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Old 01-23-2017, 08:30 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony M View Post
Probably a good idea Paul. I have some concerns with my Subaru Forester tongue weight. Interestingly, my 2010 Forester was rated to tow 2700 lbs. but my 2015 Forester is rated to tow 1500 lbs. Both had/have manual transmissions. If the vehicle can't handle the weight, the next one will have a greater towing capacity. I would prefer dual tanks, because we have always been tent campers, preferring a bit more solitude and the dual tanks would allow more boondocking. We also have a place in northern Vermont, so you might see our Scamp on those country roads. Tony
My Outback may be similar. When I look underneath at the hitch attachment points I can see why the tongue weight is restricted to 200 pounds. The metal of the "frame/unibody" is very thin where the U-Haul hitch is bolted on. The thickness of the steel in the hitch seems about 10 times as thick as the "frame". I suspect this is the real reason the tongue weight is restricted. Even though the 6 cylinder Outback can tow more than my 4 banger the tongue weight limit is the same. I keep our Scamp's tongue at 200 pounds thru cargo balancing but still take a look down there every chance I get to see if there are any issues. As Wisconsin's road salt does its work over the years regular inspection seems a good idea.

John
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Old 01-23-2017, 10:53 AM   #22
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John, We are buying the front bunk 13 footer, so I am hoping there will be less weight on the hitch than with the bathroom model. Of course Scamp tells me my hitch weight will be about 155 lbs. with the dual tanks. Don't know how accurate that estimate is!
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Old 01-23-2017, 11:00 AM   #23
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Hitch weight?

Lots of talk about hitch weight. I am new so please bare with me
To my understanding, if hitch weight is higher than the acceptable TV rating, can that weight not be lessened by moving packed weight to the rear of the trailer?
Seems like a simple solution, on paper. Perhaps not so in the real world?
I have pulled horse trailers but my Scamp will be the 1st travel trailer.

Mark
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Old 01-23-2017, 11:44 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Triker View Post
In the real world of tongue weights, the Scamp 13' with bath, Group 27 battery and one propane tank comes in at 220#. This is with NO personal gear, no air conditioning, no awning.
About right, except that personal gear awning and A/C don't really affect the tongue weight on a properly loaded trailer. My Scamp13D is at about 240# with everything you describe plus my bike rack and two bikes on the tongue.
Like you, my vote is no second tank, when in doubt simply weigh the one tank before a trip to be sure of an adequate supply. the extra tank is just 50#more than you need and its all on the tongue!
Truck stops like LOVES sell propane by the gallon, so you can top off the propane with no minimum when you stop for gas.
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Old 01-23-2017, 11:58 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by panhead_mike View Post
While I made the comment without factoring in some of the things you mention, you make me wonder just what you guys are using for a tow vehicle. Does everyone own a 4x4 truck??
There isn't much out there that tows 3500lbs any more. And since everyone wanted an automatic, that's what you have now?
Not everyone tows with a truck, especially when we're talking about a 13' Scamp. Some people do prefer a truck, both for performance and cargo-carrying capacity, but it's certainly not necessary.

On the other end of the tow vehicle spectrum are those who tow with compact SUVs, some rated as low as 1500 pounds. With care, it can work, but probably not with two LP tanks and the larger battery.

I'm not sure what you meant by "not much out there that tows 3500# any more," though. There are any number of mid-sized vehicles with a maximum tow rating of 3500# or higher that aren't trucks. Off the top of my head: Ford Escape 2.0 Ecoboost, Ford Edge, Ford Flex, Ford Explorer, Hyundai Santa Fe Sport 2.0T, Kia Sorento 2.0T, Mazda CX-9, Toyota Highlander, Honda Pilot, Nissan Pathfinder, Chevy Equinox/GMC Terrain V6, Jeep Wrangler Unlimited, Jeep Cherokee, Jeep Grand Cherokee, Toyota Sienna, Honda Odyssey, Kia Sedona, Chrysler T&C/Pacifica for starters. Any would pull a Scamp 13 just fine, one or two tanks. Most would handle a number of larger molded fiberglass trailers as well.

I tow a 13' Scamp with a 2011 Honda Pilot 2WD rated 3500/350#. With four people and gear for a week, it's just right for us. I like having a little extra room and load capacity in the car- keeps the trailer from getting too cluttered.
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Old 01-23-2017, 02:18 PM   #26
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Name: Therisa
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I am worried about this too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Linck View Post
My Outback may be similar. When I look underneath at the hitch attachment points I can see why the tongue weight is restricted to 200 pounds. The metal of the "frame/unibody" is very thin where the U-Haul hitch is bolted on. The thickness of the steel in the hitch seems about 10 times as thick as the "frame". I suspect this is the real reason the tongue weight is restricted. Even though the 6 cylinder Outback can tow more than my 4 banger the tongue weight limit is the same. I keep our Scamp's tongue at 200 pounds thru cargo balancing but still take a look down there every chance I get to see if there are any issues. As Wisconsin's road salt does its work over the years regular inspection seems a good idea.

John
could you tell us more about how you balance the cargo? We have a 2016 outback with that 200 pound limit the same as yours, and are seriously contemplating the scamp 13 with bathroom. I wondered if I ordered lithium batteries which could be put inside th scamp that I could put them for the back and reduce the tongue weight. I also wondered what else I should/could do to make it stay below that weight.
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Old 01-23-2017, 02:25 PM   #27
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Trailer: 2016 Scamp 13'
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MK Evenson View Post
Lots of talk about hitch weight. I am new so please bare with me
To my understanding, if hitch weight is higher than the acceptable TV rating, can that weight not be lessened by moving packed weight to the rear of the trailer?
Seems like a simple solution, on paper. Perhaps not so in the real world?
I have pulled horse trailers but my Scamp will be the 1st travel trailer.

