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Old 04-15-2013, 10:40 AM   #61
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Value to me falls somewhere along a cost vs. perceived benefit curve. At some point there is a “knee” in the curve where the cost just goes up without adding any perceived benefit to ME. Perhaps wristwatches serve as an example. Rolexes are exorbitantly expensive without doing the job of telling time better than the Citizen watch I currently wear for a fraction of the cost. I paid more for a watch model to get a more accurate watch but once I had a level of comfort in the accuracy, there is no increase in value to ME to pay for the Rolex.

In the case of trailers, Escapes may be better in some ways but not in ways I’d be willing to spend extra money for. It won’t help me camp “better” and I’m not interested in any better resale than I have now.

And customization is a double edged sword. After someone has yanked out the bath and range and dyed the carpeting pink (the Mary Kay Limited Edition!) that trailer has lost all value to me!

Everyone lays out the benefit axis according to whatever floats their boat.
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Old 04-15-2013, 10:59 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by floyd View Post
Full circle back to the original question Why Escape?....
Nice trailer if you can tow it, and it helps make an oversized tow vehicle look proportionate.
Hummm lets see now......

Casita 17' Liberty _______ Escape 17'
length 17' _____________ 17' 8"
Height 8' 11"____________ 8' 1"
Dry Weight 2480lbs ______ 2100lbs
Dry Hitch Weight 365lbs _____ 250lbs

Which one Floyd do you think needs the "oversized" or bigger/more tow cap tug to pull it?
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Old 04-15-2013, 11:03 AM   #63
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Having just sold our ParkLiner, we made some interesting observations as we showed it to perspective buyers. Since we also have an Escape 19ft., those who were interested could look at both and compare them for themselves. It all comes down to personal preferences! Some liked the look of the ParkLiner better (the fiberglass cabinets, the openness, etc.) and some liked the look of the Escape better (the lack of fiberglass cabinets, the floor plan/arrangement). After looking at both trailers, some of the folks decided they would purchase an Escape. Others looked at both and decided they preferred ParkLiner trailers.
The fit and finish on the Escape is far better than the ParkLiner! There is no doubt about that. No comparison there. But that is not a priority for everyone. The fit and finish on a Bigfoot trailer is also superior to most trailers, not to mention the space inside; we just felt we would need a pick-up in order to pull one (due to their width) so Escape works better for us. We would love it if our Escape had an all wood finish; can't argue with that point! Would we be willing to pay an additional $3,000 (as those who purchase a Deluxe Scamp do in order to get this look)? I don't think so. If that is a top priority for some, then a Scamp is the way to go. We have owned many different trailers over the years including stick-built, Bigfoot, Airstream, in addition to three Escape trailers and our ParkLiner. They all had their advantages (and disadvantages).

(We also found it interesting that our gas mileage was the same towing our 15ft. ParkLiner as it was towing our 19ft. Escape. We tow with a V8 4-Runner.)

Rather than argue about which molded fiberglass is "the best," all I can say is that based on my own personal preferences and my own personal experience (and my husband agrees!), Escape trailers are by far our first choice in a camping trailer. We are glad that there are lots of options out there and hope for success in all of the newer molded fiberglass trailer companies.

Happy trails!
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Old 04-15-2013, 11:32 AM   #64
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I worked for almost an equal to Escape but it was in the high-end 5th wheel. I heard the same exact reasons for making a purchase which was costing them a considerable amount of money more. This thread along with another entitled "Going to the Other Side" has made us rethink what we want and need. I think that a lot of people can't put themselves in the shoes of the other guy/gal. We started looking at the smaller trailers hoping to downsize our tow vehicle (a 1993 Ford Club Wagon, a beauty in metallic grey and smokey blue with about 140,000 miles, tow capacity 5500 lbs - built like a tank and paid for eons ago) but have realized that we need that much capacity to travel without worrying about climbing the next mountain. So, no new vehicle really needed. Yeah, gas mileage but we would only move 2 or 3 times a year at tops. I am very thrifty, not cheap but I get value for every dollar. Parting with that much cash for a trailer at this point doesn't make sense. I'm not interested in resale because that is a hard one to call not to mention the sales tax, personal property tax and the cost of insurance compared to what we have now. So, this has been helpful. So, we will probably look for used (spend the money on camping fees and tourist attractions later on), some eye-catching classic like the house we just bought, one of those 1929 Sears catalog houses and the beauty of wood and craftsmanship can't be described in words. Thank you for your insight.
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Old 04-15-2013, 05:44 PM   #65
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just looking

I recently stopped by Escape and made it clear I was just looking and still got treated royaly.
i got to look at several models and the thought that went into the design is amazing.
We could not really find any wasted space and the fit and finish is very good. They still spent their time with us answered all our questions and gave us sound advice.

