Converter/charger

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Found some information:

Magnetek Converter:

Model - DC output - Max. Charge Rate
3220 - 20a - 6a
3230 - 30a - 6a
3240 - 40a - 6a
6332 - 32a - 6a or 12a (tapering)
6345L - 45a - 6a or 12a (tapering)

7345RU 45a (full output rating, 45a)

An 'upgrade' to a 7345 power center would be an improvement to the 6300 series converter. However in a trailer wired for a 12a max charge rate (my 2000 Casita has 12ga wire and a 20a auto-reset circuit breaker from the battery to the converter), 'souping up' the charger could result in the auto-reset breaker cycling on and off (if the battery is 'low, or dead') as it now becomes the weak link in the charging system (if not upgraded along with the new power center). Straighten me out if I'm wrong here.

Pete says the 3200 series charger doesn't taper, and at 6 amps you'd want to unplug it after a time to save the battery. 6 amps is too much for a 'float' charge, not enough for a 'good' recharge on a depleted battery.:cry

My 6332 charge tapers to 2a (at 13.8v, tested for 7 days). :E :E

So if you've got a 'dedicated' charger that you can hook up directly to the battery, with a 30-50a output at 14v, 3 stage, tapering to 2a, it'd be an improvement, :sunny

.........but just hooking up your handy 15a auto battery charger wouldn't necessarily help, would it? Isn't this a myth carried over from the 'old' days of the converters with the 6a, constant rate charger?
:chased

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Whoa, careful with the terminology, I did NOT say the 3200 doesn't "taper", I said it wasn't intelligent -- there's a difference, and in fact my 3200 did appear to taper.

Intelligent chargers have three (or four for the really good ones) stages:

1. BULK, where high Amp high volt charging occurs to rapidly bring the battery back to a working voltage, but it's not full.

2. Then comes ABSORPTION, where the Amps aren't flowing so fast, but they go for a long time to pack more energy in. Voltage is still relatively high. Really good chargers also adjust the absorbstion stage to fit the actual temperature of the battery(ies).

3. Finally comes FLOAT or maintenance, where either relatively short bursts of relatively high voltage is applied occasionally or, better, bursts are applied based on internal losses and temps as measured by the charger.:party

4. Additionally on the really good ones there is occasional EQUALISATION where the batts are deliberately overcharged under controlled conditions to induce internal plate cleaning.:omy

Tapering, OTOH, means that as the batts voltage is raised as it recharges, the Amp flow is gradually reduced, but in most cases the voltage is NOT reduced, leading to slow gassing once the batts are fully charged. :sick

So-called trickle chargers do the same thing, except their "taper" is really just a low-Amp flow from the git-go.:sick

If tapering or trickle is EXACTLY matched to the batts internal losses over time, no gassing will occur, but given battery aging and ambient temps, that is unlikely to happen for very long.:sad

hope I have explained this clearly, but if not, or you want to learn more, try these links::wave

http://bart.ccis.com/home/mnemeth/12volt/12volt.htm

http://www.4unique.com/battery/battery_tutorial.htm

http://www.uuhome.de/william.darden/

http://www.batterystuff.com/

There are also some good 12VDC Life books in RV, Marine and RatShack stores.
.

Pete and RatLadies

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Right, Pete......... there's been too many 'rainy days' lately, :umb and yaking on the forum is easier than doing the research.:lol

Guess I had the image of someone going to the trouble of hooking up their little 'automatic' charger (like I've got) assuming it would do a better job than the converters charger (not that it's all that great, either).

And if a 'good' charger costs more than the battery, well...........:chin

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I use the smaller Schumacher Ship N' Shore from WallyMart. It's float cycle is a "burster", rather than true intelligence. I believe the other Ship N' Shore (in Wally's catalog, but haven't seen it in stores) is indeed a true intelligent 3-stage.

And, yes, sometimes the economics says changing batts is easier/and or cheaper than good charging. One of the most tech oriented guys I know, with all kinds of test equip (my favorite was when he put a heater in a closet with an O2 meter [doesn't everyone have an O2 meter], or was it when he was using his ballistic tester to rate potato guns?), just replaces all his deep cycle RV batts every other spring rather than try to squeeze more life out of them. He is impressed with the AGM batts but underimpressed with how quickly bad charging can wreck one and how expensive they are.

Pete and Rats

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AGM = absorbed glass mat.

I don't pretend to know what these are, but I was curious/wondering if you meant gel batteries. (Answer, of course, is no.)

Since I looked it up, thought I'd throw it in. :r

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I should have mentioned that the AGM batts have one really good feature for small RVs, esp the van-based ones. They essentially do not gas, so they don't need ventilation, and they can be mounted in any position (upside down if you wish).

Pete and Rats

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Don, it's no myth at my camp.

I carry an intelligent dedicated charger ... and use it to recharge the house battery after an extended dry camping period.

I carry several of the little camping world folding tables (discussed in another thread). It's a simple matter to reach in, disconnect the battery connections ... hook up the charger and plug it into electricity.

I've found that when your house battery is really low, the 6300 Magnetek really gets hot in high gear.

And since most of our dry camping is in Colorado ... the first night out of the mountains is usually somewhere in Nebraska, almost always in 100 F (37+ C) ... using a dedicated charger also keeps some of the heat out of the trailer.

