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Old 08-15-2014, 09:56 PM   #101
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Trailer: 2010 Scamp 16
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Originally Posted by jazzjunkysue View Post
New old (2005) Casita Patriot owner, here. Never seen a scamp, but I love my Patriot!

I have the front bathroom, and from looking at the pics of the 16' scamp, my bathroom is alot bigger and easier to use.
Plus, from reading all of the casita forums, I don't hear about leaks much. There has to be a problem like an owner-drilled hole to cause a leak.

I also don't like the drapes in the scamp. I think they close in the space. I like my mini blinds. They hug the wall and I can turn them for whatever sun/shade/privacy I want.

I prefer the casita fiberglass to the wood in the scamp. It's simpler and more relaxing than all that wood grain going this way and that. I don't mind the imitation wood doors, either, They clean up well.
I have no problem with my door and windows. Basically, the complaints I hear on casitas aren't interior: ..........

I don't know the price differences. I assume the scamps are less.

Mine rolls down the road beautifully, with no swaying. She's alot of fun!
Bathroom on a 16 ft. scamp depends on the floor plan. Some have a smaller square bath on the side. Others have a larger bath across the front the 13 ft. only has a front bath option. Essentially Scamp front bath is the same size front bath and location as the 13 ft. patriot. The smaller side bath allows one to still have the large front window open to the trailer.

I think I know why you don't hear as much about leaks on the Casita forums. Scamps have at least an extra decade of models on the road compared to Casita, this means some with much older window designs that have had an extra 10 years to develop leaks at the seals. Some have sat for years neglected and then are rescued. My own is a case in point. Sat for years behind a barn, picked up by a young fellow but it had a broken latch on one side of a window while sitting, could not buy parts since window has been out of production for around 30 years. Could not fix it so he caulked and screwed it shut, still leaked a little but not as bad. If you search you will find my post on replacing the water damaged front bunk mount. You can see why you might see more threads on leaks and water damage for a Scamp there are more really old ones out there still being used. I have a lot of metal working experience so I made a replacement for the broken latch part, replaced the rubber seals now it does not leak and works as intended.

From what I recall and pictures the Casita uses snap caps the same as Scamp does for the through the wall fasteners. They dot the sides of the Casita, don't really know if they have rivets or bolts under the caps. But essentially the same difference when it comes to fastener leaks. Old snap caps will degrade, maintain them and it reduces the possibility of leaks, don't and you will get leaks eventually.

The deluxe Scamps have a wood interior the standards are fiberglass cabinets, with pretty much the same fake wood just for the doors you describe for the casita.

Blinds vs. curtains are an actual difference one that I would say people might have a preference for one or the other. Some like the good points you mention for blinds, others like the decorating possibilities of curtains.

The Casitas I have seen were very nice campers, the Scamps and Bolers are also nice. Similar amenities available. I would say available is probably the key. Can't buy what you can't find. So unless your going with new....
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Old 08-16-2014, 05:29 AM   #102
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Raz, the Standard 13 Scamp with no options is $9,295. With the Option Package that contains City Water, 1.9 cubic ft 3-way refrigerator, Battery group 24, Gravel shield, Screen door, Window over range, Choice of front or rear cabinet, and silverware door the price is $10,195.

The 13 Standard with the front bathroom starts at $11,495.

We just got the couch, bunk bed Standard with just about every option except hot water heater and water pump. We also got extra lights and AC and DC outlets, Air Conditioning, awning, big bed (no charge), linoleum, grey water tank, etc and ours ran $12,875.

Hope that helps.

Tom
Thanks Tom. Less than $9300. Wow. If I were to do it again buying a stripped Scamp and adding what I want would be very appealing. Especially with the big bed and jalousie windows. Raz
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Old 08-16-2014, 06:15 AM   #103
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I almost forgot. Scamp gave us a $300 discount when they wrote the order up in January. The prices I gave you were from the factory as of 2 weeks ago, and don't reflect the discount. I thought the price was very reasonable. At the time we were also considering a Camp-Inn teardrop. They are (IMO) the Rolls Royce of TD's, but a similarly equipped trailer was about $5K more than our Scamp!

