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Old 03-05-2020, 07:34 PM   #41
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Name: Pat
Trailer: Escape 2013 19 ft
California
Posts: 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScribeWithAStylus View Post
Carol & Mike,
You mentioned "There was some discussion about preventing the pipes from freezing while in transit from northern cold to southern warm, but that is different from camping in the cold. One owner left his Ollie stored in below freezing weather without winterizing and the outside shower froze." See the next quote by:

"Name: Bruce & Kathryn
Trailer: Bigfoot 25 RQ" who said
"We loved our Ollie but our Bigfoot is much cozier in cold weather. Hardly any condensation in Bigfoot versus a fair amount in our Oliver. Bigfoot is better insulated. Our experience of two years in each, snow and sun."

I asked the Oliver saleslady about adding additional insulation in the form of either 1 additional inch - R Value 3.9 or 1.69 inches - R Value 5.2. She checked and was told this was not possible. She was told that the Oliver had Reflectix on the inside of the outside hull and Reflectix on the outside of the inner hull. She was told that the reflectix plus the air gap between the hulls constituted the only insulation and that this totalled to R18.

Given that Reflectix is primarily a reflective of infrared and not a direct insulator, that R value for the air gap appears high. (This is based on discussions on insulating Sprinters and other Class B's on the Sprinter Forum and the Class B forums.) Do you know of any way (other then at construction time) to add insulation to the inside of the outer hull of an Oliver or is the air gap the only insulation possible? Is there no room between the hulls to add the 1.09 inch or 1.65 inch Thinsulate.

I read a blog by another Oliver owner who said that while it was a nice trailer, it did not have enough room for his particular form of travel and living. He said that his had only 0.5 inch of Thinsulate or R-2.

My wife is highly sensitive to cold and we would prefer not to run a heater between the hulls at all times that it is below freezing. Since the Oliver has solar, we would like to be able to leave the solar collecting solar power and heating itself during the winter so that we can leave the trailer for 8 hours a day and come back to a warm trailer in the afternoon. Otherwise, we would have to camp only where we have external power. We do not want to be periodically winterizing it. Do you have any suggestions on what to order to improve the insulation? We would be camping in it for between 2 and 7 months a year.

We were told by one Oliver owner that they have a below mattress item that prevents condensation in the mattress and that Oliver now sells the equivalent as a standard option. The condensation did not cause them other problems in their Oliver.

The Bigfoot seems a bit far from Virginia to be a good alternative. Tennessee is a lot closer.

The most insulated trailer seems to be the key to minimizing heating needs so this series of posts seems to be very useful in helping analyze?

Walk in His Peace,
Scribe with a Stylus
Having installed Reflex in our studio at home way before our trailer , the installation instructions call for a 3/4 in air space which I did because I installed in our ceiling of the studio . I did wood boards in ceiling instead of drywall . Also I have sat in a Oliver a couple of times and it was very hot at the time 90s at least . The lady did not have the air on or fans . We had just the door open and I couldn’t believe how nice it was . Not so in my Escape , it is horrible unless you move the air and you need ac . I also like that the Oliver is only 7 ft wide . The Bigfoot is wider but it to is a excellent trailer .
My Escape is 7 wide and with my big f250 do not need and extra mirrors . Pat
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Old 03-05-2020, 07:49 PM   #42
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Name: Mike
Trailer: Oliver Elite II
Boerne, Texas
Posts: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScribeWithAStylus View Post
Carol & Mike,
You mentioned "There was some discussion about preventing the pipes from freezing while in transit from northern cold to southern warm, but that is different from camping in the cold. One owner left his Ollie stored in below freezing weather without winterizing and the outside shower froze." See the next quote by:

"Name: Bruce & Kathryn
Trailer: Bigfoot 25 RQ" who said
"We loved our Ollie but our Bigfoot is much cozier in cold weather. Hardly any condensation in Bigfoot versus a fair amount in our Oliver. Bigfoot is better insulated. Our experience of two years in each, snow and sun."