I've been doing it for years.

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Soooooooo:

A 'micro-processor controlled' (intelligent) 3-4 stage (4 stage adds the 'equalization' phase) charger is what we're after?!:sunny

This is better than the manual, trickle, tapering, automatic, or most RVs converter/chargers?!:E :E

Now for a make, model and price.:chased

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Don, here is what I have:

http://www.batterychargers.com/details.cfm...A%2DPE&catid=20

You are certainly entitled to your opinion as to which way to go!

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Don; A place to start. Prices can be beat.

http://www.4unique.com/

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Thanks Charles:

Now, when I hear you say you're hooking up an 'intelligent dedicated charger', it makes more sense. You're hooking up a better charger than what might be lurking in the back of the garage from another era.........(me, have an opinon?, surely not:r )

Pete:

Took some time to look at the websites you provided. It's beginning to make sense. Now, if I knew what my little old charger was doing.

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:wave well folks. we bought a pd9145+ with the charge wizzard (sp) from brwholesale www.brwholesale.com 815 woolley dr., Marshall, mi 49068 1-800-848-0934 1-800-900-2468 $234.02 including shipping.
this a 45 amp charger/converter with the 4 stage controller.
can buy the 40 amp charger from cw for a few dollars less.
www.progressivedyn.com is the manufacturer.
in the process of rebuilding that magnetec 6300. am sure this is going to be a lot of fun:r
after reading the company's stats and history )pd's) decided to use thier product.

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Morgan upgraded his awhile back. I remember he was real happy with how it turned out. Almost made me want to upgrade mind, but then mine wasn't broke.

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<img src=http://www.fiberglassrv.com/board/uploads/3dc96fcb33ed6rv_charge_wizard_diagram.gif/>
In the above diagram, the 4 stages:
1. 'Boost' = 'Bulk'
2. 'Normal' = 'Absorbsion'
3. 'Storage' = 'Float'
4. 'Equalizing' = 'Enima'......whoops that's not an electrical term.

If your battery has this kind of care it should perform like a Kentucky race horse.

OK, should be time for the semester test on battery chargers and all the related terms. To those of you who have already graduated, thanks for your input.

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"4. Additionally on the really good ones there is occasional EQUALISATION where the batts are deliberately overcharged under controlled conditions to induce internal plate cleaning."

Don't forget that the equalization mode should be turned off if you have AGM or gel batteries.

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:u
swiiiiisssssshhhhhh, zoooooooommmmmmmmm

What was that? A speeding train? A bullet? A jet? No....it was all of that flying right over my head!:wink

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Suz-

Non-tech summary -- If you are using shore power to keep your battery charged during storage, unless you KNOW it has intelligent charging, don't leave the converter plugged in all the time. Either use a timer or plug in the converter for a day per month to avoid overcharging.

Check the water on the battery (yes, you CAN pry up the covers and maintain the supposedly maintenance-free battery) and if it is using water, either it is broke or it is overcharging.

Pete and sometimes overcharged RatLadies who use a lot of water

PS: On my Scamp, the Magnatek converter was plugged into a standard 120VAC outlet located inside the kitchen cabinet; on my Jayco, the Magnatek likewise plugged in inside a different cabinet.

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Thanks a million, Pete. Thought for a sec that I wouldn't even be able to decipher the non-tech version, but then some simple words started soaking in. So, now I have a couple of more questions.

Background: I have had my '89 plugged in since I brought it home last April. Didn't even know how to check the battery for water for the longest time, so assumed it would be toast by the time I did check it. Unfortunately, the way my unit is set up, I have to take out the back seat to check it properly/add water. Have removed the access panel in the seat and taken off the battery cover...but clearances won't allow complete removal of battery cover. Excuse the digression. Anyway, when I finally did get to it I added distilled water. I assume since it will still run the lights when it is not plugged in, that the battery is okay...is that a safe assumption? I've been gone for a couple of months, so not sure of it's condition now, except the lights will still run when not plugged in to shore power.

Now for the question:

Either use a timer or plug in the converter for a day per month to avoid overcharging

Does this mean that if I unplug from shore power for a day or two every month, it should be okay?

Thanks a million. The more I learn, the less I know.

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Umm, no, leaving the converter overcharging for 29 days out of 30 is not a good thing (presuming there are no drains on the battery). Just plugging it in for a day or so will be enuf to restore the battery's internal losses that it experiences just sitting there, but any more dumb charging will overcharge it .

One solution for long-term storage is a small solar panel, but it MUST have a charger/voltage regulator that won't overcharge, and must have some sort of backflow check device to keep the battery from trying to charge the stars and clouds at nite.

BTW, same is true for the socalled Trickle Chargers; they will trickle in elec at over the gassing voltage over a long period of time causing water loss and resultant damage.

Pete and Rats

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Okay...now I think I get it. I believe the reason I never had a problem before is because I spent time out there everyday and ran the a/c and/or lights. I guess that did the trick. Real damage may have occurred, though, when I had to leave town for two months. But, as I said, the lights are still working even though I've unplugged it.

So, the battery (which doesn't cost very much) may or may not be fine. The converter could be bad, though???? If so, then why do my lights still work? Is there something I should look for as a clue other than the battery being dry? How do I check my converter?

I really hate being so dumb about all this, but if I don't ask, I won't know. Thanks.