transmission fluid change

[k0wtz]

At 36k and tugging with our 2015 Ford Edge Eco I decided to get our transmission fluid changed! My local guy didn't have the machine, the local oil change guy had the machine but I don't trust them. Jiffy Lube comes to mind!

So I called my ace transmission guy 30m away he was 20bux higher but I know I could trust him. Well I took the car in and was visiting with the owner I actually wanted to see what they were doing but 10m later the tech guy comes in and says he was done! I did go back he had 2 machines there! They looked expensive also!

Amazing but I wanted to look at the transmission fluid his only comment was why did I bring it in so everything must have been good.

With a Ford Edge there is no way to check anything regarding your transmission fluid I am a stickler for this after 2 overhauls. Not on this car but pulling a trailer is hard on a car! Oh I forgot to mention there is no filter to change.. To do that you have to split the transmission!

I just wonder how many miles these new idea Ford transmissions are good for?

bob

[Raspy]

With no filter changes and no way to check the level, all you have is the color of the fluid you remove as an indicator of the condition of the trans. If they are simply flushing it, you don't have a chance to take a sample on your fingers to inspect it. Any warning signs are hidden and flushed away for expediency.

We keep moving closer and closer to throw-away, single use parts, that are not designed to be fixed. If you follow the statistical car ownership curve, you should probably not keep that car for more than 75,000 miles. Especially considering you are working it harder than most people do.

To me, long term reliability in vehicles is a very important virtue. And I tend to not trust them completely. But I do tend to work them hard. Sometimes, as was the case with my Wrangler, I settled for an engine I didn't like, in order to get the vehicle I wanted. In other cases, as with my three Cummins' trucks, I bought the engine and settled for the wrapper. With my Taurus, I got fooled and swore I'd never let that happen again, after seeing how it was designed in a number of areas.

[k0wtz]

[
raspy sounds like we are on the same plane. I once had a 90 Cadillac I drove that car 450k miles 2 transmission overhauls and I was careful. Back in that day it had a actual filter I did changes myself I just didn't trust people to work on it.

Don't think I wasn't suprized when I want to even check my fluid no dipstick to be found. But I got fooled again by a volkswagon tdi and the big expense for a transmission oil change.

I am about betting these cars never get maintance done to them and I think you are correct we are on the road of throwaway cars!

Oh I hate them!!!

bob
QUOTE=Raspy;767885]With no filter changes and no way to check the level, all you have is the color of the fluid you remove as an indicator of the condition of the trans. If they are simply flushing it, you don't have a chance to take a sample on your fingers to inspect it. Any warning signs are hidden and flushed away for expediency.

We keep moving closer and closer to throw-away, single use parts, that are not designed to be fixed. If you follow the statistical car ownership curve, you should probably not keep that car for more than 75,000 miles. Especially considering you are working it harder than most people do.

To me, long term reliability in vehicles is a very important virtue. And I tend to not trust them completely. But I do tend to work them hard. Sometimes, as was the case with my Wrangler, I settled for an engine I didn't like, in order to get the vehicle I wanted. In other cases, as with my three Cummins' trucks, I bought the engine and settled for the wrapper. With my Taurus, I got fooled and swore I'd never let that happen again, after seeing how it was designed in a number of areas.[/QUOTE]

[steve dunham]

I got a price from a local transmission shop to change the transmission fluid and filter in my 2014 1/2 ton truck . The estimated cost was over $800 .
I thought the price seemed rather high but after checking the internet I discovered the price was actually on the low end
People balk at the cost of a synthetic oil change so a transmission change is not going to happen
Since most people don’t want to drive / own a 15 year old vehicle , with 200,000 miles on the odometer and holes in the seats , then why would the car companies build a car to satisfy that small almost non existent market that does
.

[vintageracer]

Originally Posted by steve dunham

Since most people don’t want to drive / own a 15 year old vehicle , with 200,000 miles on the odometer and holes in the seats , then why would the car companies build a car to satisfy that small almost non existent market that does?
.

Go look at the average vehicle trade in today and you will see how wrong you are about people not driving a 15 year old vehicle with hole in the seat and 200K miles!! They may not "Want To" however they damn sure do it!

The average vehicle on the road is over 13 years old now. This statistic from NADA continues to move higher in recent years. LOT'S of people driving vehicles with well over 200K miles. The vast majority of 10 year old vehicles now days all have over 200,000 miles.

