Scamp Weights

[ORshepherd]

I wrote to the company (Scamp) and told them about my limitations : 3500lbs towing capacity with a 165lb TW limit ....and just for a lark asked if they had a trailer with a wet bath that would fit that bill.

I got a letter back saying: "I received your inquiry and have attached a copy of our brochure and price sheets for you to view. Scamp 13' with shower and stool approximate weight 1300-1400#. Tongue weight 120-130#. Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns."

What is a stool?

[Jon in AZ]

Toilet, I'd guess, in Minnesota-speak, perhaps?

Their weight is a dry weight, meaning without any other options, battery, propane, water, clothes, kitchen equipment, food,… Likely reprints an approximation, because I doubt they have weighed every different build configuration. Figure several hundred pounds more loaded with proportionate tongue weight.

[Bob Miller]

Yep, our Scamp 13 was a front bath and 200-225 lbs on the tongue was more like it, and we didn't have the shower stall option, only the loo...


When they add the bathroom they add two walls, a closet and a marine toilet with holding tank. With the shower they add a waterproof surround and a shower pan, all in front, In back they have to add a water heater or it will be cold showers for everyone, There is also a grey water tank added for the shower & sink drain.


But they do take out a window, a rock shield and a couch/bunk bed.

Shame on Scamp.....

[floyd]

Originally Posted by ORshepherd

I wrote to the company (Scamp) and told them about my limitations : 3500lbs towing capacity with a 165lb TW limit ....and just for a lark asked if they had a trailer with a wet bath that would fit that bill.

I got a letter back saying: "I received your inquiry and have attached a copy of our brochure and price sheets for you to view. Scamp 13' with shower and stool approximate weight 1300-1400#. Tongue weight 120-130#. Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns."

What is a stool?

3500 with only 165 on the tongue?
If it is just for a Lark you must know that a Lark 6 with a 140CID flathead won't have enough power to pull much, heck in my Lark 6 (car) I couldn't even use overdrive with three passengers in the car.
If it is a Lark 8, the engine will be strong enough but the brakes will be iffy at best.
My friend's Grampa used to tow his 14ft fishing boat with a Lark 6 , but he had to slip the clutch to pull it up the ramp.

Are you sure you even have a Studebaker?... below is a Lark based Studebaker Champ...a newer Toyota truck looks a lot like one!



You will find a Scamp13 standard front bath moderately optioned could weigh about 1600# and loaded properly could make 165 on the tongue.

[gordon2]

Joke reply: Well the more stools you leave in the trailer, the more it weighs.. until you dump the tanks at least..

Serious reply #1: Scamp (Eveland Inc) is not real good about maintaining or spell checking their web site and email.

Serious reply #2: Please see the real world weights thread, and the customized spreadsheet for an idea of what the trailers will really weigh with options and gear.

This was average for Scamp 13s (sample size: 5 trailers):
Axle Wt, Tongue Wt, Total Weight
1508, 226, 1734

[Borrego Dave]

[QUOTE
I got a letter back saying: "I received your inquiry and have attached a copy of our brochure and price sheets for you to view. Scamp 13' with shower and stool approximate weight 1300-1400#. Tongue weight 120-130#. Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns."[/QUOTE]

Just checked Fredrick's real world measured weights. Great list that shows how much difference there is from what under weight sales ads say to what is a fact of real road use weights are by owners. Sorry, with your tugs tongue weight limits you're not going to find a trailer with a bath that even comes close. There are units that you can tow safely but your wants/needs will have to be revised or.....a better tug.

[ORshepherd]

Dave, there is no better tug. Even if it doesn't tug a lot...

[gordon2]

.... Sorry, with your tugs tongue weight limits [165] you're not going to find a trailer with a bath that even comes close. There are units that you can tow safely but your wants/needs will have to be revised or.....a better tug.

Yes 165 is really low when the tug is otherwise rated to 3500. Are you sure thats the right number? My tug has a 3500 limit also, but with a tongue weight limit of 10% of that (350).

Is it possible that you get a higher tongue rating with a weight distributing hitch?

