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Old 11-26-2018, 05:01 PM   #21
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Name: John & Gloria
Trailer: Bigfoot 21RB
Florida
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Robert, If you are curios about the weight of a 21ft Bigfoot, I just Recently weighed ours. It is the 21RB model. The fresh water tank was full and some stuff in the storage locker but nothing in the forward storage areas and only one propane tank installed. The holding tanks were empty. I did not have the WDH installed in order to get real weights. The weight on the tandem trailer axles alone was 4,340 lbs. The tongue weight was 380 lbs. Once we load the rig for the road I expect to see 500-600lbs tongue weight. and a total weight around 5,000 lbs
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Old 11-26-2018, 05:44 PM   #22
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Timely info. 500#-600# tongue weight doesn't sound good for Telescopist's plan.
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Old 11-26-2018, 06:09 PM   #23
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Trailer: Escape 2019 21. Tow Vehicle 2019 4Runner
Pennsylvania
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_L View Post
I tow both single and tandem axle trailers. Tandem definitely tows better.
In my opinion, the impact on the tug of going over a bump with a trailer depends in large part to the type of hitch used. A simple ball hitch just flexes without transmitting significant impact to the tug. A weight distributing hitch essentially makes the chassis of the tug and trailer a single unit. Impact applied to one is thus felt through both.
I understand your argument about the advantages of a tandem axle trailer. Is the "impact applied to one [and] felt through both" an event that is an improvement?
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Old 11-26-2018, 06:17 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by bobblangley View Post
I'm just wondering what you have for tongue weight and have you tried uping the TW , if so what were your observations.

Current tongue weight is approx 350# with trailer weight at 2500# and I have not played with it much yet.


When your trailer is hooked up does it have a slight nose down attitude?

Its current attitude appears to be slightly nose up.
350# sounds like enough.
Would be interesting to try it nose down or at least level,, know anyone with a bigger drop hitch than your running to try it.
Fred
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Old 11-26-2018, 06:31 PM   #25
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Name: Richard
Trailer: Escape 2019 21. Tow Vehicle 2019 4Runner
Pennsylvania
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Originally Posted by Raspy View Post
There are still a number of variables we don't know, the weight of the trailer will probably creep up to a higher number than you expect and weight distribution could change the stability of the trailer. Emergencies happen that require evasive maneuvers. Recommending the lesser of three options assumes we know more than we do and could endanger you.
So, the prudent recommendation is E2, but you should decide what you think is best. I'm glad to see you trying to do the right thing as far as safety and not just declaring there is no problem and doing nothing. There has been some pretty irresponsible recommendations made here over the years (not in this thread) and you are obviously being careful.
Thanks. The dry hitch weight of a 21 escape is listed as 360#. The dry axle weight - 2780#. Add the hitch weight @50# give or take. I think I'm sitting at around 3200#. Then of course I have to factor in 2 people some stuff in the vehicle, a full tank of gas and stuff in the trailer - maybe 715# (19 gallons of gas = 114#) for the tow. I'm up to 3,915# before putting anything in the trailer. I better be careful.
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Old 11-26-2018, 06:37 PM   #26
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I believe you have to add the weight of options too.
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Old 11-26-2018, 06:56 PM   #27
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Name: Michael
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Alberta
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I usually tow my 26 foot tandem axle trailer with a 3/4 diesel and a class V WDH. I have also towed it without a WDH. I don't find much difference between the two. Without the WDH, when the trailer goes over a bump, it bounces with little impact on the truck. With the WDH the trailer bounces less but I can feel it more in my truck although in neither case the bounce anything significant.
When I tow with a 1/2 tonne I need the WDH otherwise there is too much weight on the rear and not enough on the front which makes the steering too light.
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Old 11-26-2018, 07:10 PM   #28
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I'm not sure what you mean by "improvement"?
I see it more as a "consequence" without a "good" or "bad" aspect.
Without a WDH you have two separate chassis. Each can move somewhat independently of the other although there is likely to be some impact as they are joined through the ball.
With a WDH both chassis become one and the load somewhat equalized over both, thus when the trailer chassis bounces the energy it is more effectively transmitted to the tug chassis. Without the WDH much of this energy is dissipated through the ball as this joint is much more flexible.
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Old 11-26-2018, 07:59 PM   #29
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Name: Richard
Trailer: Escape 2019 21. Tow Vehicle 2019 4Runner
Pennsylvania
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Baglo View Post
I believe you have to add the weight of options too.
Understood.
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Old 11-26-2018, 08:01 PM   #30
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Name: Richard
Trailer: Escape 2019 21. Tow Vehicle 2019 4Runner
Pennsylvania
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_L View Post
I'm not sure what you mean by "improvement"?
I see it more as a "consequence" without a "good" or "bad" aspect.
Without a WDH you have two separate chassis. Each can move somewhat independently of the other although there is likely to be some impact as they are joined through the ball.
With a WDH both chassis become one and the load somewhat equalized over both, thus when the trailer chassis bounces the energy it is more effectively transmitted to the tug chassis. Without the WDH much of this energy is dissipated through the ball as this joint is much more flexible.
That is the best explanation I've read about the WDH and how it works. I appreciate that.
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Old 11-26-2018, 08:07 PM   #31
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I saw a video of a front wheel drive car attached to a trailer using a WDH. After they were connected they removed the rear wheels from the car and drove around the parking lot towing the trailer.
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Old 11-26-2018, 08:09 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_L View Post
I saw a video of a front wheel drive car attached to a trailer using a WDH. After they were connected they removed the rear wheels from the car and drove around the parking lot towing the trailer.