Yes people are lazy and they will not fix the LARGE hole in the driver's seat. For many vehicles today that repair is as easy as removing the passenger seat bottom from a the passenger side of a vehicle in the JY and bolting on the driver's side seat frame.

All one has to do is look at auction reports from Manheim and others to see 200K+ miles is normal for most older used vehicles today. The days of 100K miles and the vehicle is worn out are history. It takes 300K miles for a lot of people on a BUDGET now days to shy away from an older used vehicle. Trucks are a whole nother story with 200K+ the norm for 7-10 year and older trucks at auction. People love to drive their trucks!

The transmission continues to be the weak link in virtually all vehicles. Want to get that 300K out of your vehicle with little to no repair expense? Change the transmission often and you will have a good shot at 300K miles. With few exceptions engines are no longer the problem to get high mileage out of any vehicle.

For most people a vehicles is just TRANSPORTATION! A conveyance to get from point A to point B and is a throw away commodity. People with money typically don't drive a POS and rarely keep their vehicle for 100K miles. Me excluded!

For the average person their vehicle is one of the most important tools in their ability to earn an income yet they do not think of it that way. Ya gotta get to work somehow! When your vehicle breaks down how ya gettin to work? Most folks are lazy and don't have a budget telling their money what to do each month therefore when their vehicle breaks it's a BIG DEAL as they ain't got no money to fix it!

That's when the bad decisions are made concerning their transportation wants versus needs and car dealers are sitting on the lot waiting for you to "Come On Down"!

[steve dunham]

Originally Posted by vintageracer

Go look at the average vehicle trade in today and you will see how wrong you are about people not driving a 15 year old vehicle with hole in the seat and 200K miles!! They may not "Want To" however they damn sure do it!

The average vehicle on the road is over 13 years old now. This statistic from NADA continues to move higher in recent years. LOT'S of people driving vehicles with well over 200K miles. The vast majority of 10 year old vehicles now days all have over 200,000 miles.

Yes people are lazy and they will not fix the LARGE hole in the driver's seat. For many vehicles today that repair is as easy as removing the passenger seat bottom from a the passenger side of a vehicle in the JY and bolting on the driver's side seat frame.

All one has to do is look at auction reports from Manheim and others to see 200K+ miles is normal for most older used vehicles today. The days of 100K miles and the vehicle is worn out are history. It takes 300K miles for a lot of people on a BUDGET now days to shy away from an older used vehicle. Trucks are a whole nother story with 200K+ the norm for 7-10 year and older trucks at auction. People love to drive their trucks!

The transmission continues to be the weak link in virtually all vehicles. Want to get that 300K out of your vehicle with little to no repair expense? Change the transmission often and you will have a good shot at 300K miles. With few exceptions engines are no longer the problem to get high mileage out of any vehicle.

For most people a vehicles is just TRANSPORTATION! A conveyance to get from point A to point B and is a throw away commodity. People with money typically don't drive a POS and rarely keep their vehicle for 100K miles. Me excluded!

For the average person their vehicle is one of the most important tools in their ability to earn an income yet they do not think of it that way. Ya gotta get to work somehow! When your vehicle breaks down how ya gettin to work? Most folks are lazy and don't have a budget telling their money what to do each month therefore when their vehicle breaks it's a BIG DEAL as they ain't got no money to fix it!

That's when the bad decisions are made concerning their transportation wants versus needs and car dealers are sitting on the lot waiting for you to "Come On Down"!

The only car I’ve seen recently that was over 15 years old is my neighbors 1953 Studebaker .
I’ve only owned one vehicle in my 70 years that made it over 100,000 miles before the car rusted away .
In 2019 I bought a new 2019 Ram 1500 and my wife bought a new 2019 Equinox Premier, not because our old vehicles were worn out or we were having issues or because they weren’t. serviced properly .At my age I don’t want to spent my time playing backyard mechanic or worry that my 70 year old wife is sitting on the side of the road because her 15 year old car failed .
Car dealers are in the business of selling vehicles at a profit and the last time I looked that was neither illegal, unethical or immoral !