What is the exact make model year and options list of your tow vehicle?

[ORshepherd]

I really am not a dim wit.....but how is a person supposed to buy a trailer?! WHo the heck goes around weighing TW before they buy??

He also said the weight was 1300-1400 #.

(and the T@B is always a last resort.)

[ORshepherd]

Originally Posted by gordon2

Yes 165 is really low when the tug is otherwise rated to 3500. Are you sure thats the right number? My tug has a 3500 limit also, but with a tongue weight limit of 10% of that (350).

Is it possible that you get a higher tongue rating with a weight distributing hitch?

What is the exact make model year and options list of your tow vehicle?

It's saga of the Volvo xc70. A salesman I talked to (RVs) said it had to do with the Volvo's suspension being soft in order to soak up bumps. It is a SWEET ride.

[Bob Miller]

Originally Posted by ORshepherd

I really am not a dim wit.....but how is a person supposed to buy a trailer?! WHo the heck goes around weighing TW before they buy??

He also said the weight was 1300-1400 #.

(and the T@B is always a last resort.)

For new trailers, that part depends on the dealer. My local dealer won't sell a trailer to a customer without a suitable TV, an appropriate hitch and a brake controller if required.

As far as used trailers... If you read through the posts you will see that a lot of buyers are clueless about trailers and towing and, unfortunately, only come here after the fact trying to do everything from finding an appropriate TV to finding out how to turn the lights ON. We have heard some real horror stories that started out with "The seller told me...."

When we sold our trailers we advised potential buyers that they had to be able to safely and legally tow it before we would sell it to them. That cost us one sale and set us back 2 whole days in selling the Lil Bigfoot. One of the advantages of selling used FGRV's is the seller is usually in the Catbird Seat.

As for as the T@B, I too would find some owners and get some actual weights.

[Darral T.]

I wish I had recorded how many times I've posted this... But I DO have a Scamp 13 with shower AND "stool" (Dometic commode to be exact which includes its own black tank with valve assembly etc.). Of course it's going to come with a fresh water tank, grey water tank/water heater, kitchen sink. It's basically "loaded" with awning, screen door, A/C. Those last 3 items that you might want to do without which could save you apx 150 lbs....with my configuration. Mine does NOT have a furnace but it did have propane. I've since removed the tank and gone all electric.

From the factory stock with the above described options- 1700 lbs with a 225lb tongue weight- and that is with a full propane tank. With a propane furnace, it would probably weight 1740ish?

Originally Posted by ORshepherd

I wrote to the company (Scamp) and told them about my limitations : 3500lbs towing capacity with a 165lb TW limit ....and just for a lark asked if they had a trailer with a wet bath that would fit that bill.

I got a letter back saying: "I received your inquiry and have attached a copy of our brochure and price sheets for you to view. Scamp 13' with shower and stool approximate weight 1300-1400#. Tongue weight 120-130#. Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns."

What is a stool?

[Borrego Dave]

Originally Posted by ORshepherd

Dave, there is no better tug. Even if it doesn't tug a lot...

I didn't say it wasn't a good tug, just not for what you said you wanted in a trailer. You can spend a lot of time trying to get a number that shows on paper will work but in reality it's pie in the sky. As Bob said, there have been many folks that have come to this site to find out their dream tug just isn't up to the job. You came here for info and advice. Well the members, with years of experience and miles behind them have voiced their thoughts to you. I've been towing for almost 50 years, 20 of those commercial. Guess it's up to you if you want to believe us or sales ads.

[ORshepherd]

So there are lots of us, eh? Seems like a niche someone should address!

I am grateful for your experience and I do listen to you...I'm just stubborn and optimistic.

[Borrego Dave]

[QUOTE=ORshepherd;538865]So there are lots of us, eh? Seems like a niche someone should address! QUOTE]

That's a good one . The FGRV market is VERY much a niche one and we are addressing it here for you. Overall in the RV market, FG trailers have to be well below 1%, probably .001% from production numbers I've seen of RVs. When you've read posts here for a while of folks looking to buy one the comment most used is "I've never even been in one". Being there are no dealers for these you have to stop someone when you can or go to a rally to put an eyeball on them. We are all used to being asked to see them, goes with ownership. This info is just to kind of show you how small our little eggs populate the RV world. In closing, a few of us have given you our thoughts of your search. Being stubborn or optimistic in this case may be deadly, just sayin'. I'm going to leave it for others to add any other ideas for you, good luck to you.