Jalousie windows are standard equipment now.

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Old 08-16-2014, 11:14 AM   #104
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Curtains vs blinds: I don't think either one is optimal. The best interior window covers I've ever had were in my previous 2005 Rockwood trailer, fan-fold day-night shades. Pull up for a clear view out the window. Pull down the first section for a thin white material you can see out, but no one can see in. Pull down the second section for a heavier material that blocks most light. No rattling as with blinds, and better privacy and light blockage than most curtains. I think Scamp and Casita should both offer these shades.
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Old 08-16-2014, 11:58 AM   #105
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Mike,

Do you know the brand name on these or whether they're offered in a retail setting or rv store? They sound fabulous!


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Old 08-16-2014, 03:05 PM   #106
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Mike,

Do you know the brand name on these or whether they're offered in a retail setting or rv store? They sound fabulous!


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I do not know a brand name, but here is a listing at Camping World. You can see what they look like. Custom-Made Day/Night Shades - Blinds & Shades - Camping World
Here is another website where you can set the width and height, the mount location, the color, everything:
rv pleated shades,day night shades, window shades, window coverings
I'm sure there are other places that sell them, perhaps even some window treatment specialty shop in a city near you.
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Old 08-16-2014, 07:32 PM   #107
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I checked these out and they're gorgeous! Anybody reading this thread too and would have ideas how to mount to a scamp? With our rivets and curtain rods, I'd imagine those would have to be swapped out for SS traditional hardware?

Thanks for the link. A worthwhile investment for sure.

Wendy


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Old 08-16-2014, 10:01 PM   #108
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Perhaps the shade could be mounted with VHB tape. Just guessing. Norm used VHB tape to mount a solar panel atop his Scamp, and it has held for thousands of miles. If the inner surface is shaped ok to match up with the shade assembly, it should work. Or a bit of custom shaped wood could be fitted in, to form a flat surface; the same VHB tape could be used to mount the wood, then more tape or screws (into the wood) for the shade.

It would be nice if you can get by without using rivets!
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Old 08-17-2014, 01:54 PM   #109
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Casita Scamp Comparison

Having read through all these posts, I need to put in my two cents. I narrowed my egg camper search pretty quickly to Scamp and Casita. I requested brochures and price lists by phone to both companies. Casita responded within a week. Scamp took a second phone call and almost three weeks. All my comparisons come from the brochures and what I could glean from the web sites. My comparison is the Scamp 16 foot deluxe and the Casita 17 foot Spirit deluxe. Casita either does a better job with the details or simply has more standard equipment to offer. As an example, the Scamp brochure lists only fresh water and gray water tanks. I had to go to the web site to determine there is a black water tank, located under the commode.

Both companies list a lot of standard equipment and options. First, the items Casita lists that Scamp does not. I only reference the brochures, for the most part, and the web sites. Scamp may include some of these items, and some I really don't what they are. Exp. Water heater bypass, and blow out plug.

Casita Standard and Optional items not offered in the Scamp brochure. The post wouldn't allow the spaces I used. The first price or ? is from Casita and the second price or ? is for the Scamp. Looks confusing in the post.

Exhaust fan in the bathroom
Water heater bypass
Outside shower, wash station $96 option
Smoke and gas detectors
Safety brake away switch (brakes)
Dead bolt door lock
Frig fan $96 option
Fresh water hose
Blow out plug
Water pressure regulator
Hitch lock
Electric tongue jack $255 option
Outside storage compartment
Propane tank cover
Auto Propane tank changeover
Sliding screened windows vs Cranked
Mini blinds vs curtains
Led running and tail lights
Option for interior led lighting $139 option

Scamp offers a 2 inch receiver
for a bike rack $105 option

Than I compared the cost of options and what comes standard equipment. I don't know if there is a difference in quality. A/C is considered A/C and a furnace is a furnace. I would imagine the appliances come from mostly the same place. Same spacing problem here. The first item or ? is Casita and the second is Scamp. The S is standard.

