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Old 06-19-2016, 05:18 PM   #21
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
Oregon
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See this little bitty thing in the photo below that is made of plastic and is 1 inch long, just under 3/8" wide and only 3/16" high on the two side legs of the U channel? There are two of them in bottom of the aluminum window frame channel and their job is keeping the glass out of the bottom of the channel so water can get out the weep holes. The legs of the channel go down against the bottom of the frame so the water can run underneath them.

My pieces are starting to fracture so I will make replacements for them as that U Channel is a non standard size for anything currently being sold and getting the height right is important as well as the width. They do need to be plastic so they don't chip the glass when you drive over bumps.
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Old 06-21-2016, 08:17 PM   #22
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
Oregon
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Campster sliding window 3D printed parts

I just 3D printed my first replacement parts for the Campster sliding window. They were printed in black ABS plastic which is stronger than the original material as well as being more UV resistant.

The last post discussed why I needed to replace the original pieces that hold the fixed pane 1/8" above the bottom of the aluminum frame so that water can run out of the weep holes. The original, the white one in the photo was falling apart. These little U channel sections are not very large pieces but their function in the window is a critical one.

The original piece is 1" long by .35" by .125" tall and so is my replacement. As the originals were too weak to last the ages I have made the base of the U channel a little thicker as well as making the legs of the U thicker. In the center of the channel I have added a little Island in the Stream which will help prevent the channel from sagging and fracturing under the weight of the glass. There is still plenty of room for the water to flow through the U channel and reach the drain holes.

Originally there were two of these pieces under the window, I will be installing three. It took the printer ten minutes to print the three sections. As there are two sliding windows in the Campster I will make a total of six.

Well that was fun and it put a smile on my face
A few seconds worth of video of the printing process
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Old 06-21-2016, 08:48 PM   #23
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Name: Roger
Trailer: Trails West Campster andTeardrop American
California
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Way to go Karin. You might have to go into production. You can't be the only one having this kind of window problem.

Super cool.

Roger the
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Old 06-21-2016, 08:59 PM   #24
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rwilhelm View Post
Way to go Karin. You might have to into production. You can't be the only one having this kind of window problem.

Super cool.

Roger the
Not sure what the price would be or that anyone would be willing to pay it. Not so much material cost, although there is some, as it is the labor cost. First there is having to set up the print in the computer software, get the machine prepared, prepare the surface of the glass platen so the parts stick to it, warm the printer up to temperature which takes about 5 minutes and then wait 20 minutes while a full set prints. Then remove the hot glass and go put it under hot water to release the parts, clean up, put the glass back where it belongs which is at least another 10 minutes. That is a lot of labor time and that makes it at least a 40 minute job to run 6 tiny parts not counting the time to package them. I can of course run more than 6 at a time and only do one one setup and one cleanup but I can't get around that 20 minutes for 6 pieces printing time or the packaging to ship time. As I am not a factory in China I don't think I will be going into business with them anytime soon

But I will share with fellow Campster owners a copy of my 3D .stl printing file if anyone wants to make some for themselves. That is free, no shipping cost. Just send a pm with your email address.
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Old 06-21-2016, 09:33 PM   #25
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Name: Roger
Trailer: Trails West Campster andTeardrop American
California
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Well that's one way to.look at it. But not everyone has access to a 3d printer. For a lot of people, you're the only store in town. Maybe a complete kit sans glass is the way to go. ....... just a thought

You're doing good

Roger
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Old 06-21-2016, 11:38 PM   #26
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rwilhelm View Post
Well that's one way to.look at it. But not everyone has access to a 3d printer. For a lot of people, you're the only store in town. Maybe a complete kit sans glass is the way to go. ....... just a thought

You're doing good

Roger
I would never even consider going into the glass business, its too much of a make or break proposition

If you have the file you can send it to companies that do 3D printing as their regular business. You don't have to print it yourself. Shapeways is one of the better known ones who offer that service. The printer belongs to my friend, I just borrow time on it when he is not in the way. It sits right above his desk.
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Old 06-21-2016, 11:55 PM   #27
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Name: Roger
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Make or break??? Geeeeezzzz.

