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Old 07-21-2021, 06:54 PM   #61
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I loved Cosmos. "Billions and billions"
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Old 07-21-2021, 08:36 PM   #62
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Watched Cosmos when it was first broadcast on PBS. How about James Burke's Connections series (one and two). There I go, dating myself!
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Old 07-22-2021, 09:33 AM   #63
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The latest on opening the Northern, or Southern (depending on where your from) border. This is crazy, sounds like the US is trying to get even!

and then the other side of the story:

and
https://www.wgrz.com/video/news/loca...7-2df9c75af16e
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Old 07-22-2021, 09:52 AM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gordon2 View Post
Carl nailed it.. 25 years before the pandemic hit us...

Regarding this quote, it is true that most people regard technology as something too difficult to understand. How many people have any idea about how their cell phones works? Another great thinker, Arthur C. Clarke wrote, “Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.” This is where we are now. Magic is what makes our cars go, how the internet works, how vaccines protect us, (or make us magnetic). Because we no longer expect to understand our world, charlatans and con-men can convince the general population of almost anything. Just say it enough times.

Sad. Carl was correct.
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Old 07-22-2021, 10:39 AM   #65
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Get a handle on it!!!

Hi: David Tilston... There's no throttle cable any more. It's all "Fly by wire"!!!
Alf S. North shore of Lake Erie
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Old 07-22-2021, 12:36 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Tilston View Post
... Arthur C. Clarke wrote, “Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.” This is where we are now. ...Because we no longer expect to understand our world, charlatans and con-men can convince the general population of almost anything. ....
Maybe if we get rid of Dr. Fauci and use a different approach ....
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Old 07-22-2021, 01:37 PM   #67
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I need to get better at, "Magic". I try to explain my reasoning for what I believe, (and I believe some weird stuff). Typically it doesn’t end well, glazed eyes and resentment for expecting so much work from my audience.

I have a brother that lives on a sail boat, currently in Panama. He is a flat earther. As far as I can tell the arguments that convince him amount to, “YOU’RE STUPID IF YOU DON’T ALREADY KNOW THIS!” said with great conviction and a lack of respect. I just can’t do that.
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Old 07-22-2021, 05:35 PM   #68
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Maybe if we get rid of Dr. Fauci and use a different approach ....
Would be far better to be rid of Rand Paul and use a medical approach !!!
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Old 07-23-2021, 06:10 AM   #69
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I don't recognize that you have any authority to tell me who to question.

more ramblings from Jon MB

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Originally Posted by David Tilston View Post
Did you know that a compressed spring is more massive then an uncompressed spring? Mass is stored energy, full stop. Since this follows e=mc², or m=e/c², (c is the speed of light) the mass difference is quite small.
I understand it to be the energy embodied in a mass is equal to that mass times the square of speed of that mass. As a compressed spring is not 'moving', there is no added energy.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Adams View Post
Watched Cosmos when it was first broadcast on PBS. How about James Burke's Connections series (one and two). There I go, dating myself!
That brown suit!


Quote:
Originally Posted by David Tilston View Post
... it is true that most people regard technology as something too difficult to understand. ... This is where we are now. Magic is what makes our cars go, how the internet works, how vaccines protect us, (or make us magnetic). Because we no longer expect to understand our world, charlatans and con-men can convince the general population of almost anything. Just say it enough times.
I confess there are things I believe in but don't understand: gravity, and electromagnetic properties come to mind. However, I can quantify, and predict, the effect and outcome of WHAT will happen with consistency despite not knowing HOW the effect happens. I consider that a big difference from blind acceptance and as distinctly different from 'magic' and 'miraculous'.
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Old 07-23-2021, 08:39 AM   #70
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As media tries to cater to an audience it will tend to flavor the reporting in a way that will appeal to that audience. People do not tune in to get the "facts". Facts are boring, and complicated and often ambiguous.

I find one has to read more than one source on stories one finds important. Looking for the common points as well as looking for the ways quotes are used to "flavor" the story one way or the other. This source has 4 quotes from the group on one side but only 2 quotes from the opposing side. Another may switch the ratio to lean the other way. How is the headline framing the story? Does the big print giveth what the small print of the story taketh away?

Infotainment is in many cases mental shall we say self-stimulation. Designed to make you feel good about what you already think, tell you that you are correct to believe what you already believe. Convince you of your rightness. I find that a total waste of time. People who get their information from entertainers on a regular basis are still entitled to an opinion, just not one that can be considered well informed. My rule of thumb is if I agree with everything being said then I am being spoon fed cow pattie pie.

I also have zero patience with asking questions as if there is something unknown, hidden, or nefarious when there is plenty of information on that subject, it is well understood, and not nefarious in any way. Tabloids did that so much in my youth that Mad Magazine did little series of cartoons on it as a feature. Why did Joey not perform in Las Vegas - was it because he was drunk? Was he arrested for beating his wife? Etc. until the last bit where the story says Joey was not performing Las Vegas he was in Atlantic City and isn't married. Sad to see we have that sort of thing having gone mainstream.

