Lil Snoozy has closed shop - Page 2 - Fiberglass RV
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Old 03-05-2019, 07:45 AM   #21
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Chapter 7 is very much not good. I wouldn't count on getting much back on those deposits, unfortunately.
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Old 03-05-2019, 08:10 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by alan H View Post
I sure hope this turns out to be something like supply issues and that everyone is able to recoup their down payments
I am familiar with a fiberglass boat builder here in the Pacific Northwest and before they went out of business, they blamed much of it on "supply issues".

Basically, the suppliers refused to continue supplying because they had not been paid for the supplies that had already supplied.

Once, they had a big announcement on how they had changed to a new and better diesel engine. The only thing better was that the new supplier was willing to extend credit after the old one refused to do so. The original engine supplier as well as the "new" supplier never were paid for the product they had supplied.
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Old 03-05-2019, 09:03 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Dan-NS27 View Post
That's gotta be tough on anyone who was waiting. I was just reading about Chapter 7 filling, and doesn't sound good.

Thought this was interesting.


Hopefully those who had a deposit will get something back out of all this. Makes me wonder if the molds will be sold off because of this.

And with the molds, if they're sold off, there's a chance someone else could try building them again. I wonder who/where would sell/auction them from. I'm curious how much they would cost.
I’ve worked for several businessses who filed bankruptcy . My paychecks bounced , my taxes & SS were deducted from my check but never paid , my medical insurance lapsed . I stood in line with other creditors and only recovered a small percentage of my loss .

Many of these businesses got into a cash flow problem . They were owed money but we’re forced to borrow to pay day to day expenses . Eventually they couldn’t pay their loans , the interest or creditors and went under .
The last contractor I worked for got in this problem and sold off part of his business . He kept selling more and more parts until he lost control and then the new owner closed the business up . The employees , suppliers and customers took it in the shorts
Anytime I see this scenario , I try to run as fast as I can cause bankruptcy isn’t far behind .
You can’t recover your money if there’s no money left !!
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Old 03-05-2019, 09:16 AM   #24
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I am very sad to hear about this unfortunate situation for those with deposits. I admin the Facebook group Lil Snoozy Owners of America and have seen a few folks who had deposits down requesting to join the group. Here is the link if any one here wants to follow the thread there as well:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/3156...491/?ref=share
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Old 03-05-2019, 10:11 AM   #25
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Those who put down deposits will be unsecured creditors.
That puts you at the very end of the line to get money.

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Old 03-05-2019, 10:17 AM   #26
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British Columbia
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Karmantra, we have a 1999 Burro for sale in BC, near the border. $10,000 US. Bought it 14 years ago from a couple in Eugene. 17-ft widebody, have loved it but needed something larger now.
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Old 03-05-2019, 10:17 AM   #27
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Name: Darral
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Maybe this isnt the time nor place to say it, but I will. I think Parkliner was another one of the up-n-coming FG builders that went under.

So, if you're looking to get into a NEW FG trailer, in my opinion, you'd be better off to stay with the "pioneers" of the industry- Scamp, Casita, Escape, Big Foot.

We were at an RV show in Huntsville, AL about 3 weeks ago. I was talking to the makers of the "Trail Manor" folding trailer. They told me the RV industry is gearing for a "down turn". Sounds like it's already hitting the FG market. It will be interesting to see how Oliver survives this one.
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Old 03-05-2019, 10:19 AM   #28
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I was only about a month away from putting a deposit down on a Parkliner when they went belly up. Nice camper but plagued with crappy management and horrible communication. Buy used!
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Old 03-05-2019, 10:55 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darral T. View Post
We were at an RV show in Huntsville, AL about 3 weeks ago. I was talking to the makers of the "Trail Manor" folding trailer. They told me the RV industry is gearing for a "down turn". Sounds like it's already hitting the FG market. It will be interesting to see how Oliver survives this one.
Maybe it will down turn, but I think that is mainly because the industry has been playing catch up since the recession, so there may be some lessening in demand after the rush, but I think there is still some ongoing demand going forward, just not the record pace of the last few years. The established fg manufacturers all have a backlog of orders still.

Apparently Lil Snoozy couldn't produce fast enough to pay the bills and ran into cash flow problems that snowball as discussed above, or were simply not charging enough to cover costs.

The old saying "it takes money to make money" is very true for a business like this, it is very difficult to keep paying the bills before production can get really rolling and economies of scale kick in, and sometimes they never catch up.
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Old 03-05-2019, 11:04 AM   #30
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The large deposit Lil Snoozy required was an indication of what was to come.
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Old 03-05-2019, 11:16 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Darral T. View Post
Maybe this isnt the time nor place to say it, but I will. I think Parkliner was another one of the up-n-coming FG builders that went under.

So, if you're looking to get into a NEW FG trailer, in my opinion, you'd be better off to stay with the "pioneers" of the industry- Scamp, Casita, Escape, Big Foot.

We were at an RV show in Huntsville, AL about 3 weeks ago. I was talking to the makers of the "Trail Manor" folding trailer. They told me the RV industry is gearing for a "down turn". Sounds like it's already hitting the FG market. It will be interesting to see how Oliver survives this one.
From public records, Oliver has been in business since 1998. They make shower and tub enclosures as well as trailers. Established businesses are more likely to ride out downturns because they may have cash reserves, better financing terms, and a stronger customer base--all things a startup like Parkliner or Lil Snoozy would be missing. Bottom line, Oliver is going to be just fine.