Casita Scamp
Exterior door light S $30
(2) 20 pound propane tanks S $120
Propane gauge ? $50
110vac ext. outlet S $40
12vdc interior outlet S $30
110vac interior outlet S $30
Vinyl flooring $296 $75
Fantastic roof vent/fan S $175
Tongue wheel ? $25
Step S $50
6 gal water heater gas/electric S Gas only Stand. + elect. $270
Power range hood/light S $105
Roof A/C with heat stripe S $799 heat stripe $80
Furnace 16,000 BTU $474 $395
TV ant. and amp $159 $185
TV shelf $59 ?
Cable ready $38 $45
Awning 10 foot $735 $900
Range cover (hinged) $32 $45 (not hinged)


Other differences:

16 gal fresh water standard in Casita. 12 gal fresh water Scamp.
25 gal fresh water option $63 Casita. Extra fresh water Scamp $100.
32 gal grey water. 26 gal grey water.
15 gal black water. 9 gal black water.
15 inch tires. 13 inch tire C range
15 inch D range tires with high lift
axle is a $189 option.
Fiberglass furniture with fake wood Scamp deluxe has beautiful real wood
cabinet covers. cabinetry.
Interior height is 6ft 1 1/2 inch. Interior height 6ft 3 inches.
External height is 7ft 10 inch. Exterior height is 8ft. 11 inch.
Weight dry is approx. 2480 pounds Weight 1750 to 2000
Hitch height ? Hitch height 21 inch.
Flat access door. Curved access door.
Fridge 4.0 with gas, 12vdc and 110vac Fridge is 4.6 gas and electric only.

The Casita has a much higher tongue weight at around 365 pounds vs the Scamp at 185 to 220 pounds.

The Casita has one connection to empty the gray and black water tanks. The Scamp has two connections to empty the tanks.

I don't have the measurements, but the windows in the Casita entry door, rear and above sink, appear larger.

The Casita is a full fiberglass shell.

The drain hose fits in the rear bumper on the Casita, and I like the option of having interior Led lighting option. For the cost, I would replace the bulbs with Led bulbs myself.

Casita price $20,292 minus 2014 discount $3616 = $16,676. The options I would choose (no awning, electric tongue jack) (high lift axle, d range tires, vinyl flooring and the rest of the options) total $1502. Total price $18,178.

Scamp price for the deluxe with the nice wood cabinetry is $18,695. Cost of having similar equipment (not including the 2in receiver) totals $2629 in options. Even than the options are not apples to apples. Makes the total for the well optioned Scamp $21,324. It's more than possible that Scamp has or would match the Casita discount. I haven't talked to salesman from either company.

Like I said, all this information was taken from brochures and the company web sites. I'm only interested in a new unit. While Minnesota is a lot closer than Texas, I think the drive is worth the investment to purchase the Casita. I can also add, that Casita gave me two references for the 17 foot deluxe in my home town of Great Falls. I was given an excellent rundown on a 2013 by a very enthused owner. I looked at a 2007 Scamp for sale in Missoula, Mt, about 180 miles away. No local owner references were offered by Scamp. If anyone cares to dispute this comparison, I'd be happy to be educated.
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Old 08-17-2014, 02:39 PM   #110
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Wayne, I would say your feature by feature analysis is spot on, at least in regard to the 16' Scamp Deluxe vs the 17' Casita Spirit Deluxe.

We made the exact same comparison a year ago and found the Casita to be the better value and, to us, a better design. Casita seems to be much more receptive to making changes to improve their product while Scamp continues to do what has worked for them in the past. I'm afraid they're falling behind the competition.

This wasn't the conclusion I wanted to come to as I'm from Minnesota. Regardless, we made the trip to Texas in April and are very happy with our decision. I'm sure the Scamp folks are as well but if buying new, I would encourage people to look at both and compare the features as you have done.
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Old 08-17-2014, 04:15 PM   #111
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I think the term Deluxe is not meaningful between brands. Scamp uses it to distinguish the full wood interior. Casita uses it to describe the equipment package upgrade for the same interior.

Scamp deluxe floor plan B is a wood version of standard layout 6 with the bathroom option selected. In standard layout 6 one can have that space as bath or storage. Deluxe floor plan A is same features of standard layout 6 but with a side bath and front dinette which preserves the front window. Standard has front bath and side dinette so no front window.