If there is really controversy then there will be two (or more) arguments if the information source can't present those arguments in a balanced and straight forward manner, using competent and informed sources then one has a choice. Accept that you don't care to be informed as much as you wish to have ammunition, and be entertained in exchange for viewing the advertising. Or do the work to compare the information to other sources in a good faith effort to formulate a well informed opinion.

Based on all available information I have seen I find Canada's requirements for entry reasonable. Even if I did not I would have to defer to them acting in the best interest of their citizens. No matter my opinion it is after all their house so their rules. I just hope that we get to see our Canadian friends at Algonac rally.

Wow I managed to not insult anyone with that, did not belittle the stated opinion of other members, did not use any buzzwords or talking points that were sure to push buttons. In short I found it reasonably easy to abide by the community rules, and be respectful. It is my hope that everyone posting here will lean more that direction than some of the current posts are. You only have to "win" an argument if one is posting an argumentative post.

Read Mad Magazine, I would say I was dating myself but that magazine was around for generations :-)
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Old 07-23-2021, 08:54 AM   #71
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On that pesky spring... is a compressed spring not potential energy? I have zero recollection of how that would factor in as different from kinetic energy in this discussion. Just recalled that both kinetic and potential are energy. Kinetic being relative to surroundings and potential was inherent to the objects state.

Man I can even see the little picture of a hammer striking a nail (kinetic) vs a hammer suspended by a string in the air (potential). I think gravity was assumed in the second picture.

Someplace in heaven their is a science teacher gasping in amazement that I was paying attention. If it starts to rain then I suspect angels are weeping :-D
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Old 07-23-2021, 08:55 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonnie RB View Post
more ramblings from Jon MB

I understand it to be the energy embodied in a mass is equal to that mass times the square of speed of that mass. As a compressed spring is not 'moving', there is no added energy.
I apologize for hijacking this thread with something almost no one is interested in.

Jon, Perhaps take a look at the video that I linked to. It's one of my favorite. It is about the intrinsic nature of mass. Kinetic energy is a way to add mass, (energy), it is not the only way. Anything that adds energy, (velocity, heat, electrical charge, physical position in a gravity well, mechanical energy stored in a spring....) adds mass.

Be warned, PBS Space Time is a very deep rabbit hole.

These are a few of my favorite episodes. This is not a complete list:









There are almost 290 episodes. They are all worth watching, (well… most of them).

BTW, for me, the inescapable conclusion is that we are living under the event horizon of a black hole. This is because of the nature of time. Told you I believe weird stuff.
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Old 07-23-2021, 09:02 AM   #73
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Would be far better to be rid of Rand Paul and use a medical approach !!!

That's for sure. Let Science through EDUCATION guide our feeble minds. They compare this Pandemic to the 1918 Spanish Flue. Here in Louisiana (and many other states), we are really back in 1818. Only 37% know that vaccination has been discovered (Louis Pasteur was born in 1822). They beg the Doctor "don't put me on the Ventilator". The Doctor hold their hand and says "sorry it's too late". A Pandemic of the un-vaccinated ! 100th of years of medical progress & discoveries thrown in the garbage can, listening to Ran Paul, one of the drivers of the Clown Car.
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Old 07-23-2021, 09:05 AM   #74
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Even research can be confusing. I knew there was a quote about believably of things. I looked it up “ believe nothing of what you hear and only half of what you see”. Attributed to…………. well several sources. And I don’t know what to believe and immediately following “I don’t care.” People say things as fact who don’t know anymore about it than you and me. In many cases you know more about it than the so called expert. People lie. People get confused. People don’t report all the facts which my change the perceived meaning of the message. And on and on. Will the border open and will the crossing be relatively seamless? That’s all I care. But until I see American vehicles coming in and out of Canada on several “News” Reports I won’t get my hopes up too high.
I will not be leaving for Canada betting on the come and I never had much luck on 8 10 the hard way
Iowa Dave
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Old 07-23-2021, 09:33 AM   #75
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So Dave, you are a bowler? I love to bowl, seems like the only exercise I can do these days....
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Old 07-23-2021, 10:02 AM   #76
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Although I agree with very little Carl Sagan said, he is right here. Whatever political persuasion you may be, I think we can agree that madness has seized the world. Our civilization is a house of cards that is sitting in a windstorm. Happy camping.
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Old 07-23-2021, 10:20 AM   #77
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That's my "something new each day". Now, may I be excused?

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Tilston View Post
I apologize for hijacking this thread with something almost no one is interested in.

Jon, Perhaps take a look at the video that I linked to. It's one of my favorite. It is about the intrinsic nature of mass. Kinetic energy is a way to add mass, (energy), it is not the only way. Anything that adds energy, (velocity, heat, electrical charge, physical position in a gravity well, mechanical energy stored in a spring....) adds mass.