We really like them now .... we just need to save up and decide if we get a new tug and the 19 or 5.0 or just get a 17.....
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Old 04-15-2013, 06:13 PM   #66
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Alan I think you have hit the nail on the head as to why people who have dealt with Escape feel good about recommending them to others. Customer service first and foremost and you dont need to have ever bought a trailer from them to get treated well.

A lot of people from around here take various makes & ages of fiberglass trailers to them for repairs and all the ones I know of that have used them have come away very happy customers. This past summer at a vintage rally down south I meet a nice young family with a really nicely done up older Trillium. They made it very clear that although they had done some of the work most of the work had been done by Escape & they had done far more than they had ever dreamed of or asked for and were VERY happy customers. There is a lot to be said for that. A company could never buy the kind of advertising they have gotten from just that one trailer & word of mouth that followed. We seem to be living in a day and age where we don't often come away from a place we have gone to for service feeling good about how it went.
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Old 04-15-2013, 06:50 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carol H View Post
Hummm lets see now......

Casita 17' Liberty _______ Escape 17'
length 17' _____________ 17' 8"
Height 8' 11"____________ 8' 1"
Dry Weight 2480lbs ______ 2100lbs
Dry Hitch Weight 365lbs _____ 250lbs

Which one Floyd do you think needs the "oversized" or bigger/more tow cap tug to pull it?
Yep! that's one of 'em!
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Old 04-15-2013, 06:55 PM   #68
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Floyd,

I don't have a clue what your point is.

baglo
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Old 04-16-2013, 06:36 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by floyd View Post
Full circle back to the original question Why Escape?....
Nice trailer if you can tow it, and it helps make an oversized tow vehicle look proportionate.
And I remember when you used to argue that compact pick-ups could tow just as much as full-sized ones! What made you change your mind?
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Old 04-16-2013, 06:57 AM   #70
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And I remember when you used to argue that compact pick-ups could tow just as much as full-sized ones! What made you change your mind?
I've only been here a year or so, but I don't remember Floyd making that statement. Since it is all recorded here, perhaps you could provide a link to his statement.
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Old 04-16-2013, 11:50 AM   #71
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LOL Tom you are a newbie! LOL - pretty sure if one takes the time to look back over the years you will find a few examples of what Ray has mentioned. But you want links here is one for you. New to Tow Vehicle Ford note post #5 which reads in part:

Originally Posted by Floyd.

"It is so difficult sometimes for people to understand that not everybody wants an oversized truck, especially since a Ranger can be outfitted to outtow a fullsized V6 truck and even an occasional V8 fullsized truck.
My Ranger has the same transmission and rear axle as it's contemporary fullsized truck and more horsepower and torque than the fullsized V6 offering. The regular cab has more head and leg room as well...All that and the fun of driving a decent sized truck and the ability to access the box!"


Sorry Floyd!! Just couldnt help myself!
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Old 04-16-2013, 12:20 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by Daniel A. View Post
I place Escape just below Bigfoot.
My reason is the extra space inside.

Bottom line is anything Fiberglass will last, the other makers are fine in my book.
Nothing like being warm and dry in spring or fall.

I think your all nice people even if you don't have a Bigfoot.
Does a size 12 shoe count?
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Old 04-16-2013, 12:26 PM   #73
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Thats pretty well how they stack up for me as well but I would add one more:

Oxygen - Coolest looking!


Oh, I thought the rates were based on newer models, but if were gonna get into vintage out of production glass trailers,

I would have to say that the Wilerby would win coolest looking in my book! Don't get me wrong, I think "Oxygens" are pretty cool looking too! But the Wilerby makes my cool meter, red line............
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Old 04-16-2013, 01:20 PM   #74
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Oh, I thought the rates were based on newer models, but if were gonna get into vintage out of production glass trailers,

I would have to say that the Wilerby would win coolest looking in my book! Don't get me wrong, I think "Oxygens" are pretty cool looking too! But the Wilerby makes my cool meter, red line............
Oh so do I but I have never seen one in person and suspect few of us ever will! just kept my chooses to the ones there was half a chance of actually owning!
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Old 04-16-2013, 02:13 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by Carol H View Post
LOL Tom you are a newbie! LOL - pretty sure if one takes the time to look back over the years you will find a few examples of what Ray has mentioned. But you want links here is one for you. New to Tow Vehicle Ford note post #5 which reads in part:

Originally Posted by Floyd.

