Dometic Rm2351 and RM2354 3cu-ft Absorption Refers Discontinued

[Thane]

The subject small refers are no longer available from Dometic.

I know lots of folks are updating to compressor fridges but for those of us with old trailers without solar and dual batteries, and no desire or time to add them, this is unfortunate. I would get those items on a new build.

I hope my new refer lasts as long as my 19 year old original. It worked well for us.

Amazon has some in stock and Camping World has a few in stock in selected stores. For example one in Oregon and one in Utah.

[Thane]

I called Dometic today, because yesterday their website said these were discontinued and you could not put one in your cart, but today there is no mention of being discontinued and they can be put in your cart.

The Dometic rep confirmed they are discontinued and said the webpage now links your cart to a dealer that has one in stock.

[Jon in AZ]

Sad to see the choices slowly disappearing. They already discontinued their smallest 1.9CF model used in 13' Scamps, as well as smaller tent trailers and truck campers, several years ago. This size is common and affects a lot more RV models. Modern electric 12V compressor fridges do work well, but- as you say- they require an upgrade in power generation and storage for off-grid use. I also don't think they'll last as long as the older propane fridges without electronics, many of which remain in service for two to three decades.

The 1.9CF also remained visible on their website for some time after it was no longer available.

[Sunnyfalls]

They discontinued the 4 CF unit a couple years ago that was the Castia OEM refrigerator for many years. Fortunately, these absorption refrigerators are simple devices and are relatively easy to rebuild and repair as long as OEM parts remain available:

https://coolfunrv.com/product/rm2351...-cooling-unit/

And even without OEM parts, they can be rebuilt for little cost using commonly available materials if one has the knowledge, skills and inclination. Sure wish I had a dollar for every sailboat absorption refrigerator that I rebuilt and recharged in some remote harbor in my wasted youth.

Gayle & Bob
"Los Gatos Casita"

[thrifty bill]

Good riddance. Compressor fridges are so much more efficient, hold temp better. I keep a nice dual compartment fridge in my truck, ~60L, low priced on Amazon.

[Sunnyfalls]

Compressor refrigerators require a larger power footprint which takes up space, adds weight, increases expense and increases fire risk. For those of us who mostly dry camp and prefer comfort, convenience and practically over big and wow factor, absorption refrigerators get the job done very well. If you are big and mostly have hookups, compressor refrigerators are probably the better choice.

Gayle & Bob
"Los Gatos Casita"

[Jon in AZ]

Modern 12V compressor fridges require more power than a propane fridge, yes, but depending on the size of the fridge, ambient temperatures, and solar exposure, I have heard of people getting by continuously off grid with as little as 100AH of lithium battery storage and a single 100W solar panel.

Advantages include more stable fridge temps in changing ambient conditions and eliminating large openings in the shell. Disadvantages include initial cost and longevity. Both propane and 12V power carry fire risks if not installed, operated, and maintained properly, and there are also environmental pros and cons on both sides.

Bottom line, I don't think it's as one-sided a choice as some suggest. It's unfortunate that new buyers and rehabbers no longer have a choice.

[Sunnyfalls]

Definitely not one sided...there are cons/pros to both. Yep, we easily get by with a 100AH LIFEPO4 battery (our daily depletion less than 40AHs) and with 200 Watt solar panels, but that's with a 3CF absorption refrigerator. I haven't had the need to work the numbers on the 12VDC compressor refrigerators to make a definitive determination. However, I expect they would exhibit more noise in a small RV than our absorption refrigerator which is totally silent, but maybe not. And given they use a compressor, I would expect a much shorter lifetime too, but maybe not either. Insurance companies have recently started to add greater than 100 LiFePO4 battery restriction exclusion clauses to RV policies which could become problematic too.

Gayle & Bob
"Los Gatos Casita"

[computerspook]

Originally Posted by thrifty bill

Good riddance. Compressor fridges are so much more efficient, hold temp better. I keep a nice dual compartment fridge in my truck, ~60L, low priced on Amazon.

But can you run it on propane conveniently?

[computerspook]

I know in my case, when I'm actually camping I'm mostly running on AC. A lot of times the generator. But I sometimes go for quite a ways before I stop. And the 12 volt part of my absorption gets its use. Especially doing a response I have run for 33 hours straight , dual driving, before we stopped.

That what I'm on site I'm generally running a generator. If I'm wearing the camper is. But there are times where it sits for a while without me there. And I really don't want to generater running that long without me there.

Everybody seems to be so thrilled with solar and lithium batteries. But I worry about that a lot. I used to work where they tested lithium batteries. And in testing they would trigger failures. And in some of the cases in the failures the battery would go "high order", which would mean it exploded. And exploded with great enthusiasm. I know sometimes with batteries the size that people are using today, or smaller, they would shatter the test room wall. And that was made of cement block with rebar and filled with concrete. Now my job didn't involve the testing I was doing other work at that place. So I'm not an expert. But in talking to the expert they told me that the battery on a Tesla if it ever did go high order would explode with more Force then took down the federal building in Oklahoma.