I'm pretty sure the fridge is 3 way in either one gas/electric generally means both 110 & 12 volt electric.

Only way to really know what the darn brochures and pricing means is to call and talk to sales. I know a few people have posted about asking if something can be added by Scamp and getting told "sure". Or finding out it was an unlisted option. Also I think (but it has been almost 10 years since I enquired) Scamp is listing optional items such as outlets as price if you want additional ones added not that it does not have them at all.

And some floor plans don't have space for certain things so they are "optional" but only if you purchase a model that has that spot available. Can't put overhead shelf in if you have front bath and closet.

Scamp has been (rightly) criticized for not having better and clearer information. On the other hand Casita does not offer 9 different floor plans in a 16 ft. so it would be less complicated to provide sales brochure that is easy to understand.
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Old 08-17-2014, 04:55 PM   #112
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The thing that was my deciding factor is interior height, I was looking at Casita over 2 years before Scamp. But the extra inch(s) of head room wins.... I'm able to stand up in my Scamp, not quite able to in Casita. Secondary the tongue weight and total weight would have been a issue. I'd prefer the larger tire size though.
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Old 08-17-2014, 05:12 PM   #113
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Darrell,

The first year we attended the Scamp Camp in FL there were two people who had changed their Scamp tires to 14" tires.

The only mod they said they made was to remove the black trim around one wheel well, cut the fiberglass a little, replace the black trim and mount the tires. They claimed no interference with the larger tires.

I had planned the same mod but our 13's worked just fine.
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Old 08-18-2014, 02:45 PM   #114
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Good report Wayne! One thing on the Casita, you're getting a precious 1' more in length! (16 vs 17) Possibly the reason for the added tongue weight?

Rivets:
I want to revisit the Rivets vs Bolts:
I'm the one that replaced my Scamp closet rivets with S/S (Stainless Steel) screws..they will NOT rust. You simply cannot compare fiberglass to steel in reference to how the rivets hold up. FG will fatigue MUCH quicker with any given shifting of the rivet against the fiberglass surface than steel.

I realize there's MANY FG's on the road with rivets. Regardless, I personally had trouble with the two rivets supporting my closet. That area of a Scamp can shift considerably during travel from what Scamp has told me. The bolts allowed me to secure the closet to the roof so now there's little if ANY "shifting" between the two. So far, they're holding up well. And, I would STILL use bolts in this area because of the extra stress applied there-- which is obvious- those are the two that worked loose. I keep a watch on the bulkhead as well. (I have a front bath). So far, the bulkhead rivets are holding up fine. The upper cabinets? They should shift/move with the top of the fiberglass shell because of their size. But remember, my Scamp closet is attached from top to bottom! That's over 6' stretch of technically, a fiberglass support there...hope that makes sense.

Curtains:
You cant really compare the curtains in my Scamp to a preference over the mini-blinds. They're NOT private and that's the main issue. They are private now since I added the Roc-lun. Personally, I think curtains look a bit more "homey" than blinds but that's just my opinion. I'd rather have blinds in the Scamp for the convenience though. Another issue with curtains in the Scamp, if you will look at the window on the side, the side window curtains stand away from the bottom of the window in areas at 2-4"!! You can plainly see down in the Scamp. If you're laying there, you can look up at alot of sky! I secure the bottom of the curtains at night for total privacy. Again, blinds mounted correctly would take care of that issue as well.
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Old 08-18-2014, 03:11 PM   #115
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Hi Darral,

Good to know about the closet area, as I too had to replace there. I used rivets, but with your experience and info you gleaned from Scamp, I'll keep a close eye on it as my closet rivet was leaking there too.

What is Roc Lun? A blackout material? Do you get at a fabric store or something?

Thank you,
Wendy


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Old 08-18-2014, 03:23 PM   #116
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more on Scamp CURTAINS

For what it's worth Wendy, I like your "Open-mindedness"

The Roc-Lun I bought was from "Jo-Anns". They have an EXCELLENT supply including "room darkening" and "Black-out". If you will look on my Flickr site, I show an alternative to sewing to the curtains! (link at bottom). And here's how that came about....