"It is so difficult sometimes for people to understand that not everybody wants an oversized truck, especially since a Ranger can be outfitted to outtow a fullsized V6 truck and even an occasional V8 fullsized truck.
My Ranger has the same transmission and rear axle as it's contemporary fullsized truck and more horsepower and torque than the fullsized V6 offering. The regular cab has more head and leg room as well...All that and the fun of driving a decent sized truck and the ability to access the box!"


Sorry Floyd!! Just couldnt help myself!
No apology needed, It's nice to have a decent sized truck to pull a decent sized trailer, That is the point of the smaller fiberglass trailers and the Ranger.

Ray's apparent assertion that every TV aught to tow at it's limit, is his , not mine. Maybe that too comes from reading Consumer Reports?

Having an oversized trailer, pulled by an oversized truck, is a problem. Having more power and capacity in a package fit to drive is not.
I simply prefer a TV which is fit to drive when not towing as well as when towing. I also like the ability to parallel park and access drive-up windows while towing.
Not wanting an oversized trailer comes from the same philosophy as not wanting an oversized truck.
I don't think I would want to tow a 19 Escape with my Ranger nor would I choose to pull a 19 Escape with the full sized truck described in my comment which you quoted out of context.
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Old 04-16-2013, 02:26 PM   #76
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I'm just laughing at this latest example of all things being relative...In my opinion, the Escape 19 IS an "oversized trailer"- and so's anything else over 2,000 pounds!

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Old 04-16-2013, 03:40 PM   #77
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Well that Francesca pretty well takes anything 16' and over off your list ;-)
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Old 04-16-2013, 04:03 PM   #78
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Depends on the age and added ca-ca...in Scamp's case, for example, pre-1990 16 footers weighed around 1400 pounds dry, putting them in the same weight class as my first-gen Trillium. I could easily keep gross weight at/near 2,000 pounds.

They seem to have gotten progressively heavier beginning in 1990 or so...all Scamp 16 footers are definitely not created equal, weight-wise.



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Old 04-16-2013, 04:54 PM   #79
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Francesca, your right they are not all the same - Scamps 16' side bath historically weighs a little less than other floor plans. Mine is a pretty basic 16' side bath, no ac, no microwave, oven or real wood in it & it has a small fridge ..... weighs in at 2450lb loaded for camping - one person, no water.

But the brochure that I was given along with the original order form for it states the 16' weighed 1500lbs dry plus a 120lb hitch weigh dry - total 1620lbs. The brochure although it was handed out in 92 in typical Scamp fashion it appears to be a little out of date - suspect by the photos of the tugs in it and dress of the people it was actually printed in the 80's. I also though have the actual order sheet which is dated 1991 and it shows only a 50lb total weight increase over what the brochure states for dry weight. The reality is that once you add a battery, full propane, a couple of overhead bins, stove top, fridge, toilet, hot water tank, rock guard etc - which you can be sure where not included in the dry weight advertised in the brochure the weight starts to climb fast - just as it does with all trailers today.

Personally would be surprised if there ever was a 16' Scamp that weighed in under 1500 lbs - even an empty one.
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Old 04-16-2013, 05:12 PM   #80
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LOL Francesca I just dug out the original Owner Manual issued with my 92 Scamp 16' it reads: "Weight Approx 1300lbs' "Hitch weight approx 120lbs" - note no mention of that being dry weight. As I said above not a chance it ever weighed that. LOL

Funny enough the manual also gives the weight for a 13' - it reads "Weight Fully Equipped: Approx 950 lbs" again in this situation they actually state fully equipped so its not a dry weight. Funny enough there isnt a 13' scamps on the real world weights under 1500 lbs - the lightest is 1620 lbs with most of the others closer to 2000lbs than 1500 lbs. I would be very surprised if all the 13' Scamps that have been weighed were all 90's or newer.
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