I asked the Oliver saleslady about adding additional insulation in the form of either 1 additional inch - R Value 3.9 or 1.69 inches - R Value 5.2. She checked and was told this was not possible. She was told that the Oliver had Reflectix on the inside of the outside hull and Reflectix on the outside of the inner hull. She was told that the reflectix plus the air gap between the hulls constituted the only insulation and that this totalled to R18.

Given that Reflectix is primarily a reflective of infrared and not a direct insulator, that R value for the air gap appears high. (This is based on discussions on insulating Sprinters and other Class B's on the Sprinter Forum and the Class B forums.) Do you know of any way (other then at construction time) to add insulation to the inside of the outer hull of an Oliver or is the air gap the only insulation possible? Is there no room between the hulls to add the 1.09 inch or 1.65 inch Thinsulate.

I read a blog by another Oliver owner who said that while it was a nice trailer, it did not have enough room for his particular form of travel and living. He said that his had only 0.5 inch of Thinsulate or R-2.

My wife is highly sensitive to cold and we would prefer not to run a heater between the hulls at all times that it is below freezing. Since the Oliver has solar, we would like to be able to leave the solar collecting solar power and heating itself during the winter so that we can leave the trailer for 8 hours a day and come back to a warm trailer in the afternoon. Otherwise, we would have to camp only where we have external power. We do not want to be periodically winterizing it. Do you have any suggestions on what to order to improve the insulation? We would be camping in it for between 2 and 7 months a year.

We were told by one Oliver owner that they have a below mattress item that prevents condensation in the mattress and that Oliver now sells the equivalent as a standard option. The condensation did not cause them other problems in their Oliver.

The Bigfoot seems a bit far from Virginia to be a good alternative. Tennessee is a lot closer.

The most insulated trailer seems to be the key to minimizing heating needs so this series of posts seems to be very useful in helping analyze?

Walk in His Peace,
Scribe with a Stylus
If you are going to camp in cold weather with no hookups, you have an on board propane heater to keep the trailer warm. We have dry camped in very cold weather and the propane heater did a fine job keeping us warm. The solar will keep the batteries topped off provided you have some sun.

There is not enough space between the upper hulls for 1” insulation. You could add insulation between the bottom hulls that you can access. We haven’t seen the need to do that.

We have not had an issue with condensation. I know some have, it may be about ventilation, not sure. I know Bruce was an Oliver owner but likes his Bigfoot more. We’ve looked at the 25RQ and like it, it’s a nice trailer. It has a queen bed, bigger dinette, dry bath and bigger tanks. It does well in cold weather, like the Oliver. Between Oliver and Bigfoot, I’d go with whichever one has the features you like. There’s a Bigfoot dealer in NC and one in GA, so distance shouldn’t be a factor. Hope this helps. Mike
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Old 03-05-2020, 07:51 PM   #43
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Name: Gnuu
Trailer: Sprinter
Virginia
Posts: 15
LindaandPat,
Thank you for the tips. How is your studio in the Winter? and have you had an opportunity to compare your Escape and the oliver in Winter?

Your comments on the air gap may be why Oliver does not want to install additional insulation. If it takes 3/4" air gap and they have two separate layers of Reflectix on the two hulls, that may be why there is no room left. However, users of Reflectix on Sprinters have noted that it is much better at reflecting heat during the day then at night and that it does not work as well in the winter as it does in the summer.

It is good to hear that it works so well on hot days, that means that we probably do not have to worry about the summers. The Oliver owners we met do not travel in the Winter and have their Oliver winterized and stored.

Again, thank you for the feedback. Every bit helps as we go towards a decision.

Walk in His Peace,
Scribe With A Stylus.
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Old 03-05-2020, 07:56 PM   #44
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Name: Elliott
Trailer: Bigfoot
Everywhere
Posts: 302
You're right about the Reflectix - it's definitely not even vaguely close to R18 in that application. At best it's R7.2, but I suspect having a second layer of radiant barrier on the other side of the air gap actually makes it worse rather than better, so maybe R-5 for the interior occupants and possibly more like 1-2 for the pipes. They do at least have that airgap though, unlike Scamp who sandwiches Reflectix between layers where it's R1.1 at best then claims R-15.