Gotcha
Thanks

Rog
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Old 06-23-2016, 05:48 PM   #28
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
Oregon
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Time to add another issue I have found with that Universal Rubber felt track. I got the window installed and it rained last night. Silly me I was not thinking ahead. I did not cut interim drainage slots into the bottom of the rubber felt window channel. So since I was parked on a slight slope all the water ran down the rubber felt gasket to the far end and spilled over into the inside of my trailer. Good thing it is gutted, there are no interior finishes to worry about. Guess it won't hurt anything at this point to open the window when the rain slacks off and take a knife to the bottom and see if I can cut some drain slots without removing the window again.

I think the felt track really does need to be made of woven fabric reinforced by metal but that it absolutely must not be a solid piece of metal but instead made up with metal segments so the water can pass through it and get out the weep holes. The Universal fit description for the rubber felt run channel from the automotive part sources does not mean it will work if not modified to allow for drainage

Did I tell you how much I hate these old windows and how much I long to stuff them into a dumpster? I am sure you know that by now! Oh well I will keep plugging away and see if I can make them work for another year. It might end up being that the only way to make them work for a year is to seal the glass in place to keep the water out.
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Old 06-24-2016, 09:10 AM   #29
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Name: Elizabeth
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I was just going to ask about drainage with the rubber track since I was cleaning out the track of one of my sliding windows (which was stuck again). in the process I noticed that the track needs to drain so water can get out the weep holes...

At this point most of the felt is gone from the tracks (at least the bottom track) but I still have the woven metal part. But the window slides again (sort of) so I can camp out tomorrow night. This will be a short shakedown trip to see what really needs to be fixed before the longer trip next month.
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Old 06-24-2016, 03:58 PM   #30
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Name: Kelly
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I did cut a few more slots yesterday evening around an 1/8" wide and about a half inch long length wise, into the rubber. That did let the water drain out so it could flow into the aluminum channel and out through the weep holes. I made the slots right at the bottom edge that faces the exterior placing them near to the weep holes in the aluminum channel and also one halfway between the weep holes. There was no overflow after last nights heavy rain so it seems to have resolved the issue.

I did not want to have to invest more money into felt channel so I did a "hack job" As is true of any hack job, sometimes they work, sometimes they don't. I got lucky this time.
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Old 06-24-2016, 04:18 PM   #31
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Trailer: 1971 Trails West Campster/1980 Scamp 13
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Here is my disclaimer: I have read part of this post but not all of it.

I have not taken my campster windows all of the way out but have replaced the screws on the inside, and yes they came with screens (over 1 side of the window) i replaced those the same way you would a house screen. I used nylon screen and the cord you can buy at any hardware store, and a litle roller.

The fabric channels the window slides back in forth in, i could not find anywhere, There nearest I found is you "may " be able to find that fabric (flat) at a custom automotive place (ie upholstry etc) and soak it and form it into your own u channel.

I wasnt able to find the rubber/plastic strips that actually "hold" the window glass in, but I am presuming a glass shop can help with that . Personally i never made it that far after I couldnt find the channel cloth.

And finally the clamp which grips onto the window I couldnt find, but just checked hardware stores, perhaps an actual window store might have these.

Hopefully this helped, and feel free to PM me if you have any more questions about this, maybe together we can figure something out.
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Old 06-24-2016, 05:06 PM   #32
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
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Hehr Standard Glass Seal


I ordered a sample of the seal in the photo above from Vintage Trailer Supply to check the fit as a potential replacement part. This seal does fit nicely into the space around the exterior of the fixed pane in the sliding windows. It will seal (lightly) against the glass and it is an improvement over the original in that it hooks over the edge of the aluminum channel so that no water can go down that edge on into the channel. But read on further below to find out what it won't do for you. You will have to take an easy to do step to make this seal work for you.

Here is a photo of the sample in position next to the original, badly UV damaged seal. Big improvement for that grungy old window, badly in need of help!



Unfortunately this seal is not a perfect solution because it will not solve the rattling glass issue that fixed pane is prone to as this seal does not put sufficient pressure against the glass to hold it firmly in position. But that is pretty minor as you can solve the rattle issue by using some silicone to adhere the glass pane along its edge to the aluminum frame. Just apply the silicone in such a way that it can be pulled loose in case you ever need to remove the pane. Also do not let the silicone block any weep holes or prevent water from moving out the weep holes. You can do most of the anti rattle silicone application at the top and side. That fixed glass pane will chip if it rides right against the metal on the edges so there is an advantage to having silicone between the edge of the glass and the aluminum frame.
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Old 06-24-2016, 05:57 PM   #33
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thee Jimbo View Post
Here is my disclaimer: I have read part of this post but not all of it.

