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Old 05-24-2021, 06:19 AM   #41
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Old 05-24-2021, 06:49 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcs02d View Post
We moved to a sticky but the new stickies are not the same as the old ones.

We've had a Geo Pro and now a Nobo and previously we had a scamp.

They are an aluminum frame with azdel on the sides and a molded fiberglass top.

Is it going to 40 years? Probably not but it sounds like you won't be lasting another 40 either. It's not wood, it's not going to leak or develop mold like the old ones. You will get 10 years out of it with no problem and more if you keep it up and use it. The 19 foot Geo Pro I had was right about 3,000lbs. Not that much more than a Casita deluxe and a lot bigger and a lot more comfortable - We had a bath tub and a toilet!

They run about 25K now which is on par with a Casita or Scamp now.

I love the Escape 23 but it's going to be twice the cost. It might last twice but I'm not sure I will!
Interesting. Do they really have fiberglass roofs? Roof leaks (and subsequent wall delamination) are the main reason for avoiding stickies.

I see the No Boundaries ('NoBo') 16.2 is a small trailer (21' with tongue) that has twin beds and a dinette. Kitchen though is a slide-out. I remember back in 2016 (when we found our used Casita) looking at a trailer with a slide-out kitchen and saying, "Whoa! No way I'm having water and propane lines flexing every time we open and close the slide-out! Recipe for disaster!"

They have a '19 foot' (24' with tongue) with big bunks, bed, plus dinette (and no slide-out). More than we need but probably more available than an Escape 23. Looks like Forest River still likes yucky interior colors, though.

If what you say about construction is accurate, though, certainly worth a look.

/LEJ
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Old 05-24-2021, 08:47 AM   #43
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You can get an idea of how the walls are constructed with this -


We had a geo pro with bunks and sold it when the kids got big.


We just got a Nobo 19.6


You can find plenty of threads here where a roof fan or AC provided a leak to the inside of the camper so no camper is going to be 100% waterproof 100% of the time.
I don't think the roof is any more likely to leak over say a 10 year period than a solid fiberglass camper but obviously it's not going to last 30+ years like a fiberglass shell might.



My impression is that it's not a solid fiberglass shell but the interior of the Geo Pro/E Pro/Nobo campers is much much nicer than the Scamp or Casita. It's not as nice as an Oliver or an Airstream Nest. It's about on par with an Escape.


The azdel is much quieter and better insulation than a Casita or Scamp. Probably less so than something like an Oliver with double walls but that is a 50K+ camper. Mine was about 25K
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Old 05-24-2021, 09:14 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by dcs02d View Post
You can get an idea of how the walls are constructed with this -


We had a geo pro with bunks and sold it when the kids got big.


We just got a Nobo 19.6


You can find plenty of threads here where a roof fan or AC provided a leak to the inside of the camper so no camper is going to be 100% waterproof 100% of the time.
I don't think the roof is any more likely to leak over say a 10 year period than a solid fiberglass camper but obviously it's not going to last 30+ years like a fiberglass shell might.



My impression is that it's not a solid fiberglass shell but the interior of the Geo Pro/E Pro/Nobo campers is much much nicer than the Scamp or Casita. It's not as nice as an Oliver or an Airstream Nest. It's about on par with an Escape.


The azdel is much quieter and better insulation than a Casita or Scamp. Probably less so than something like an Oliver with double walls but that is a 50K+ camper. Mine was about 25K
Good luck and congratulations
FG RV owners are a lot like any group of enthusiasts , they see flaws in their preference as only minor and the same flaws in other brands / styles as catastrophic. I’ve had roof leaks in every FG trailer I’ve ever owned , no matter new or used . I have never felt any superiority because I own a product anyone can buy with the bank’s money
We pay a lot of money in order to own a FG trailer , so we can falsely claim
“ THE ROOF DON’T LEAK “
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Old 05-24-2021, 09:57 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve dunham View Post
Good luck and congratulations
FG RV owners are a lot like any group of enthusiasts , they see flaws in their preference as only minor and the same flaws in other brands / styles as catastrophic. I’ve had roof leaks in every FG trailer I’ve ever owned , no matter new or used . I have never felt any superiority because I own a product anyone can buy with the bank’s money
We pay a lot of money in order to own a FG trailer , so we can falsely claim
“ THE ROOF DON’T LEAK “
When we were looking at travel trailers in 2016, all (most?) of the stickies had black 'rubber' roofs, which had to be treated with some kind of black stuff every year. Even then they leaked, as visits to older ones made clear (smell of mold). Most of the traditional travel trailers I see parked around here have big tarps over their roofs.

I've had only a couple of small leaks in my Casita, both from rivets that came out: easily stopped up.

If Forest River is putting fiberglass roofs on some of their trailers, that is certainly a plus. And that Azdel stuff on aluminum frames sounds good, too.