[ORshepherd]

I meant a niche MARKET. I predict that there will be a surge of people looking for trailers they can tow with cars. The tiny house movement and the swell of baby boomers ...Just my feeling. Still may not be a huge market but....there is one. This "glamping" idea is one...

[Borrego Dave]

Originally Posted by ORshepherd

I meant a niche MARKET. I predict that there will be a surge of people looking for trailers they can tow with cars. The tiny house movement and the swell of baby boomers ...Just my feeling. Still may not be a huge market but....there is one. This "glamping" idea is one...

I too have seen a growth of the tiny house movement. Don't think our eggs are in that group though as all of the "tiny houses" I've seen are built on 16' or bigger utility trailers and would have to be pulled with a large v/8 truck. I have a neighbor that just finished one at 18' and it has to weigh at least 5K#. Yup, it's tiny and nice but sure isn't lite .

[Cathy P.]

In the olden days, where I come from, SW MI, we called it a "toilet stool". I have heard that from a lot of other people also as we moved around to different places.

Also, on the T@B, do you have a definite hitch weight? I had looked them online and although I could not find a hitch weight on the one with wet bath, this article makes it look like that depending on options, your hitch weight might exceed your limit.

ALL manufacturers give a dry weight, without options unless otherwise stated. Some manufacturers weigh each trailer that they manufacture but that is rare. The trick there is that many have nearly every item as an option and the weight adds up very quickly. I noticed the amount of cargo was around 300 to 400 lbs on the T&B. Water weighs 8 lbs. per gallon, propane is 4.2 lbs and it all adds up pretty quick. ***Note: This info appears to be on before they sold to Little Guy. I would stay away from the used ones made by Dutchmen as I know they were having a lot of problems. I do not know how much different they are since sold.

I did finally find the brochure and it said tongue weight was 155 to 165 dry weight You probably have this but note the info about dry weight and options: http://tab-rv.com/downloads/TAB-Brochure-2015.pdf

I think that here, you get the pros and cons while on some other forums, they sing the glory very loudly and you don't really get the whole scoop.

[Bob Miller]

T@B should get some credit for truth in advertising, but they went out of their way to hide what they were saying. For example:


Described as having a "Lite Footprint"... what the heck does that mean?


Weight is shown as 1620 lbs to 1760 lbs, but warns that it does not include a full tank of LP OR a battery (both on the tongue) and suggests adding up to 10% for options with no mention of added weight from personal items. With even 300 lps of "stuff" that adds up to about 2032 lbs to 2286 lbs which equals a minimum of 200 to 220 lbs of tongue weigh.


The posted tongue weights, if correct, are laughable because: a) They didn't include the battery and LP load on the tongue and, b) They are well under the 10% ratio generally accepted as minimum tongue weight.


Some Subaru's have the same issue, with low allowable tongue weight vs listed towing weight,, but many find a way.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by ORshepherd

I meant a niche MARKET. I predict that there will be a surge of people looking for trailers they can tow with cars. The tiny house movement and the swell of baby boomers ...Just my feeling. Still may not be a huge market but....there is one. This "glamping" idea is one...

Originally Posted by Borrego Dave

I too have seen a growth of the tiny house movement. Don't think our eggs are in that group though as all of the "tiny houses" I've seen are built on 16' or bigger utility trailers and would have to be pulled with a large v/8 truck. I have a neighbor that just finished one at 18' and it has to weigh at least 5K#. Yup, it's tiny and nice but sure isn't lite .

I believe the point is that people with a mindset that a footprint of 200 sf is sufficient as a permanent residence are more likely to think that a space of 65 sf is sufficient for traveling. I do see an interest in tiny trailers paralleling the interest in tiny houses.