[dmad1]

Tranny Fluid Change. We previously owned a 2012 Tahoe. At 100,000 miles I took it to a shop I had used before and asked for a "fluid change". I thought I was getting all new fluid and filter. I did, sort of. They only drained the pan and installed a new filter, while I waited. That requires only about 6 or so qts of fluid. After I returned home and checked it, the fluid was still a dirty tan. I have messed with cars all my life but at 78 I decided I didn't want the hassle of doing it my self but seeing this I decided to do it myself because I knew I could do it right. Only took about 30 minutes by disconnecting the two tranny lines into and out of the radiator. Pumped it into a bucket, added new fluid and all was well. Two years ago we bought a 2017 Tahoe that was a lease car so at 30k miles I decided to change it since we pulled the trailer and really didn't know the car's history. Did everything the same way but when I was draining the fluid I thought it really looked nasty and really needed to be changed. Then the engine started knocking. After doing some head scratching and listening to it knock, I figured out that GM had rerouted the tranny lines and what I thought was tranny lines was now engine oil lines. The engine was knocking so badly that I figured I had knocked the bearings out of the bottom and ruined the crankshaft. Feeling about as low as I could and seeing only $ signs, I tried to correct my huge mistake. Could see metal flakes in the drain pan so I changed the engine oil and filter 3 more times. Someone was looking out for this old man because I now have another 23k miles on it and it still holds good oil pressure and all seems as if I dodged the bullet. Now. my wife throws a fit if I even mention tuckering with her car... Sorry about the long post. Hope there is a lesson in it somewhere.

[vintageracer]

Originally Posted by steve dunham

Car dealers are in the business of selling vehicles at a profit and the last time I looked that was neither illegal, unethical or immoral !

The car business IS an honorable business.

I never said the car business was "illegal, unethical or immoral".

That alone was your interpretation!

[mosquito13]

At best you can do a partial automatic transmission fluid change . Torque convertor holds a bunch . I suck it out of the fill tube. Tool pays for itself in two changes. Might want to ask some questions about maintenance before buying your next vehicle . Mityvac Fluid Evacuator

[Rzrbrn]

I keep our cars about 10+ years. We buy new. Within the first week I buy a dash board cover, install seat covers, and add weather tech type floor coverings front and back. At that time I wash the new engine, then wax the inside of the engine compartment and as much of the engine as I can reach. Also the door jambs, and inside the gas tank door, and under the wheel wells and frame as best I can. Then wash and wax the outside of the vehicle. I do some of my oil changes, but not all. I used to change at 3k miles, now I change at 5k miles using full synthetic oil only. My 1995 GMC Safari had 225K miles on it and traded it in on a new Nissan Maxima. Ran that for over 200K miles until wife totaled it (not her fault). I currently have a 2005 Jeep Liberty diesel with 198K miles on it, and My 2011 Tundra has 90K miles, but I expect to trade it in soon. I bought it to tow a Casita but now I have a much heavier Big Foot and I need more capacity, so will probably get a diesel.

I like the Ford diesels but am put off by the fact that the body has to be raised to do serious work on the engine. Can the various fluid filters be changed on the new Ford truck? Does the transmission have to be cracked to change the transmission filter?

Same questions above for the Ram and Chevy diesel trucks. If the filters can't be accessed please let me know, that might be a deal breaker.

I am partial to the RAM but I don't like the interior colors, that being Black, Dark Grey and...Black. I do like the Ford King Ranch with the brown leather interior. To bad something similar can't be found in the Ram.

I have encountered a couple of very nasty new car dealers over the years, but as a rule most are ok, just hungry. Selling and servicing cars is a tough business.

[dmad1]

Rzrbrn- I have had two Chevy diesels (Duramax) and both had the Allison tranny. Both had external canister type tranny filters. They also had a tranny pan drain plug which makes it a snap to change both the filter and fluid. Loved the trucks but didn't need the last one once we bought the Casita.

[Rzrbrn]

Thanks Dick. Chevy diesels are back on the table.

I have a son who works in the auto industry as a purchasing manager. He drives an older Ford SUV because he is cheap. He likes it. But he says that Ford was noted for replacing top of the line metal parts for cheap plastic parts when he worked at Borg some years ago. I don't like some of the design things Ford does, like needing to lift the body of the frame, etc. I do like that they have so many dealerships. Hopefully most can repair Ford diesel engines.

I really like the Cummins diesel, but not the body so much, in particular the interior colors. Ram has the fewest dealerships.

I have not really looked at the Chevy, although I do like them historically.

[k0wtz]

well I picked up some good tips on many cars today. I did change out the transmission fluid on the Edge. Sort of! Somehow I got the sideways fluid gasket but auto parts guy said no filter.