/LEJ
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Old 05-24-2021, 10:03 AM   #46
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Originally Posted by dcs02d View Post
[Geo Pro and NoBo trailers] run about 25K now which is on par with a Casita or Scamp now.

I love the Escape 23 but it's going to be twice the cost. It might last twice but I'm not sure I will!
I don't see a price yet on the Escape website, but I hope it's not twice $25k! The Escape 21s start at US$29k, so maybe not too much more than that?

/LEJ
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Old 05-24-2021, 10:38 AM   #47
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My experience is just the opposite. I've had 5 fg trailers over 13 years with nary a roof leak. The only leak I've had is a window on my Bigfoot and that came from the previous owner.

Walt
Quote:
Originally Posted by steve dunham View Post
Good luck and congratulations
FG RV owners are a lot like any group of enthusiasts , they see flaws in their preference as only minor and the same flaws in other brands / styles as catastrophic. I’ve had roof leaks in every FG trailer I’ve ever owned , no matter new or used . I have never felt any superiority because I own a product anyone can buy with the bank’s money
We pay a lot of money in order to own a FG trailer , so we can falsely claim
“ THE ROOF DON’T LEAK “
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Old 05-24-2021, 10:39 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Lynn View Post
I don't see a price yet on the Escape website, but I hope it's not twice $25k! The Escape 21s start at US$29k, so maybe not too much more than that?

/LEJ



Those I don't know about as much. I'm in Florida so part of my cost for an Escape is the giant cost to transport it here.


I have the impression a Casita or Scamp is now in the 26K ballpark new.



You can get one of these https://forestriverinc.com/rvs/trave...es/NB16.2/4977 for in the ballpark of probably 23.


The base on an Escape 21 is about 29K. I think out the door an Escape 23 will easily be close to 40K.



For the same comfort and $$ I'd buy the solid fiberglass camper every time. If I was not camping with a a wife, dogs and a cat I'd personally buy a Casita


Quick edit - I'd also add the slideout we have is totally different than the older ones. No leaks and it slides out just fine on 12 volts.
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Old 05-24-2021, 11:06 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by dcs02d View Post
. . . Quick edit - I'd also add the slideout we have is totally different than the older ones. No leaks and it slides out just fine on 12 volts.
So it doesn't bother you that your slideout has (flexible) propane, water, and electrical connections? I would me, but I'm a worrywart.

Otherwise, that's a nice layout, basically what we'd like to get in a twin-bed Escape23. But to do that without the kitchen slideout you'd need to shrink that big bathroom. Curiously, Escape is doing it by putting the shower across the aisle from the toilet and sink:

https://escapetrailer.com/wp-content...3T-maple-2.jpg

/LEJ

PS Earlier in this thread we talked about trailer width. I had misread the Escape23 specs. Actual exterior width is 7'11", pretty close to 8 feet.
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Old 05-24-2021, 11:11 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by dcs02d View Post
Those I don't know about as much. I'm in Florida so part of my cost for an Escape is the giant cost to transport it here.


I have the impression a Casita or Scamp is now in the 26K ballpark new.



You can get one of these https://forestriverinc.com/rvs/trave...es/NB16.2/4977 for in the ballpark of probably 23.


The base on an Escape 21 is about 29K. I think out the door an Escape 23 will easily be close to 40K.



For the same comfort and $$ I'd buy the solid fiberglass camper every time. If I was not camping with a a wife, dogs and a cat I'd personally buy a Casita


Quick edit - I'd also add the slideout we have is totally different than the older ones. No leaks and it slides out just fine on 12 volts.

My 2018 Escape 21 was close to $40,000 USD after I add in sales tax , registration , license and title. With the base price and option price increases in the last 3 years I could envision that the total cost would be closer to $45,000 and could easily approach $50,000 USD
If you want to feel sticker shock , price out a new Bigfoot . $75,000 USD is not unrealistic

A friend of ours owns a RV dealership and he concedes that they leak
He contends that the two biggest causes of leaks are poor maintenance and continually storing the trailer outdoors exposed to the elements
Most people never inspect / perform maintenance on the roof until it starts leaking . I checked the roof on my fiberglass trailer this Spring and was surprised how many caulk joints needed repair and I store my trailer indoors
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Old 05-24-2021, 11:19 AM   #51
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So it doesn't bother you that your slideout has (flexible) propane, water, and electrical connections?