With the wait times for new FG being what they are, I don't think there's danger of an immediate downturn. And with American tastes being what they are (gotta have the new shiny thing), there's probably not a danger of long term downturn either.
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Old 03-05-2019, 11:26 AM   #32
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Name: To Infinity & Beyond!
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Hate to say I told ya so however here is my post on this site from just last week in response to the thread about Lil Snoozy, their waits times for build delivery and their upfront deposit requirements!

I am truly sorry for all those that will loose their substantial deposits they paid to be in line for trailer production.



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40% Deposit of the $25K+ total cost of the trailer UPFRONT at the time the order is placed?

Then a 20+ Month WAIT for the possible delivery of your trailer?

This is DISASTER waiting to happen for any type of economic slowdown!

If the manufacturer that has been in business for as long as Snoozy is not primary in the in house manufacture of the major components of their trailers such as the basic fiberglass shell begs the question WHERE'S ALL THE MONEY GOING from all the trailers they have already sold over the years????

That money has certainly NOT been re-invested back into their business!

Try and get your deposit back.

That should tell the tale if they are underfunded if they do not readily, willingly and quickly return your deposit without a bunch of BS reasons as to why it may take time to process your deposit refund request.

You can build a 20K square foot mansion in less time than it takes to get a new Lil Snoozy ordered and delivered.

We are talking about a small trailer here guys and gals

I'd run away as fast as I could from this manufacturer.

If I just "Had To Have One One Of These Snoozy's" I'd pay ALL the money for a good USED Snoozy, get on with my life and most importantly traveling and camping!

http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...now-88273.html

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Old 03-05-2019, 11:51 AM   #33
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Does anyone know how many Snoozys were completed and how many deposits were on the books?

The 20 month wait time and huge deposits just don't add up to a stable business. The simple modular design should have meant they could be built quickly and the system should have been easy to ramp up to higher production.

They have a unique design that seems well made, practical and quick to assemble. The way Alan described the features and the process, led me to think they should have been very successful. It also looks like a system that someone else, who is better at business, could take over and continue since it was made with so many outsourced parts.

Also, I would not allow this failure to in any way predict Oliver's future. Oliver is much much bigger and the trailer business is only one division of what they do. When the Great Recession hit, they stopped production of the trailers, but didn't stiff anybody or go out of business. They just waited until things improved and then came back better than ever. Now, they have really hit their stride with efficiency, quality, production techniques and models.
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Old 03-05-2019, 12:24 PM   #34
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The only winner was the guy that owned the business nice LLC made many decisions, still taking deposits right to the end. Likely gave himself a nice bonus.
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Old 03-05-2019, 12:35 PM   #35
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A previous post seems to say that the building is empty. If so, where are all the tools and equipment and unfinished trailers. Is it all hidden somewhere to avoid a liquidation sale. The unfinished units should be offered to whoever is next in line for delivery, but I'm sure it's too late for that to happen.
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Old 03-05-2019, 12:54 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by mary and bob View Post
A previous post seems to say that the building is empty. If so, where are all the tools and equipment and unfinished trailers. Is it all hidden somewhere to avoid a liquidation sale. The unfinished units should be offered to whoever is next in line for delivery, but I'm sure it's too late for that to happen.
Pure speculation, but the owner could have sold off assets in order to pay employee salaries, bonuses, and benefits one final time before throwing in the towel. I'm no lawyer, but from what I can tell that would only maybe be fraud.

If all the assets are merely hidden they should still be on the books and somebody will track them down. That is definitely fraud.

Any unfinished trailers, if they exist, should be auctioned off with the rest of the assets to pay creditors who couldn't care less about who was next in line.

And of course, maybe it's not truly empty. Maybe it just looks that way because they rolled the last trailer off the line and closed up shop.

However it happened, I hope the owner is held accountable somehow. Your business doesn't go under in a day, nor is bankruptcy filed in a day; there's no ethical reason to continue taking deposits knowing where you're headed.
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Old 03-05-2019, 01:11 PM   #37
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Another thought, did they own the building. If rented or leased maybe they were forced to vacate because of unpaid rent. Whatever the situation it is unfortunate for those who have placed orders and we all wish the best for them.
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Old 03-05-2019, 01:16 PM   #38
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Maybe one of the Seven Dwarfs sued them over copyright.
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Old 03-05-2019, 01:25 PM   #39
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Maybe one of the Seven Dwarfs sued them over copyright.
That's just dopey ...
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Old 03-05-2019, 01:35 PM   #40
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Name: Neal
Trailer: 2019 Casita Freedom DLX
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Highly disappointed I put a $10,000 deposit down August 16 of 2017 I was told at the time it would be 6 to 8 months but more than likely eight months before completion in February 2018 I purchased a truck fridge and a max fan and had them shipped to the factory A cost of just over $1000 between the two I'm curious if anybody would know if that would be considered theft of personal property because I had paid for those items from the supplier and I have receipts from the companies that deliver them to the Lil Snoozy manufacture
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