In terms of Bigfoot, they're actually sold through dealers rather than factory-direct. IMO not necessarily a good thing, but it does mean your travel distance would be a lot shorter than BC. There's dealers in GA, NC, and FL: Factory Outlets - Bigfoot RV - Truck Campers & Travel Trailers - Recreational Vehicle Manufacturer
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Old 03-05-2020, 08:44 PM   #45
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Name: Pat
Trailer: Escape 2013 19 ft
California
Posts: 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScribeWithAStylus View Post
LindaandPat,
Thank you for the tips. How is your studio in the Winter? and have you had an opportunity to compare your Escape and the oliver in Winter?

Your comments on the air gap may be why Oliver does not want to install additional insulation. If it takes 3/4" air gap and they have two separate layers of Reflectix on the two hulls, that may be why there is no room left. However, users of Reflectix on Sprinters have noted that it is much better at reflecting heat during the day then at night and that it does not work as well in the winter as it does in the summer.

It is good to hear that it works so well on hot days, that means that we probably do not have to worry about the summers. The Oliver owners we met do not travel in the Winter and have their Oliver winterized and stored.

Again, thank you for the feedback. Every bit helps as we go towards a decision.

Walk in His Peace,
Scribe With A Stylus.
The studio is pretty nice but our winter temps are not extreme down to low 30 ‘s . We also have dual pane windows with regular insulation in walls ( pink stuff ) we also have a little heater if needed .
I can tell you the Oliver we sat in were very comfortable with the heat outside . I would say if insulated for heat will work the opposite in cold ( keep you warm ) another thing we like on the Oliver is the heat is ducted in the bath . Sure wish we had that in our Escape .
Both the Oliver and Bigfoot are excellent trailers and both have differences .
It depends what is important to you . I would make a comparison sheet between both trailers . Everything . Bigfoot is more traditional looking but Oliver is more boat looking that you is clean looking and you decorate . Both are the top of the list for fiberglass . So we can’t change at this point of life but I would love either trailer . Really it comes down to what you like .hope this helps you but it is your decision . Pat
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Old 03-06-2020, 05:57 AM   #46
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Trailer: 2008 Scamp 13 S1
Arizona
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScribeWithAStylus View Post
The Bigfoot seems a bit far from Virginia to be a good alternative. Tennessee is a lot closer.
Bigfoot is sold through dealers. It’s a pretty small network, but I believe there’s one in Georgia. Not so far.
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Old 03-06-2020, 06:12 AM   #47
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Name: Bruce & Kathryn
Trailer: Bigfoot 25 RQ
North Carolina
Posts: 110
Both Oliver and Bigfoot are great trailers. We just returned from a 4 week Florida trip with friends who have an Oliver, bought when we bought ours. It was fun traveling with both trailers. Each seemed to attract their own audience of interested parties. In one campground, Myakka River, we had an Escape, Casita, Scamp, Oliver and Bigfoot in the same loop! I think all of us were enjoying our camping experience.
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Old 03-18-2020, 02:20 PM   #48
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Mississippi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Defenestrator View Post
...but the Oliver's pipes are in the middle of the conditioned space and not fully "inside", which can cause some problems when it gets well below freezing....

We've owned two different Oliver's over the past 12 years. The ONLY time your stated "problems" would occur would be if there were NO heat at all in the trailer. The between hull spaces are heated by the furnace and/or the water heater. I have four temperature sensors mounted in this space (two fore, two aft) the temps consistently stay within 15 degrees of the cabin. I've not heard any of the owners ever complain of this situation.
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Old 03-18-2020, 02:31 PM   #49
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Trailer: 2019 2ndG Escape21 DeJa View pulled by 2014 Dodge Ram Hemi Sport
Pennsylvania
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There is a reason there are wheels on a travel trailer, if uncomfortable you move it. If unable to move it you use it but winterize it. Even if you have a 4 season camper, it will not do any good when most cg open only offer electric as running water is not available in very cold climates, thus you are limited to electric only hook ups, no water, no sewerage. As long as you have electric you have supplemental heat for your on board heater and you can survive the coldest weather.
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Old 03-20-2020, 09:38 PM   #50
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Name: Fredrick
Trailer: Escape 21C
Tennessee
Posts: 317
21 layout completed photos, incl options