I have not taken my campster windows all of the way out but have replaced the screws on the inside, and yes they came with screens (over 1 side of the window) i replaced those the same way you would a house screen. I used nylon screen and the cord you can buy at any hardware store, and a litle roller.

The fabric channels the window slides back in forth in, i could not find anywhere, There nearest I found is you "may " be able to find that fabric (flat) at a custom automotive place (ie upholstry etc) and soak it and form it into your own u channel.

I wasnt able to find the rubber/plastic strips that actually "hold" the window glass in, but I am presuming a glass shop can help with that . Personally i never made it that far after I couldnt find the channel cloth.

And finally the clamp which grips onto the window I couldnt find, but just checked hardware stores, perhaps an actual window store might have these.

Hopefully this helped, and feel free to PM me if you have any more questions about this, maybe together we can figure something out.
Thanks for contributing. We will solve much of this problem of window restoration by all working together at it. It does require a lot of time to track down sources, order samples, make things that no longer exist, etc.

We do have a local source in Seattle for supplies from the automotive industry, Perfect Fit McDonald. I can go there in person and meet with the sales rep. But all of their felt run channel made with cloth is too wide to fit the Campster.

Size wise there is a felted fabric channel that looks potentially to be a good fit. CRL 7/16" x 3/8" Universal Channel It is made with the same kind of wound metal for support that will eventually rust. But I can only find it in 100 foot rolls minimum. I did not contact them to see if I could obtain a sample. Also note that a sample will not tell you much. Testing with a sample I though the universal fit rubber channel I got you would work. However once the window was all put back together I could not close the window frame back together as it made the channel liner with glass sandwich too tall.
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Old 06-24-2016, 08:01 PM   #34
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
Oregon
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another seal for the Campster sliding window


I ordered a sample section of this seal from Vintage Trailer Supply and it has proven to be suitable for use in restoring the sliding windows of the Campster
Hehr Clear-View Window Strip

It is a good fit that can be used as one of the seals in the vertical aluminum extrusion that is in the center of the exterior forming the divider between the panes. This seal will locate on the side with the fixed pane of glass in the sliding unit. You will need a 3 foot length to do both of the two sliding windows. It slips into the extrusion channel before you put that piece in place. The side edge of the fixed pane of glass is cushioned against the short leg of the seal and the long leg lays down over the outside surface of the glass to prevent water intrusion. You might need to remove the other exterior seal that holds the fixed pane in place in order to shift the fixed pane into alignment so it butts against the short leg of the seal to help prevent water intrusion into the interior of the Campster. This silicone seal will also help to cushion the edge of the glass to stop rattling.

Unfortunately they currently have a minimum order of 24 feet from Vintage Trailer Supply as they have been selling it for use on the jalousie windows on Airstreams. But I hope we can convince them to sell it to us in a 3 foot length if we let them know it works for the Campster windows. I will put that on my list of email inquiries to make next week to find out if we can buy it as a shorter segment.

I was not even thinking of its use in that position, but then as I was holding it up to where I had considered it going I glanced in the right direction and realized I had another Bingo. Sometimes I get lucky

While I wish I could create a full materials list and a step by step photo tutorial for restoring the sliding windows I am not there yet on finding all the pieces of the puzzle of seals and parts. At this point I don't know if I will end up ordering new windows or continue on with the restoration; I am just documenting as I go along. I know it is not optimal but at least we are getting somewhat closer to being able to keep water out and have working sliding windows. I still have a few seals to find replacement solutions for.
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Old 06-26-2016, 01:42 PM   #35
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
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Another potential piece of the sliding window replacement seal puzzle has just showed up on Vintage Trailer Supply as a brand new item. Unfortunately it is not yet in stock so I have no way to order a sample. This piece will insert into the exterior vertical divider. It seals against the sliding window to keep out water, dirt, drafts, etc. (I did a temporary replacement fix for this seal on my window with piece of windshield wiper but it is not the perfect size)

I can't wait to get my hands on it to confirm my thinking that this is going to have fins that are tall enough to wipe against the sliding pane. It is a replacement for the 1960's era sliding windows so hopefully that means our Campster sliding windows will also be able to use it. With that slant on the fins you would install it one direction on the right side of the trailer and the opposite direction on the left. It will wipe water off the surface of the glass as you slide the window open.