Then I called the Ford dealer and got the scoop this really made me mad no replacement filter but I am very careful to not get the car stuck. Very hard on transmission fluid the first drain the fluid looked brand new. I don't know about the second because they got it done before I could look at it! Dang it anyway!

You guys have posted some very useful information especially mileage on cars today. I thought a 200k car was well scrap. Apparently not so in todays world!

While at Quartzite I camped close to a guy who had Dodge caravan with 160k on it. He was a mechanic and loved the motor in the thing!

Life in the car world goes on and on!

bob

[Rzrbrn]

I forgot to mention that on all my Vehicles I have never had any serious work done. Although I would like to add one story. I had a GMC Safari van that I really enjoyed. Driving 70 mph on the Interstate, everything goes dead; no steering, no brakes, no lights, no anything. I used the emergency brake to slow down, and managed to turn the steering wheel enough to get it to the side of the road and stopped. My 2 young boys were with me. I was shaking like a leaf. The control module, located under the driver's seat went bad at 160K miles. Module cost $25.00. Dealership charged about $100 to replace. Although I don't count this as major repair, it could have resulted in a major accident. I have not owned a Chevy since, although only because I found other vehicles I like better than Chevys on the market at the time. I traded it because a friend of my son played Tarzan on the driver's side door. If they ever reintroduce the exact model and design I would by it again, I like it that much.

Come to think of it my 2005 Jeep Liberty diesel has had about $3K or so of repairs over its life time, but those was electronic control thingies and some sort of solenoids, nothing major.

[k0wtz]

I have been a gm guy for a long time. never heard of this one!

wow is all I can say

bob

Originally Posted by Rzrbrn

I forgot to mention that on all my Vehicles I have never had any serious work done. Although I would like to add one story. I had a GMC Safari van that I really enjoyed. Driving 70 mph on the Interstate, everything goes dead; no steering, no brakes, no lights, no anything. I used the emergency brake to slow down, and managed to turn the steering wheel enough to get it to the side of the road and stopped. My 2 young boys were with me. I was shaking like a leaf. The control module, located under the driver's seat went bad at 160K miles. Module cost $25.00. Dealership charged about $100 to replace. Although I don't count this as major repair, it could have resulted in a major accident. I have not owned a Chevy since, although only because I found other vehicles I like better than Chevys on the market at the time. I traded it because a friend of my son played Tarzan on the driver's side door. If they ever reintroduce the exact model and design I would by it again, I like it that much.

Come to think of it my 2005 Jeep Liberty diesel has had about $3K or so of repairs over its life time, but those was electronic control thingies and some sort of solenoids, nothing major.

[Cliff Hotchkiss]

Originally Posted by Raspy

With no filter changes and no way to check the level, all you have is the color of the fluid you remove as an indicator of the condition of the trans. If they are simply flushing it, you don't have a chance to take a sample on your fingers to inspect it. Any warning signs are hidden and flushed away for expediency.

We keep moving closer and closer to throw-away, single use parts, that are not designed to be fixed. If you follow the statistical car ownership curve, you should probably not keep that car for more than 75,000 miles. Especially considering you are working it harder than most people do.

To me, long term reliability in vehicles is a very important virtue. And I tend to not trust them completely. But I do tend to work them hard. Sometimes, as was the case with my Wrangler, I settled for an engine I didn't like, in order to get the vehicle I wanted. In other cases, as with my three Cummins' trucks, I bought the engine and settled for the wrapper. With my Taurus, I got fooled and swore I'd never let that happen again, after seeing how it was designed in a number of areas.

My last 5 vehicles bought new, and kept at least 10 years. Had a Ford for 12 years, sold to a coworker and he owned for another 5 years. His only major expense was a clutch. I was happy with my return on my vehicles also, but you have have to know what they’re worth or some unscrupulous dealers will take advantage of uneducated consumers. Did have a minor rust on the 12 year old explorer but none on the other vehicles. Regular wash and wax and parking in garage has served me well.
Maintenance today is definitely more expensive than it was 20 years ago, what isn’t?? The upside is the service intervals are way longer due mechanical and chemical advances. 3 of my 10+ year old vehicles where sold with same plugs they came with. Never happen if we where still using leaded fuel. The lack of a dipstick is 1 reason the fluid change intervals are longer. That dipstick is a major source of contamination. I’m impressed with the technology of today’s vehicles, sure there a few lemons out there, but that’s up to the consumer to educate himself, and that means separating fact from opinion 😎

