New Electric F-150 and thoughts on electrification of Tow Vehicles

[thrifty bill]

Ok, since we are off the rails now, it will change smog in LA for sure. The oil rich countries in the Middle East will collapse. China will assume greater power from its dominance of rare earth metal mining supply.

Air pollution will be replaced with water and ground pollution from the entire battery supply chain. Global warming crisis will be replaced with a fresh water crisis.

How much of this will occur? I am not sure but some of it will.

It will be a seismic shift in world power.

[Alf S.]

Originally Posted by thrifty bill

Ok, since we are off the rails now, it will change smog in LA for sure. The oil rich countries in the Middle East will collapse. China will assume greater power from its dominance of rare earth metal mining supply.

Air pollution will be replaced with water and ground pollution from the entire battery supply chain. Global warming crisis will be replaced with a fresh water crisis.

How much of this will occur? I am not sure but some of it will.

It will be a seismic shift in world power.

Hi: thrifty bill... What about the in ground pullution from burring all the spent fuel rods created by the "Nuclear power production". They hafta go somewhere!!!
Alf S. North shore of Lake Erie

[Borden]

Tesla is the largest in electric car sales; think Ford is a lot bigger over all. Tesla has best battery and electronics. Tesla model 3 has been tested well beyond the weight of a boler 17'. The test on YouTube was over the top for weight and speed, they pulled a fully loaded horse trailer really beyond reasonable to expect from a car. Then gave it a poor rating, but point is in video it managed. Only problem is the lack of charging station's in the north still would like the extended range model to tow with.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by ThomasC

Sure but it wouldn't be safe.

Depends on the rig and more importantly the competence of the driver.
The question is often asked without full context.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqrpPaNm8yw

[Terry G]

Originally Posted by thrifty bill

Ok, since we are off the rails now, it will change smog in LA for sure. The oil rich countries in the Middle East will collapse. China will assume greater power from its dominance of rare earth metal mining supply.

Air pollution will be replaced with water and ground pollution from the entire battery supply chain. Global warming crisis will be replaced with a fresh water crisis.

How much of this will occur? I am not sure but some of it will.

It will be a seismic shift in world power.

I'm not too worried about China dominating rare earth mining. For one thing, they aren't exactly rare and they are found in many places including the US. Yes, it takes a lot of expensive equipment to extract the minerals but there are already people setting this up in places besides China. Not a big deal.

[thrifty bill]

1. The french for many decades have been successfully recycling spent fuel rods. The USA in our infinite wisdom would rather just accumulate them in swimming pools at every nuke plant.

2. The Chinese government has been buying up supplies out of Africa in particular. We will see how that plays out.

3. The chemical industry will still need natural gas as a feedstock so watch the value of NG go up and crude drop.

[Terry G]

I don't think there's any doubt that electric vehicles are going to take over. Although they currently cost more to manufacture (and need a Government subsidy), current projections are for electrics to become cheaper around 2026 or 2027. And there are literally hundreds of labs working on battery development so it's inevitable that batteries will get cheaper, longer lasting, and more reliable.

So where does this leave us campers? Well, for people who camp at established campgrounds, it's a matter of upgrading the electric infrastructure. That shouldn't be a huge problem and I'm sure the costs will passed along. The people who are going to most affected by having to buy electric TV's are the boondockers, people who spend their days far off the grid. I don't know what the solution will be for them. They're such a small minority with little economic impact.

[ATHiker]

We're all talking about the environmental impact of electric vehicles / battery production & disposal. Just think of the environmental impact of oil extraction, global transportation, how many thousands of miles of steel pipe, fracking impact, polluted ground water, refining, distribution, air pollution, thousands of buried fuel tanks,..................

[Raz]

Originally Posted by thrifty bill

.....China will assume greater power from its dominance of rare earth metal mining supply.............It will be a seismic shift in world power.

Should of bought Greenland when we had the chance.

Originally Posted by ATHiker

We're all talking about the environmental impact of electric vehicles / battery production & disposal. Just think of the environmental impact of oil extraction, global transportation, how many thousands of miles of steel pipe, fracking impact, polluted ground water, refining, distribution, air pollution, thousands of buried fuel tanks,..................

Since I don't see Boeing making the all electric transatlantic passenger jet or NASA getting to Mars with the all electric rocket, I expect we're in for both.

[ATHiker]

Originally Posted by Raz

Should of bought Greenland when we had the chance.



Since I don't see Boeing making the all electric transatlantic passenger jet or NASA getting to Mars with the all electric rocket, I expect we're in for both.

I agree that we will need both. But all the doom talk about the environmental impact of electric vehicles is ignoring the impact of fossil fuels. Plus all the talk of a lack of charging stations and power generation capacity is probably similar to the talk of a lack of service stations after the turn of the last century.............

