 19 requires safety chains. By definition, it should be called a Scamp 19. Those who have converted true 5th wheels to the Andersen hitch are no longer using the 5th wheel connection. Legally, the Andersen hitch requires the use of safety chains. The true 5th wheel is the only current system that Federal DOT and State law(s) exempt from using safety chains.
And in reference to Donna's post, it is my opinion that Scamp should switch from a coupler to a king pin box. It is far easier to hook up because it only needs to be aligned in one plane rather than two. I suspect Scamp chooses to stay with their proprietary system because it is less expensive.

[Donna D.]

I agree Carl. I often wonder if people towing a Scamp 19 and break down outside a small town ever have problems getting a tow truck that can tow the trailer since it's not anything "common."

Jared J did a great job changing the proprietary hitching system to a king pin


Unfortunately he hasn't been around for a long time (Last Activity: 01-07-2015 03:50 PM) so we can't ask him how well it worked out.

[DavidG]

[QUOTE=Donna D.;634373]I agree Carl. I often wonder if people towing a Scamp 19 and break down outside a small town ever have problems getting a tow truck that can tow the trailer since it's not anything "common."

Jared J did a great job changing the proprietary hitching system to a king pin
Attachment 104702

Unfortunately he hasn't been around for a long time (Last Activity: 01-07-2015 03:50 PM) so we can't ask him how well it worked out.[/QUOTE--------------------------------------------

I saw something a few years ago in Wyoming that could be built fairly simply. It was a commercially manufactured 'trailer' , a bit like the Con Gear (converter) we used to use on 'Sets of Doubles " to switch the front semi into a rear 'pull trailer' . Just a very short trailer bolted to the truck or PU, it had the Fifth Wheel ( or ball )on it. It was solid to the PU, needed no license, was the support for the Fifth wheel trailer which rode over it and was hooked to it. I can't find the photo, sadly. But you get the idea. I don't know if many were sold. David in Fresno and Sonora

[Donna D.]

Thought y'all would appreciate these couple of pictures. Taken in South Korea of a Scamp 19. Takes "bumper pull" to a whole new level.

[BARNEYCONE]

Take two ibuprofen and call me in the morning!!!!!!!!!!!!

[DavidG]

Originally Posted by Donna D.

Thought y'all would appreciate these couple of pictures. Taken in South Korea of a Scamp 19. Takes "bumper pull" to a whole new level.

-----------------------------------------------------------

Donna : What a 'Yoke' that is ! And two photos: a " Double Yoke " ! David in Fresno and Sonora, and sometimes Oregon.

[Raspy]

Originally Posted by Donna D.

Thought y'all would appreciate these couple of pictures. Taken in South Korea of a Scamp 19. Takes "bumper pull" to a whole new level.

There ya go. No special equipment needed! No structural changes to the trailer. If he parks on a steep enough hill, it won't even need leveling! Problem solved. But how did he get that thing over to Korea?

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by Raspy

There ya go. No special equipment needed! No structural changes to the trailer. If he parks on a steep enough hill, it won't even need leveling! Problem solved. But how did he get that thing over to Korea?

It was actually shipped to South Korea. Obviously the buyer didn't know exactly what he/she was getting. I just hope they get it figured out and don't plan on towing all the time like the photos. Can you imagine where the tail lights are pointed? Wowser!

[RandyNH]

This ones my favorite.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Donna D.

I agree Carl. I often wonder if people towing a Scamp 19 and break down outside a small town ever have problems getting a tow truck that can tow the trailer since it's not anything "common."

Jared J did a great job changing the proprietary hitching system to a king pin
Attachment 104702

Unfortunately he hasn't been around for a long time (Last Activity: 01-07-2015 03:50 PM) so we can't ask him how well it worked out.

Actually any wrecker with a formula could tow it fairly level, assuming they have a simple 2" ball adapter. Ours came with one.
Most rollbacks even have a formula.

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by RandyNH

This ones my favorite.

Interesting. I wonder how much MORE weight is stored under the loft. Or maybe it's just a place to store stuff out of the weather during camping...

[Paul O.]

The "South Korean" hitch is one answer to the emergency situation, but of course the picture of the adapter that Floyd posted is much better. Any wrecker worth his salt will have one.

We still do not know how Scamp people reacted to Kevin's (offroad) request, but my thinking is that such an option offered by Scamp would be prohibitively expensive and would fragment their market. Not good from the marketing/sales point of view. They cover it well now with the 13, 16, and (unique) 19.

(By the way, my tongue weight is about 600 lbs, about right for the Tacoma, with two people traveling, lots of stuff on the back seat and some weather proof stuff in the bed.)