Told you I believe weird stuff.
I hope my distillation below is not considered to be selective to the point of bolstering my opinion, but these agree with my admittedly limited understanding of Einsteinian physics.
"In relativity we only use the rest mass, also known as the invariant mass of an object."
"The rest mass does not include contributions from kinetic energy or potential energy, but it does include contributions from changes in internal energy."
"If we compress the spring we are doing work on it - the work done is W=1/2kx2 where k is the spring constant and x is the distance we've compressed the spring. The internal energy of the spring has increased by 1/2kx2 and that means its mass has increased by W=1/2kx2/c2."
citation:
https://physics.stackexchange.com/qu...-stretched-one.

Now, since any numerator value over the 186,000 mi/sec x 186,000 mile/sec denominator value is so small the mass increase is not measurable, neither of us can 'prove' there is a mass increase, but I have to accept the math behind the mass change assertion as reasonable.

Now that my day's lesson is learned, can I go outside and play?




Oh, alright.... MAY I go out and play?
Jon MB
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Old 07-23-2021, 11:00 AM   #78
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My concern is that those who are driven by fear rather than reason will destroy the last vestige of autonomy, prosperity and liberty.

The Scientific Method requires skepticism
I am a Christian who also believes in the scientific method.
I can read... and I find no contradiction between my faith and an understanding of the natural world.
Being "Pro-science" is dangerous and ineffective in a world without "Conscience"
Even an atheist could learn from the wisdom in the first chapter of Romans.

To save the body and kill the spirit can never be in the subject's "best interest".
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Old 07-23-2021, 01:24 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iowa Dave View Post
Even research can be confusing. I knew there was a quote about believably of things. I looked it up “ believe nothing of what you hear and only half of what you see”. Attributed to…………. well several sources. And I don’t know what to believe and immediately following “I don’t care.” People say things as fact who don’t know anymore about it than you and me. In many cases you know more about it than the so called expert. People lie. People get confused. People don’t report all the facts which my change the perceived meaning of the message. And on and on. Will the border open and will the crossing be relatively seamless? That’s all I care. But until I see American vehicles coming in and out of Canada on several “News” Reports I won’t get my hopes up too high.
I will not be leaving for Canada betting on the come and I never had much luck on 8 10 the hard way
Iowa Dave
We are taking the chance to cross to Canada and have signed up for the Niagara Wine Fest. We have not been able to go since it began, since I taught, but I retired last year. My bucket list trip has to see the Chapin (Harry) family concert at Natural Ovens Campground in Nova Scotia, owned by Harry's brother, Steve, in August, but the campground did not even say that they were waiting for Trudeau administration decisions. They punted us to next year and gave us yet another day in that beautiful campground. This trip kind of makes up for that trip being postponed yet again.

I briefly panicked when the US made that inexplicable decision not to follow the Canadian lead. I thought we might not be able to return after the US decision, but Reuters published an article that indicated that you can return if you go to Canada.

So, hopefully we made the right decision. I wanted to kind of make up for the stuff we missed in May and June (part of Roy's Fish Fry, 4 Bs, and Eggs A La Bourbon) due to my knee, which is doing really well now. Just finished a Lectric bike ride and loaded them into the pickup for a week in Door County.

And in any case, the night of the Chapin Concert is now the due date of our soon-to-be baby grandson. Our daughter and son-in-law took us all by surprise. We all thought that they enjoyed their lifestyle without children too much. I hope Junior enjoys Las Vegas or the other grandma is willing to go along and babysit Junior. We do not like Las Vegas, LOL!

Thank you, Canada. I hope you can join us in this country in the future.


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Old 07-23-2021, 04:04 PM   #80
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So Dave, you are a bowler? I love to bowl, seems like the only exercise I can do these days....
Hi Jim
I am not a bowler and have never bowled in my adult life. I’ve played my share of
14-1 billiards, some 9 ball and while in college, tried to learn 3 cushion among less important things like organic chemistry, comparative anatomy etc. Mostly I spend my time outside. And usually for pure recreation, alone.

Today on my way back from registering a wetland tract with the USDA,
I visited a spot on a small creek where my grandma had an epic battle several times with a large mirror (German) carp that she never landed. I saw a leopard frog, raccoon tracks and some Tiger Lillies. Respect for the past, observation of the local flora and fauna and preservation of land for the future.

This morning it was out to the local community college to see my grandson in concert with his combo from this past weeks summer jazz camp. Six kids in the combo, they named themselves “Half dozen.” I told him it was lame. The stand up base player was a girl, the rest of them were boys. He said nobody had anything better. I said “I’ll get a name for you.” He said “No we are good.” Today I told him they should call themselves “Queenie and the five satins.” He thought that wouldn’t fly. And that’s the day for me.

Take it easy and don’t push things too hard .
Iowa Dave
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