[floyd]

Originally Posted by ATHiker

We're all talking about the environmental impact of electric vehicles / battery production & disposal. Just think of the environmental impact of oil extraction, global transportation, how many thousands of miles of steel pipe, fracking impact, polluted ground water, refining, distribution, air pollution, thousands of buried fuel tanks,..................

So at least you admit that electric vehicles are not "Zero Impact" as most proponents claim.
There is very little doubt that electric vehicles will start to dominate, the question remains whether it will be from mandate or merit.
Electric is great for local driving in urban areas where electricity is cheap,
But now they are even discussing shutting down most generation methods.
As Paul Simon said...
"All lies in jest, still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest"

[Keith2000]

Seem to be growing in popularity without any mandate. You don’t have to mandate products that users actually enjoy using.

For our hobby we will likely move to PHEV for our next truck. I wonder who will make the first one.

[John in Santa Cruz]

Originally Posted by Borden

Tesla is the largest in electric car sales; think Ford is a lot bigger over all.....

ya think?

lets see...

Tesla total vehicles sold in 2019, 367,656
Ford total vehicle sales in 2019: 5.4 million

so thats about 15X as many vehicles. I concur with my friend, when Toyota and Ford and GM take electric cars seriously, Tesla will be but a speedbump.

[CalCop]

Originally Posted by ATHiker

I agree that we will need both. But all the doom talk about the environmental impact of electric vehicles is ignoring the impact of fossil fuels. Plus all the talk of a lack of charging stations and power generation capacity is probably similar to the talk of a lack of service stations after the turn of the last century.............

My post was pointing out that as it would seem the electric vehicle is a positive move, it still has its own perils to the environment.
When the electric vehicle becomes more and more common, smog from fossil fuels will be replaced by other air issues caused by the production of electricity and battery components.
A wise move might be to begin a discussion to place in motion protocols that would mitigate the issues.

[John in Santa Cruz]

to ultimately 'mitigate' the issue, we would either need a LOT fewer people, or at least a lot fewer MOBILE people. a whole lot less wasted on all this techno internet cheezits that lets us chat via this forum thing on the world wide web. (says the guy who spent his entire career working with computers), but transportation is the biggest slice of the pie. we are too mobile for our own good.

he says.... on a forum of RV campers

[Terry G]

Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz

ya think?

lets see...

Tesla total vehicles sold in 2019, 367,656
Ford total vehicle sales in 2019: 5.4 million

so thats about 15X as many vehicles. I concur with my friend, when Toyota and Ford and GM take electric cars seriously, Tesla will be but a speedbump.

And then in 2020:
Tesla total vehicles sold 509,737 (An increase of 38%)
Ford total vehicles sold 4.2 million (A decrease of roughly 25%)

Tesla now has a factory in China and is constructing two more in Germany and Texas. If you feel Tesla is doomed to failure, perhaps you should try shorting their stock. So far, investors have lost over $52 Billion doing that.

[emers382]

Tesla doubled their sales in China in 2020 compared to 2019 in a year when considerably less vehicles were sold worldwide. One fifth of all Teslas sold were in China. The country also has their own EV companies which are expanding.

But how are these vehicles charged? Despite China investing heavily in renewable power generation they still use coal primarily as the source for their electricity and they've only promised (if you can believe Chinese promises) to go carbon neutral by 2060.

[Alf S.]

Originally Posted by emers382

Tesla doubled their sales in China in 2020 compared to 2019 in a year when considerably less vehicles were sold worldwide. One fifth of all Teslas sold were in China. The country also has their own EV companies which are expanding.

But how are these vehicles charged? Despite China investing heavily in renewable power generation they still use coal primarily as the source for their electricity and they've only promised (if you can believe Chinese promises) to go carbon neutral by 2060.

Hi: emers382... I don't have to be to concerned about going "Electric". I don't have enough extension cords!!!
Alf S. North shore of Lake Erie

[Alex in LA]

Wow, this thread went south really quickly.
All I was saying is that an electric truck (or maybe even a hybrid truck) will provide several exciting features for campers who like/want/depend on having electricity while camping. It's not going to solve world problems, pollution problems, or immediately and/or forcibly replace conventional trucks. But I see it as a great alternative for someone looking for a new TV to whom having electric hook-ups at every campground without having to deal with generators/solar panels/inverters outweighs short comings. And Ford Lightning is particularly exciting as one of the most common brands with dealer support, proven record, and a price comparable to gas versions.
20,000 put their reservation deposits in the first day.
Cheers!

[emers382]

Originally Posted by Alex in LA

Wow, this thread went south really quickly.

Cheers!

Hey Alex you've been around here for three years you must know how many threads go well away from the original post, oh look there's a squirrel...

But seriously despite all my misgivings regarding EV's I could potentially see one in our future, perhaps ten years down the road once we've finished camping and perhaps moved into a retirement facility of some sort but still wish to get out and about at least locally (shopping, visiting) as at that point we'd likely fly to visit family. By that point they should be more affordable with long lasting batteries and maintenance free.

Adrian