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Old 07-20-2019, 12:39 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by steve dunham View Post
I have no problem with making REASONABLE accommodations for people with chemical sensitivities but sometimes it is taken to the extreme .
I’ve worked at businesses where people have complained about the smell of certain foods and want the management to limit what food people can bring to work in there lunch or complain about the smell from peoples clothing because they use a laundry detergent that they find objectionable .
Next they will want bakeries to eliminate the smell from baking bread

Just to add an additional level of validity to my claims I added sources with an attempt to make them factual based by unbiased sources.



I'm speaking directly about something proven to cause known health issues, I'm not comparing a war veteran with Gulf War Syndrome to some lady who doesn't like the smell of curry.



Can you please link any sources or examples you're citing relating to this topic of chemicals and the scent of foods?


As far as I know, peanuts would be the closest example as many planes removed them due to allergies.



You're comparing a valid accommodation request a disabled person with MCS might make under the American's with Disabilities Act with a food smell preference and I'm not seeing a correlation between them. Can you please explain further as to my knowledge the smells of food are not included in any literature relating to MCS or Gulf War Syndrome accommodations.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Borrego Dave View Post
+ 100% on your comment. You can always find statistics to "prove" any point being made.

I accept your offer to find statistics to "prove" the smell of normal foods is a health risk or concern. I'm looking forward to you backing this up. I'm also open to you finding something to disprove that petrochemical are unhealthy for humans to come in contact with.
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Old 07-20-2019, 01:01 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by TucsonAZ View Post
I accept your offer to find statistics to "prove" the smell of normal foods is a health risk or concern. I'm looking forward to you backing this up. I'm also open to you finding something to disprove that petrochemical are unhealthy for humans to come in contact with.
I didn't offer to prove anything, just stated the obvious that everyone knows. The results of polls are only as good as how and what questions are ask or the testing information put in to get results you're looking for to back/prove your claims. Happens all the time. Eating eggs are no good one day, then it's OK, more than one cup of coffee is bad, then a pot full is OK and the examples go on and on. Sorry that you have a problem with certain things but there is no one size fits all in the world. Hope you find the perfect TT for you.
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Old 07-20-2019, 03:09 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Borrego Dave View Post
I didn't offer to prove anything, just stated the obvious that everyone knows. The results of polls are only as good as how and what questions are ask or the testing information put in to get results you're looking for to back/prove your claims. Happens all the time. Eating eggs are no good one day, then it's OK, more than one cup of coffee is bad, then a pot full is OK and the examples go on and on. Sorry that you have a problem with certain things but there is no one size fits all in the world. Hope you find the perfect TT for you.

I guess I don't understand comparing food to a topic about petrochemicals. Eating eggs and huffing gasoline are very, very different things and nobody is disputing that.


I'm not cherry picking data to back up an unfounded claim that petrochemicals are bad for your health. Now of course I don't know you, you may think the earth is flat and the moon landing is hoaxed but unless you know something about OSHA and every other reputable corporation and standard/threshold limit I have seen being made up I don't think anybody is debating exposure to petrochemicals being bad for your health. There is no study you will find that proves smoking cigarettes is good for example, or huffing glue, painting without a respirator and so on.


I'm going on about this not because I'm sensitive but because these products impact EVERYBODY exposed to them negatively the only thing that's open for debate is the threshold.



Thanks for the kind words and I don't mean to retort with a bit but I don't love people comparing Gulf War Syndrome to eating eggs. Certainly I agree with you, the merits of many things are up for debate but research on this topic isn't something I've heard disputed by any medical professional.
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Old 07-20-2019, 03:42 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by TucsonAZ View Post
I guess I don't understand comparing food to a topic about petrochemicals. Eating eggs and huffing gasoline are very, very different things and nobody is disputing that.
I'm not cherry picking data to back up an unfounded claim that petrochemicals are bad for your health. Now of course I don't know you, you may think the earth is flat and the moon landing is hoaxed but unless you know something about OSHA and every other reputable corporation and standard/threshold limit I have seen being made up I don't think anybody is debating exposure to petrochemicals being bad for your health. There is no study you will find that proves smoking cigarettes is good for example, or huffing glue, painting without a respirator and so on.
I'm going on about this not because I'm sensitive but because these products impact EVERYBODY exposed to them negatively the only thing that's open for debate is the threshold.
Thanks for the kind words and I don't mean to retort with a bit but I don't love people comparing Gulf War Syndrome to eating eggs. Certainly I agree with you, the merits of many things are up for debate but research on this topic isn't something I've heard disputed by any medical professional.
Well Adam, I was well versed with 30 years of dealing with OSHA's regs and I wasn't comparing GWS with eggs, gee really? Only that there are many open debates as to the harmfulness to many things and no, there is no debating huffing gas or glue is good etc. People are either on one side or the other of what you're posting and many are in the middle which is where I am. So I'm going to leave it here and move on. Like I said, good luck in your search for the perfect TT and I wish you well.
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Old 07-20-2019, 05:40 AM   #25
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I spent 40 years of my life working in chemical plants , oil refineries , paint factories , plastic plants , printing plants so I could feed my family and stay off welfare and now I am supposed to go into panic over air freshners ? . I have sympathy and respect for our Vets , they earned it by serving our country and putting their lives on the line . What I don’t support is forcing businesses and individuals to accomodate the small , vocal minority who are allergic to everything known to man .I don’t want a sanitized , odor free world and if a Woman smells like perfume that’s fine with me .
If you want an odor & chemical free trailer then build one and let me know how it goes !!
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Old 07-20-2019, 06:02 AM   #26
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I don't get that part. Are you saying that fiberglass resin/carpet/mdf off-gasses less than wood/aluminum?
Adam,