I bought "room darkening" at first and sewed it to the rear and side curtains. (yes....I did it myself by using my daughter's borrowed Singer ) Wife doesnt sew. (GOOD COOK THOUGH!!) Well, I decided- as you will see in my flickr photos- to do the door a little different because of its size. As you will see, I created a "shade" by taking the roc lun and taping it with "vinyl" clear tape to a 3/8" wooden dowel. You can roll it up and tuck it away at the top behind the curtain!

For what it's worth, we liked this so well, I bought MORE "black-out" and made some for the other windows as well!! The rear windows, I usually tuck it behind the curtains and from the inside, it's invisible. But wow, what a difference it made/makes in the Scamp at night with the "black-out" on the windows. The neat thing is, we can roll these up in the daytime and tuck them ALL behind the curtains or simply lay them up in the rear cabinets. Then you can have some natural light coming through with the room-darkening or light-filtering material I sewed on the curtains...or of course, just open the curtains.

I know this all may sound kinda corny...but hey..it works for us!

https://www.flickr.com/photos/503516...7626459677721/

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Old 08-18-2014, 04:07 PM   #117
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I think it does not matter which fastener, rivet or bolt as long as one can get it tight. FG will break before either rivet or bolt will. Bolts allow one to put in washer to spread out load (less stress on the hole) but under extreme stress rivet will pull through with less FG damage than pulling a nut or nut and washer through the hole.

On mine the top closet, right at the curve of the roof required a slightly longer rivet than the other attachments through shell to secure cabinets or closet sides. Choice is bolts or getting a longer rivet and cutting tube to length required. On mine these fasteners go into the acorn nuts. I honestly don't recall if I did bolt or rivet for fastener there at the curve of the roof/closet.
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Old 08-18-2014, 04:19 PM   #118
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I needed a longer rivet for the left side as you face closet. Right side was a shorter one!

I do keep an open mind to all of this stuff, especially fasteners. But keep in mind also my trailer was in an accident once and is definitely tweaked some. If I keep on needing to replace the same rivets, you bet your bippy I'd go with SS bolts!

Thank you for the info on the Roc Lun. Something to do over the long winter. Alas, our camping season here will soon be over. Blech...


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Old 08-18-2014, 08:56 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darral View Post
Good report Wayne! One thing on the Casita, you're getting a precious 1' more in length! (16 vs 17) Possibly the reason for the added tongue weight?

Rivets:
I want to revisit the Rivets vs Bolts:
I realize there's MANY FG's on the road with rivets.
.
And after forty some years of a dozen makes using rivets effectively, the issue has now been settled for decades.
Remember, I have no dog in the fight since my Scamp is not held together with rivets from the factory.
It took a lot less time to convince most folks that tubeless tires were viable, and with a LOT higher failure rate!
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Old 08-18-2014, 10:38 PM   #120
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Umm just for the record I think the thread is Casita vs. Scamp and don't both use rivets?

As is the case with many things you can't argue with "it works well". That applies to either bolts or rivets. Cleat blocks tabbed in or double wall. Each offers some potential benefit and some possible downside. Cost, weight, ease of repair or.... But in each case "it works". And probably not the top reason on the list of reasons one would purchase a particular model of camper. One does not buy a deluxe scamp to avoid the rivets, one buys it for the wood interior and the layout. Pretty sure having enough cabinets and closets well located trumps how they are attached.

Long, long ago in a land far away (well actually only about 10 miles) I used to go into bars frequented by Harley riders in fairly large numbers. I would be wearing my Triumph or BSA shirt or maybe a jacket with Triumph wings on it. Sometimes a person would comment on the fact that those were not "the wings" generally worn here. I would point out if you don't have pride in what you ride, why ride it. That generally settled the question. I'm pretty sure if a bunch of drunk bikers understand that concept we FGRV owners should have a pretty easy time of understanding why folks have pride in their brand of egg. Now if those had been Honda wings.... I would have been less popular then a sticky trailer at a FGRV rally.
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