No I don't know what it really took to make things like that happen. And the technology may have gotten better. But I'm not totally sure of that.

I have noticed that one of the big problems right now in rebuilding in California is they have large areas they can't let people back into anymore. And that is because when the people evacuated they left their electric cars behind. And before they left the people back in they have to remove the electric card which has to be done with a very delicate process that reminds me of explosive ordinance disposal. So they certainly think there's a problem with current cars that many of what they're dealing with here are current models.

And in California once they get the car secured and turned over so they can remove the battery and then remove the battery and put it in proper shipping; they end up taking it to a storage area. And one of the steps there is to discharge the batteries all the way and that involves placing them in big containers of water. But then boil for days. But then when they get all of this done they have a bunch of batteries/chemicals but nobody's really sure how to dispose of.

But that's kind of a little ways away from the subject of this thread. But it is why when I needed to replace my refrigerator I actually did decide I was going to stick with a generator and an absorption unit with propane.

[hwdornbush]

There has been mention of fire danger with lithium batteries. Trailers use lithium iron phosphate LiFePo batteries which do not burn or explode. They are not nearly as dangerous as lithium ion batteries used in electric cars

[CarlD]

Absorption fridges have there place. Personally I will never have another one! I have owned numerous Servel and rv units. A friend was killed by his fridge. We had white smoke coming out of ours once. They do require regular maintenance! Small rv units work great if it is not too hot. You have to keep an and eye on your contents. A thermometer is a necessity IMHO. The cost of solar panels, LFP batteries (which are a lot safer than some would lead you believe) and associated electronics are not prohibitively expensive any more. My newly built 10 foot overlanding camper is designed for dry camping (or boondocking as most people call it). (600 watts solar, 230 Ah LFP, compressor fridge, 2000 watt inverter, induction cooktop, air conditioner). No maintenance, except cleaning off the solar panels once in a while. It's easy to see why manufacturers are modernizing. As Bob Dylan said "The times they are a-changin".

The camper is just more stuff my heirs will inherit and it was fun to design and build.

[computerspook]

Originally Posted by hwdornbush

There has been mention of fire danger with lithium batteries. Trailers use lithium iron phosphate LiFePo batteries which do not burn or explode. They are not nearly as dangerous as lithium ion batteries used in electric cars

I know that my small LiFePo batteries that I use for functions where weight is an issue came with some pretty serious warnings about fire and explosion risks. Don't know it that is an issue or a lawyer type warning for covering corporate butts. Do know that people seem to think that one is not supposed to question them because they are part of the green push. The politically correct seems to be outweighing the correct in most things today and I can't figure out if that is the case with these batteries or not.


I have noticed that there is a politically correct claim about recycling both of these style batteries that is using information about the recycling of lead acid batteries and the ability to recycle the component parts of these batteries without any consideration of the lack of a way to separate them into these component parts. Currently they are being completely discharged and then sent to sealed hazmat dumps for disposable and not recycled. But that is not supposed to be something we notice.

[CarlD]

I have watched some videos of punctured LFP batteries and lead batteries catching fire. I have also had a lead acid battery explode in my van (hydrogen gas is explosive!), but there was no fire. We had a lead acid battery recycling plant near us. They gave away a lot of milk at that place because it apparently reduces the effects of lead poisoning. I have read that there are efforts to recycle LFP batteries underway. Both batteries contain stuff you don't want to interact with, but I'll take LFP batteries over lead acid any day due to the energy density, weight, lack of maintenance and longevity. When it comes right down to it, the safest thing to do is don't have batteries but what fun would that be.

[computerspook]

Originally Posted by CarlD

I have watched some videos of punctured LFP batteries and lead batteries catching fire. I have also had a lead acid battery explode in my van (hydrogen gas is explosive!), but there was no fire. We had a lead acid battery recycling plant near us. They gave away a lot of milk at that place because it apparently reduces the effects of lead poisoning. I have read that there are efforts to recycle LFP batteries underway. Both batteries contain stuff you don't want to interact with, but I'll take LFP batteries over lead acid any day due to the energy density, weight, lack of maintenance and longevity. When it comes right down to it, the safest thing to do is don't have batteries but what fun would that be.

The explosion of the hydrogen from a lead acid is nothing compared to even low order from the lithium batteries which were being tested where I worked. (I did their computers and networking) A battery about the size of a car battery would shatter cement blocks feet away. I have had a lead acid battery hhydro explosion happen about 2-3 foot from me and got some first degree acid burns and it hurt like heck. But the explosions I saw the result of from a lithium would have like literally obliterated my head in the same situation. Big difference.