Our completed E-21 [std floorplan] awaits us on pickup day late next month.. in Chilliwack. WE are just hoping the coming of warmer weather helps shut down this Beer Flu mess soon!
Upholstery is stain-free, synthetic "Jute", to go w the chosen Maple Interior. Sink is larger option Holly & I wanted..drop-shipped to BC from Home Depot last fall. TV mount, to be attached on forward bulkhead, driver side...just aft of foot of bed. We opted for a Skyworth, 19" LED TV/DVD combo, ordered from RoadTrucker.. The same size as we had in our Casita and light & easy to move or store away (in its provided box)while traveling. Even has a separate stand if we need to move it to the rear dinette "flip-up" [if someone wants to sleep up forward while TV is on]. . We are really not much for TV watching..just weather, news and movie-DVDs, if weather keeps us aboard. Figgered it had dozens of great reviews and if it could withstand running in 18 wheelers, it wd do in an Escape ;-) All in all, for US: Perfect 3-season trailer for us "3-season campers". WE have named her "Social Distance" in honor of the current mess.
And..no..I do not know where the propane cover is..I expect ETI has plenty of them around.
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Old 03-21-2020, 04:34 AM   #51
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Name: Bruce & Kathryn
Trailer: Bigfoot 25 RQ
North Carolina
Posts: 110
That is a beautiful interior, hope you get to enjoy it soon! We’re still finalizing a 3 month trip from NC to Washington and Idaho. Hard to know if a mid-May departure is likely. I look forward to camping again in any brand of trailer....
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Old 03-21-2020, 07:16 AM   #52
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Trailer: Casita SD
Tennessee
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Very attractive, congrats!
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Old 03-21-2020, 10:20 AM   #53
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Name: Fredrick
Trailer: Escape 21C
Tennessee
Posts: 317
Trip to ID & WA

We had planned to stop & see lots of NPs and 'attractions' on the way out and back to WA to pick up our new trailer.....now with the hullabaloo about the "beer flu" we may lose many of the reservations at the AirBnBs we made for the trip TO WA..and who knows about CGs on the way home. At least coming home we will be carrying our home with us! Sheesh.
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Old 03-21-2020, 10:42 AM   #54
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Name: Shelby
Trailer: Casita SD
Tennessee
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You'll have beautiful scenery even if the parks are closed! Be careful, would be a bummer to get sick while on the road.
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Old 03-21-2020, 11:26 AM   #55
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Name: Amy
Trailer: currently shopping
Ohio
Posts: 3
We hope to view a Escape 5.0 and a Scamp 5th wheel. I have contacted Escape for local 5.0 but We are waiting until this coronavirus business is over so that may be months to contact owners. We really like the Escape 5.0 but need to see one before we buy (order). We don't camp in the winter. But insulation is a plus for cooling in the summer.
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Old 03-26-2020, 01:34 AM   #56
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Name: Aaron
Trailer: 2000 Bigfoot 21RB, & 92 Vanagon Westy
Idaho
Posts: 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Outlaw View Post
We've owned two different Oliver's over the past 12 years. The ONLY time your stated "problems" would occur would be if there were NO heat at all in the trailer. The between hull spaces are heated by the furnace and/or the water heater. I have four temperature sensors mounted in this space (two fore, two aft) the temps consistently stay within 15 degrees of the cabin. I've not heard any of the owners ever complain of this situation.
I think the point was that a lot of energy is lost heating the space between the layers. Sure you can keep the pipes from freezing, but that is true in a scamp as well, it just takes running the furnace more.

As Olivers are heating the space between the shells, a space that has the same isolation as that found in scamps, the furnace has to work harder than that found in a Bigfoot.

I have not been in an Oliver, but I have noticed from video walkthroughs that the space between the shells is not sealed in anyway, and that it is open to the rest of the living space by means of the cabinet doors. I don't know exactly how much, if any, it would effect the R value, but I assume it would lower it.

I have not used my Bigfoot in that low of temperatures, just down to 17 F. The space under the bed (the location of the fresh water tank) was only 10 degrees lower than the rest of the compartment while running the furnace. This was with the door closed and as such not heated directly.
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