Mark
I'm sure others a lot more technical than I am can answer this better, but my trailer should be level. If I were to add more weight to the rear, yes, the tongue would weigh less, but it also would rise AND add to the total weight of the trailer. This also makes the trailer behave differently. It's also best to have the trailer balanced weight-wise from side to side.

Vehicle Owner's Manual will usually state towing tongue weight and total trailer weight. My comment about NO personal gear, no air conditioning, no awning was more toward the second rating, as off the factory floor it weighed 1500#.
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Old 01-23-2017, 04:31 PM   #28
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Dual tank holder

When I installed a dual tank holder both tanks had to be in place for the holder to properly secure the tanks. With one tank the upper bracket would not apply the proper pressure.
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Old 01-23-2017, 04:32 PM   #29
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Theresa, you could also replace the propane tank with a fiberglass one to save another 15 or so pounds off the tongue weight, but having a front bath in the 13' Scamp will be very difficult to overcome that added weight.
Dave & Paula
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Old 01-23-2017, 04:37 PM   #30
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Unless they have changed, the after market hitches bolt to the two bottom of tubes that stiffen the rear of the car. The oem hitch attaches to three studs at the end of those tubes. I suspect the tow ratings are based on the oem hitch.

You'll find pictures here:
http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...hed-52650.html
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Old 01-23-2017, 05:48 PM   #31
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My front bath, group 27 battery, one propane tank, deluxe oak 13' Scamp had a tongue weight of 230 pounds from the factory. I suspect without the front bath the tongue weight would be about 200 pounds. I resolved the heavy tongue issue by moving the battery inside and to the very rear of the dinette seat (with external venting) and added a 20 pound bike rack to the back bumper. I also try to store heavier items in the rear of the trailer as well (jack, tools, etc).

I did add a front cargo box to the tongue that surely weighs at least as much as a second full propane tank. Still in the end I always weigh in at 200 + or - 5 pounds on the ball.

One bike on the rack helps more, but two causes a bit of sway at which point I move some cargo forward.

Better to have a huge tow vehicle and not have to juggle, but I love my Outback and after 25,000 towing miles couldn't be happier.

John
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Old 01-23-2017, 06:00 PM   #32
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Name: Therisa
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Thanks for good suggestions

It looks like I can use interior lithium battery, change propane tank to fiberglass, move heavy stuff to the back, and maybe take the doir off of the bathroom in order to get below that 200 lb tongue weight. I will still try to persuade my partner that he really does not need the shower and that he can live with the porta-potti option. Without the bathroom, I might not have to go through all these changes.
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Old 01-23-2017, 06:40 PM   #33
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hitch weight

Very interesting reading. Thanks to all who have contributed. I am much more informed than before.
Mark
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Old 01-23-2017, 06:43 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Ken in Pa View Post
Mark, If you are going to change your order do it soon. That tank holder is one of the first things they do. The frame is made first and the holder is welded on.
Ken
Ken, just got an Email from Scamp. Production will start approx 6 weeks from delivery date. They must be backed up with quite a few orders!

Mark
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Old 01-24-2017, 06:31 AM   #35
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floyd, I never knew you could buy propane by the gallon. Every time I fill a tank in New England, it's a flat fee, tank empty, $17.00, tank half full, $17.00. That's why I am considering the second tank. Knowing I can start each trip with a full tank makes a big difference. I'll will check the local truck stops. Tony
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Old 01-24-2017, 07:11 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony M View Post
floyd, I never knew you could buy propane by the gallon. Every time I fill a tank in New England, it's a flat fee, tank empty, $17.00, tank half full, $17.00. That's why I am considering the second tank. Knowing I can start each trip with a full tank makes a big difference. I'll will check the local truck stops. Tony
$17? I do not know how they do it, but Bob's Garage in Whiter River Junction is $8.75 for the 20# tank refills. And the West Lebanon, NH Feed & Supply store is $9.50. But, LP gas is a refinery "waste product", after all.
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Old 01-24-2017, 07:45 AM   #37
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Tractor Supply meters their propane. You pay only what the tank takes. On the road the web site will tell you which stores have propane. The West Lebanon, N.H. store was up to $1.96/gal last week. Don't go if you are in a hurry. There is typically one person qualified to fill tanks and you have to wait for them to free up.
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Old 01-24-2017, 07:50 AM   #38
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There is only 5 gal in a 20# tank, 25gal in a 100# tank..etc. Propane here is about 2.15 per gal but it jumps around like gas and varies by location to. Lotsof places just refill by the gal,look around some. I get mine filled at tractor supply... about 12.00 if empty.
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Old 01-24-2017, 08:12 AM   #39
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tongue vs total weight

I apologize if I'm stating the obvious, but when moving weight from the tongue to the rear, don't forget that the tongue needs to remain the proper percentage of total weight. Generally 10%-15% but Scamp may have their own recommendation.
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Old 01-24-2017, 08:45 AM   #40
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$17.00 at BJ's for non members, $13.00 for members. Being a member, I was thinking I was getting a good deal. Those are CT. prices. In northern VT. I pay about the same at the local gas station/convenience store. I've only needed propane for occasional use of the gas grill, so it hasn't been a big deal but now that the Scamp is on order and we will be using a lot more propane, I will definitely be looking for per gallon fill ups and better pricing!
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