[k0wtz]

Originally Posted by Cliff Hotchkiss

My last 5 vehicles bought new, and kept at least 10 years. Had a Ford for 12 years, sold to a coworker and he owned for another 5 years. His only major expense was a clutch. I was happy with my return on my vehicles also, but you have have to know what they’re worth or some unscrupulous dealers will take advantage of uneducated consumers. Did have a minor rust on the 12 year old explorer but none on the other vehicles. Regular wash and wax and parking in garage has served me well.
Maintenance today is definitely more expensive than it was 20 years ago, what isn’t?? The upside is the service intervals are way longer due mechanical and chemical advances. 3 of my 10+ year old vehicles where sold with same plugs they came with. Never happen if we where still using leaded fuel. The lack of a dipstick is 1 reason the fluid change intervals are longer. That dipstick is a major source of contamination. I’m impressed with the technology of today’s vehicles, sure there a few lemons out there, but that’s up to the consumer to educate himself, and that means separating fact from opinion ��

cliff I drive my vehicles long miles. I am a stickler for checking my oil every time i put gas in and I like to pull the transmission stick to check the condition of my transmission oil.

I learned this after getting stuck one time and getting the fluild too hot probably the filter was plugged up also. No doubt you are right about modern cars some my transmissions have lasted a long time some not.

my 90 Cadillac had a fantastic motor in it but I had to watch the transmission although 2 in 450k probably wasnt above average. I dropped the pan and changed filter and fluid quite a few times. my transmission guy said the torque converters were bad about going out!

I guess the next step is sealed motors entirely!

bob

[Cliff Hotchkiss]

Originally Posted by k0wtz

cliff I drive my vehicles long miles. I am a stickler for checking my oil every time i put gas in and I like to pull the transmission stick to check the condition of my transmission oil.

I learned this after getting stuck one time and getting the fluild too hot probably the filter was plugged up also. No doubt you are right about modern cars some my transmissions have lasted a long time some not.

my 90 Cadillac had a fantastic motor in it but I had to watch the transmission although 2 in 450k probably wasnt above average. I dropped the pan and changed filter and fluid quite a few times. my transmission guy said the torque converters were bad about going out!

I guess the next step is sealed motors entirely!

bob

Transmissions don't burn oil, they either leak or they don't. No leak, not necessary to check it every fuel up.You're probably doing more damage than good . Every time you pull that stick out you're taking a chance on introducing contamination.

[Raspy]

I'm a big fan of changing gearbox and differential fluids often in the beginning of a vehicle's life, (along with doing the engine early too). Differentials especially. Initially the differential oil comes out with lots of metal in it. But over time, with several more changes, it starts coming out looking like what goes in. Then you know it has broken in and the bearings won't be running in oil contaminated with hard face steel.

When towing at full throttle up a long grade, I feel better about what the differential is doing.

With my Aisin trans in my Ram, I changed it at every engine oil change for the first 60,000 miles. No doubt that was excessive as it always came out looking clean, but draining the pan only drained about half of the overall oil, so I just kept changing it to get it all mostly changed.

[Cliff Hotchkiss]

Originally Posted by Raspy

I'm a big fan of changing gearbox and differential fluids often in the beginning of a vehicle's life, (along with doing the engine early too). Differentials especially. Initially the differential oil comes out with lots of metal in it. But over time, with several more changes, it starts coming out looking like what goes in. Then you know it has broken in and the bearings won't be running in oil contaminated with hard face steel.

When towing at full throttle up a long grade, I feel better about what the differential is doing.

With my Aisin trans in my Ram, I changed it at every engine oil change for the first 60,000 miles. No doubt that was excessive as it always came out looking clean, but draining the pan only drained about half of the overall oil, so I just kept changing it to get it all mostly changed.

🤔
In my entire life including the 10 years as a mechanic I can count the differentials I’ve seen fail from normal wear and tear on 1 hand with fingers left over. Now if you’re talking drag racing or serious off-roading different story. In today’s vehicles the best oil your differential will probably ever see is the original. The recommended change interval for my F150 is 150k, 60k for severe use. I’ll loose no sleep and save a bunch money and resources by going on the factory recommendations. Things have changed a lot since the “early” days of the automobile and for the better.😎