You never answered this one - or I missed it in the fog.
Thanks
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Old 07-20-2019, 07:31 AM   #27
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I would like to see everyone here play nicer. This thread is not a competition.

My view is that folks have the right to their own decisions just so long as they are not affecting others poorly by them.

I still plan on keeping whiskey as my air freshener.
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Old 07-20-2019, 08:44 AM   #28
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I believe sensitivity is a real problem for many and buying new may be the only answer. In addition some new rigs have many odors too. So a new rig might not be enough. The higher the sensitivity the more thorough investigation is required. If I was very sensitive, I’d visit at least a couple of factories, do a tour, and spend time in a brand new unit.

As a chemical engineer myself I spent a career in chemical manufacturing. First job the plant made vanillin, came home smelling like a cookie. Got where I couldn’t stand the smell. I wasn’t allergic to it but too much of a good thing is just too much!
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Old 07-20-2019, 05:25 PM   #29
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Jim I want to point out that whisky releases VOCs so I am sure Adam is against that as well.

Alex sorry about your MIL, I completely understand. My wife has always had issues with fragrances, sometimes causing headaches, sometimes affecting her sines. On top of that I have had on numerous occasions had to have conversations with employees about perfumes and BO.

Adams original post was, "For the life of me I can't fathom why people put these toxic petrochemicals in a tiny space they're sleeping in. Totally ruins the trailer as those petrochemicals leach into every single plastic based fiber in the trailer and will never come out." This is unfounded, alarmist crap on par with anti vaccination tards. The last sentence of this statement makes me wonder if he even knows how plastic is grown.

Before anyone has a conniption fit, know that negative health impacts generally require exposures beyond the Permissible Exposure Limits (PEL)of a chemical before they have negative health impacts. If you could even come close to the PEL from exposure to an air freshener they would be pulled from the market. Exposure to any chemical can be problematic. To much oxygen and you will die, not enough oxygen and you will die. We live in a world of balance. Everything that is good for you is also bad for you, so it is important to understand that balance and not be swayed by alarmist, hucksters and scammers.
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Old 07-20-2019, 05:36 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Frye View Post
The last sentence of this statement makes me wonder if he even knows how plastic is grown.

Or that it's made out of petrochemicals.
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Old 07-20-2019, 05:37 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Frye View Post
Jim I want to point out that whisky releases VOCs so I am sure Adam is against that as well.
Very Ominous Characteristics?
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Old 07-20-2019, 06:25 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Frye View Post
Adams original post was, "For the life of me I can't fathom why people put these toxic petrochemicals in a tiny space they're sleeping in. Totally ruins the trailer as those petrochemicals leach into every single plastic based fiber in the trailer and will never come out." This is unfounded, alarmist crap on par with anti vaccination tards. The last sentence of this statement makes me wonder if he even knows how plastic is grown.

I have a full grasp of petrochemicals and plastics, I think this is my point, since plastic and oil, gasoline, air freshener, anything that has the ingredient "fragrance" or "perfume" are all petrochemicals they bond to each other. Imagine filling a plastic water bottle with gasoline, then imagine trying to use it for water again, it doesn't matter if you washed it 100 times it would never be safe for drinking again. This is the same with air fresheners and the things exposed to them be it curtains or carpeting, if it's plastic based, you're not going to remove the smell.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo View Post
Or that it's made out of petrochemicals.

That's the very crux of the matter.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Bennett View Post
Very Ominous Characteristics?

This is the same argument smokers make about car exhaust, of course any smell is a type of off gassing and of course too much of anything is a bad thing. I mean, ozone is too much oxygen and a room full of it will kill you good and fast but a little of it will actually make the air fresher.



I would like to think that most people understand the smell of nailpolish and the smell of an apple pie are very very different but this is the internet so if there's room to argue somebody it will be done.



I honestly didn't think we would be disputing if petrochemicals were harmful, I could see debating how harmful, I could see accepting the risks, but in this day and age I didn't think there would be a debating about if exposure to them was good or bad. My initial assertion was that I didn't understand intentionally exposing yourself to them.