I am trying to focus on using Vintage Trailer Supply for as many of the window gaskets as possible as they are having them made in silicone which won't have the shrinking and hardening problems of the original vinyl materials.

If this vertical finned seal proves out that leaves one last seal to find a replacement for. I think I will send Vintage Trailer Supply a chunk of it and see if it is in their plans to produce it in silicone. I will hold off on getting that one for a while longer if it is going to be available in silicone to match the rest of the seals. I do have an alternative potential candidate for that sole remaining seal but it is only made in black vinyl. I really would prefer it if all the seals matched in color, it just looks a lot more professional.

In case you are curious how to quickly sort out how to out the best candidates for a seal one of the things I do is take measurements from the window and/or existing seal. Then on the internet I try to find a measured image of the potential candidates for a seal that show a sectional view with the dimension lines shown on that view. Then I use the clipping tool on my computer and clip it right at the leader lines of a known dimension and save that as an image file. I then import it into a graphics program, in my case I am using Corel Draw for the graphic work. When I select that image in the program I can go to the size box that shows the height and width of the imported image, then I lock those dimensions to remain proportional. The next step is to type in correct size of the dimension that belong to the part. Then I can print it out as its real size and hold that image next to my original seal. I could even trim the image on the paper and test fit it at the location but so far I have not had to do that.

After 3 weeks of searching and testing and ordering samples there is now some strong light at the end of this tunnel even though we are not quite through it.
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Old 06-28-2016, 08:53 PM   #36
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
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Thanks to seeing a catalog with window parts on an unrelated window fix I managed to track down as "gray universal glazing spline" from CRL. It will work for the vinyl spline on the fixed pane for my 2 sliding windows as well that the fixed window at the front.

I located an Ebay seller who was offering a 100 foot roll of it for about $20.00 plus $5.00 for economy shipping. Now that is what I call budget friendly and I will still have lots of it left over. Having seen so many of the vinyl seals selling for $1.00 to almost $5.00 per foot a price of $0.20 cents per foot does rate as being affordable.
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Old 07-06-2016, 03:06 PM   #37
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Name: Kelly
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universal glazing spline CRL Campster windows

I received my roll of universal glazing spline, made by the CR Laurence Company. It is a PERFECT FIT to replace the vinyl seal that is used around the fixed window in the front and also the fixed window section in the sliders.

Here is a source for a 25' length of it. 59-068 Universal Glazing Spline, 25' : SWISCO.com

Other places sell it in a 100' roll for around $20.00. Check Ebay and Amazon for the best price on the 100' roll.



This will really help dress up those old windows and also solve some of the leaking issues. It comes in grey or black.
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Old 08-08-2016, 06:28 PM   #38
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Name: Kelly
Trailer: Trails West
Oregon
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vertical sweep seal sliding window


CRL Translucent Shower Door Vinyl "T" Seal and Sweep for 7/16" Maximum Gap - 32-5/8 in long


I finally got around to installing a seal I ordered for the sliding window. It goes on the exterior side of the window on the underside, against the glass of the vertical dividing bar. The original seal for mine was triple finned and had shrunk with time and also hardened.

What I put in its place was a clear vinyl seal made for installing on the bottom of a shower door. It has a single long fin, the top edge of the T shape is exactly the right width and thickness to fit into the T slot of the aluminum extrusion. While the illustration of the product makes it look as if the T is a 90 degree angle it is not, it has a slant in one direction. That is actually a nice advantage. You will face the slant towards the rear door. The seal then lays nicely and invisibly against the glass and will keep out the bugs and the drafts or driving rain. The window slides open easily and closes easily with the seal in place. I was dubious before I installed it as the product has a wavy edge from the vinyl being placed onto a roll while still warm as it came out of the extrusion machine, but it flattened out just fine once it was in place. Depending on where you order it there may or may not be adhesive applied to the top of the T. If you have a choice go for the one without adhesive or otherwise just leave the protective paper on the adhesive and slide it on up into the T. It is captured and going no where so adhesive is not required and would only make it difficult to slide into the slot.

It cost me just under $5.00 with free shipping. Keeping the skeeters, water and the drafts out...priceless
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