Mine does not. It's just a couch on a slide-out. No hoses going through it that I know of but I guess I could be mistaken. We do get a good bit more space with the kitchen



This is what I have - https://forestriverinc.com/rvs/trave...es/NB19.6/4763


Also it has an actual thermostat for the AC
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Old 05-24-2021, 11:34 AM   #52
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We had a Casita 16 and outgrew it, it was OK for my solo astronomy trips, but just too cramped for the two of us, sleeping arrangements in particular didn't work well for us with weak bladders and or excessive beer consumption. I made a plywood platform for the dinette,and put a 'tri fold' mattress on it, that was only marginally better, and it meant no dinette without major hassles.

upgraded to an Escape 21, and are TOTALLY happy. we bought our E21 (barely) used, driving to Houston TX (at the end of December) to bring it home.
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Old 05-24-2021, 01:11 PM   #53
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kalley 11

May 20, 2013






It is nice to be able to have the walking space by day and the wider bed by night. We usually eat outside, but if necessary don't mind eating on the "sofa". It takes about 2 min. to widen the bed. It is a matter of pulling out the longer bed portion, leaving a narrower section by the bathroom door, so it can open all the way. It gives us an 8" memory foam mattress that is slightly more than 30 inches wide. The extra storage shelf under the side dinette space is nice too.

With this set up, we slide our CPAPs under the front of the full size bed in the back and pull the tubing out at night and just push one button on the surge protector to turn them both on. Works for us.










The shorter board by the bathroom is not as long as the fiberglass bench seat. It is only as long as was needed to open the bathroom door completely. The longer board over laps that fiberglass section, allowing for maximum width for the length of the bed while allowing the bathroom door to open completely. There is a lip on the front of the wider two boards that holds the mattress sections in place.

The base has 4 legs that fit into the leg space of the dinette. There is a shelf built into those 4 legs, giving extra storage space. The dust ruffle is just slid onto a café curtain rod and held in place by the mattress.

At night, it is a matter of sliding out the longer board, shelf section, dropping down the narrow board and dropping the extra cushion piece in place, for a comfortable nights sleep. In the morning, pull out the narrow mattress piece, pull up the narrow board, push in the wide board, make the bed. The extra mattress piece fits perfectly across the head of the large bed with the pillows.

We put felt on the bottom of the 4 legs of the long board to protect the floor. We place that rubber lining used to keep things from slipping, between the boards and the fiberglass. We also built a frame out of PVC pipe to make sure the bed does not slip while on the road. It is light weight and does not keep the fridge from being opened for a snack or beverage when stopped. It is easily moved to the back of the truck when we get stopped for the day.

Hope this helps. terry r.
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Old 05-24-2021, 01:14 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by dcs02d View Post
Mine does not. It's just a couch on a slide-out. No hoses going through it that I know of but I guess I could be mistaken. We do get a good bit more space with the kitchen



This is what I have - https://forestriverinc.com/rvs/trave...es/NB19.6/4763


Also it has an actual thermostat for the AC
My mistake; you linked to the NB16.2 twinbed floorplan as an example, and I assumed that was the NB you had.

/LEJ
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Old 05-25-2021, 08:26 AM   #55
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Thanks, Terry, for all the photos of your clever expansion of the dinette bed.

One question: did you put hinges on the extension board that folds up to make a back in couch mode?

Our solution was more primitive and time-consuming to set up: two pieces of plywood (which we keep under the big bed) and a 4" foam extension, plus a foam topper to make the bed a little softer. Makes it big enough that the sleeper doesn't feel as though he's about to fall off, but not as wide as yours. The one advantage is that we get the table back when we put the extensions away. I like sitting at that little table, and if we're just overnighting, it's a place to eat.

I posted a couple of photos on a thread I started last fall on the Casita Forum:

https://www.casitaforum.com/invboard...ide-bed-wider/

See the ideas (like pool noodles!) from other Casita owners in that thread.

/LEJ
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Old 05-25-2021, 08:57 AM   #56
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bed boards

No hinges. The the board shelf unit pulls out, leaving narrow board at feet, or head if you prefer. That narrow board just drops down behind shelf section. Then the other piece of mattress slides right in. In the day, pull out the extra mattress piece, store on other bed as a back pillow, bolster type thing. The back comforter is wide enough to wrap right over and around it.



I am still trying to figure out how to post the photos of the rear twin and dinette/seating section, since that is what you are most interested in.
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Old 05-25-2021, 12:56 PM   #57
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What is the difference in tow weight ready for camping?

Most people want 2 feet more.
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Old 05-25-2021, 01:11 PM   #58
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I may not understand your question. When towing, we have the total width of the original aisle. We have that same width during day, after bed is made for the day. If we don't feel like making up bed, because we will be out site seeing all day, we have enough room to do what we need, including sitting in back at seats. We also have access to fridge, although the door does not open the full width.
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Old 06-21-2021, 07:44 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by dcs02d View Post
Mine does not. It's just a couch on a slide-out. No hoses going through it that I know of but I guess I could be mistaken. We do get a good bit more space with the kitchen



This is what I have - https://forestriverinc.com/rvs/trave...es/NB19.6/4763


Also it has an actual thermostat for the AC
Late question:

Does that couch also make into a bed?
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