With that said, like thrifty_bill said earlier in this post "I just looked it up, US sales of air fresheners was $1.62 billion in 2016 alone!!" which is nothing compared to the $130,000,000,000 in US tobacco sales and even with a $300,000,000,000 cost in tobacco related illnesses people are showing no signs of slowing down usage.



This topic has been beat to death at this point and we can all agree to disagree on it. I appreciate all of your responses be them critical or otherwise. There's always room for learning and growth.
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Old 07-20-2019, 06:42 PM   #33
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It seems like we've gotten away from the original question. Why would someone use air fresheners in a trailer there trying to sell. To cover odors. I, Also, would not buy any trailer, car or even a house which has a heavy smell of air fresheners. Certain air fresheners are one of the few ways to cover the smell of mold, dry rot and some other organic smells. They cover it. They don't do away with it.
I speak from experience after 34 years in public housing.
Also, just for information sake, pure bannana oils about best way to cover the smell of a fire. It makes a place livable much sooner.
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Old 07-21-2019, 08:26 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TucsonAZ View Post
This is the same argument smokers make about car exhaust, of course any smell is a type of off gassing and of course too much of anything is a bad thing. I mean, ozone is too much oxygen and a room full of it will kill you good and fast but a little of it will actually make the air fresher.
Not at all the same argument as they are two totally different things. Scotch and other good whiskeys are wonderfully natural and they taste and smell beautiful. In small doses some say good for your health. I used to smoke over 30 years ago and have been subjected to gas fumes for over 60, and neither can be compared in any way. Sad that I smoked at all, but still require the use of fuel for many things.

I am not a big fan of smelly fragrant trees on car dashes though.
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Old 07-21-2019, 08:54 AM   #35
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FWIW

WE will soon be putting our 17' Casita Independence Dlx on the market..our grand kid ds are now coming "in bunches" and we have just now outgown our Casita. She goes on the market around Aug 2nd after we get back from a family reunion in NC
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Old 07-21-2019, 11:12 AM   #36
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I must be the odd duck cause I like / enjoy the smell of a good bourbon or brandy , campfires , fresh cut hay , walking in the pines , a steak sizzling on the grill , a good cigar , perfume , bread baking , a dairy barn , burning leaves , a splash of cologne after a haicut or hot shave , meat in the smoker , freshly washed clothes , pinesol Etc Etc
To each their own
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Old 07-21-2019, 03:14 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by thrifty bill View Post
As a chemical engineer myself I spent a career in chemical manufacturing. First job the plant made vanillin, came home smelling like a cookie. Got where I couldn’t stand the smell. I wasn’t allergic to it but too much of a good thing is just too much!
I worked in a peanut butter manufacturing plant in college and noticed loose dogs would follow me while walking back to the dorm...........
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Old 07-21-2019, 04:49 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by steve dunham View Post
I must be the odd duck cause I like / enjoy the smell of a good bourbon or brandy, campfires, fresh cut hay, walking in the pines, a steak sizzling on the grill, a good cigar, perfume, bread baking, a dairy barn, burning leaves, a splash of cologne after a haircut or hot shave, meat in the smoker, freshly washed clothes, Pine-sol, Etc, Etc
To each their own
Amen Brother! Ditto here...
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Old 07-21-2019, 06:16 PM   #39
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Scents

Favorite scents
1.Line dried sheets
2. Apple orchard in bloom
3. Dry Hickory wood campfire
4. Coming in from outside in Iowa in November to Thanksgiving dinner.

And contrasting

Smell of a skunk on the night air reminding you of catching Civet Cats when you were 14

Gasoline that put you through college, bought you your first everything, and made you smell like the men you admired.

Perfume your prom date wore when you pinned the corsage on her dress. ( Paid for by, you guessed it, gasoline.)
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Old 07-21-2019, 08:00 PM   #40
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Growing up in the fifties on a NC tobacco/cotton/peanuts/grain farm with poultry and livestock and spending a lot of time directly behind flatulent mules may have tempered my sense of smell somewhat but I find few odors truly objectionable. Many, while not particularly pleasant in and of themselves, will trigger a memory of something or someone that I hold dear and I'm thankful for those.

Even the air fresheners which seem to have prompted this thread bring back a couple. I once managed an auto parts supply warehouse and we had half a row of shelving dedicated to the Christmas Tree, Rose and whatever air freshener cards - cases and cases of them. The picker for that section, an older lady who went out of her way to make me feel welcome there, always smelled of those darned fresheners. I still remember her fondly whenever I catch a whiff on one.

Steve and Dave (posts 36 and 38), I'm with you guys and will add

1. The ocean at night from the deck of a boat
2. Creosote bushes just before dawn on an April morning in Big Bend NP
3. The air after a heavy southern thunderstorm
4. The earthiness of freshly dug peanut vines
5. Flue cured tobacco after its dried and ready to be removed from the barn (I quit smoking over thirty years ago and refuse to be anywhere around cigarette smoke but this is entirely different).
6. Coffee, eggs, bacon and biscuits whenever I'm camping
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