The recycling of these batteries reminds me of fusion power. I can remember popular science articles in the 1970s on how we would have commercial fusion power in 2-3 years in the 1970s. H ave seen those articles pretty much every year or two since then. We still don't have it. The federal government has been using lithium batteries for like forever. They have spent literally billions on trying to find a way to recycle them, and have been doing that researching that since before the 1990s. And like commercial fusion that has been going to happen in a couple years since about then.


There are some really good reasons that this is a much bigger problem than recycling lead acid batteries.


As for the milk. Does not surprise me. Back when I was a welder they used to give us milk if we were welding galvanized (zinc) to get that our of our systems as they absorbed it. Must of worked I know my doctor has been complaining my zinc level is now too low ;-)


By the way a properly designed lead acid battery will last a long time too. They don't design them that way any more. We have a 1950s battery on one tractor that was original equipment. I was still good in the 1980s. Now every about 5 years you had to desulfide it. Simple process. Remove the battery. Totally discharge it. Charge it up backwards and cycle it four or five times. Totally discharge it and charge it up the right direction and you were good for another 5 years. But that was with metal lead plates. You also used to have to check it and add distilled water to it regularly. Let the level get down below the top of the plates and the battery was done for. They use ceramic lead compounds that use less lead now to make the batteries lighter. And you can't do this process with them.


But they both have problems for sure.

[Sunnyfalls]

Originally Posted by hwdornbush

There has been mention of fire danger with lithium batteries. Trailers use lithium iron phosphate LiFePo batteries which do not burn or explode. They are not nearly as dangerous as lithium ion batteries used in electric cars

All true, but not nearly as dangerous doesn’t mean they are safe. The FAA doesn’t allow LiFePO4 batteries in the cargo hold of airplanes because their fires can't be extinguished. Risk increases with increasing AHs. Risk can always be managed/mitigated to some extent and people have different risk comfort levels...with a good insurance policy providing financial protection.

Gayle & Bob
"Los Gatos Casita"

[computerspook]

Originally Posted by hwdornbush

There has been mention of fire danger with lithium batteries. Trailers use lithium iron phosphate LiFePo batteries which do not burn or explode. They are not nearly as dangerous as lithium ion batteries used in electric cars

I can find videos of people claiming to have them do both. Now not nearly what I saw in the test center. But one guy was able to get a fire of over 800F.

[Joy A]

so I have had my new AC/DC compressor refrigerator since last October and I love it. I added a 175 W solar panel to the roof of my 13 Scamp because I didn't and don't want to fool with having to put the panel out at every stop. I also changed to a 100 lithium battery. This little refrigerator takes half the juice on DC as did the three-way absorption refrigerator. My battery sits at 13.2 hardly budging using this new refrigerator. The difference between the two refrigerators is that the absorbtion refrigerator runs constantly off of DC where the compressor kicks on and off when needed. as far as the footprint for this little refrigerator the opening had to be made maybe a quarter inch to a half inch bigger and that's it. It fits perfectly depth wise into the cabinet. Yes, you can hear the little compressor running, but that's only at night time when it's really quiet and it is not that annoying, it's far quieter than any of the furnaces around.

Oh yes, and I now have a freezer compartment which makes life far easier for a meat eater like me. The only thing is, is that I dont't have to shop for meat as often and the biggest thing is Remembering to take somegthing out to thaw for the next day.

By the way the panel ran around $300 including cable and brackets, $200 for the lithium 100 battery and $90 for the new Victron smart solar controller. Installation is very straight forward.

[computerspook]

Ok the idea of an absorbtion frig and dc, is that dc is for when you're on the road. Then when you're camping you're supposed to be using AC or the propane. You'll notice the propane has a thermostat and the AC has a thermostat and the DC does not. Frankly the DC is, yes, always on and the thing is that it's less effective. It isn't really supposed to keep up with the amount of loss of cold. But it is supposed to come close to that, so that when you have a long drive your food is still cold in the fridge when you get there.

At one point you weren't supposed to have the propane on when you're on the road. And there have been safety issues with it over time. But they kind of ignore that now. The large absorption refrigerators mostly didn't have a DC option because they usually had enouday mass if you could travel all day without the food getting warm. So the DC option is supposed to be a way to avoid using propane when you're moving and don't have access to AC.

So if you're using the DC option while sitting as your primary means of making it work, yeah it's supposed to be on all the time. And it's supposed to like let your refrigerator get kind of warm over time. Always remember to use the right tool in the right place.

[Joy A]

\\ell that's true I was comparing DC/DC use but to add propane to my comments I will just say that it's nice not to have to worry about that little tiny flame blowing out. I had not run my 3way fridge on DC for some twenty years. Early on I put the fridge on DC while traveling and found that when I got to my destination my battery was drained. Consequently I always ran it on propane but then the flame would blow out.
Just saying it is nice now not to worry about either of those issues. Plus my propane bottle last a lot longer.

Just thought of an added benefit of the new fridge, you don't have to worry so much about leveling the trailer for it. You might want to for your equilibrium, though.