Proving what?
That it does what it is supposed to do, transferring weight from the rear axle of the tow vehicle to the front axle and to the trailer axle, distributing the weight? And that if you over compensate, you can make a video?
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Old 11-26-2018, 08:47 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Mike_L View Post
I saw a video of a front wheel drive car attached to a trailer using a WDH. After they were connected they removed the rear wheels from the car and drove around the parking lot towing the trailer.



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Old 11-26-2018, 09:06 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Telescopist View Post
Thanks. The dry hitch weight of a 21 escape is listed as 360#. The dry axle weight - 2780#. Add the hitch weight @50# give or take. I think I'm sitting at around 3200#. Then of course I have to factor in 2 people some stuff in the vehicle, a full tank of gas and stuff in the trailer - maybe 715# (19 gallons of gas = 114#) for the tow. I'm up to 3,915# before putting anything in the trailer. I better be careful.
Richard,

The weight can add up quickly, particularly the tongue weight as there is so much storage forward of the axles in the 21. On ours, that includes gear carried in that handy-dandy tongue box. I quoted some numbers in this post: http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...tml#post695033
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Old 11-26-2018, 09:35 PM   #35
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Name: Richard
Trailer: Escape 2019 21. Tow Vehicle 2019 4Runner
Pennsylvania
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Civilguy View Post
Richard,

The weight can add up quickly, particularly the tongue weight as there is so much storage forward of the axles in the 21. On ours, that includes gear carried in that handy-dandy tongue box. I quoted some numbers in this post: http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...tml#post695033
Much appreciated. I bookmarked your comments. Tomorrow I'll read through the entire thread. I have given some thought to the issue that the tongue weight will increase due to the storage box, all the junk in it, and the two propane tanks.

I'd like to stick with the Highlander if at all possible. At least 80% of the time it will serve a different function in my life beside towing a TT. That's probably why for months my intention was to go with a 19. It seemed like a more practical choice considering the tow vehicle. However, when I scrutinized the specifications of both trailers and discovered that the total dry weight of the 21 was *just* 260# more than the 19, I began to reconsider my choice. That and I like the layout of the 21 much more.
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Old 11-27-2018, 04:37 AM   #36
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Name: John & Gloria
Trailer: Bigfoot 21RB
Florida
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Richard, I think you will be fine towing the 21 with the Highlander. It would be good if it has all the equipment included in what is normally called "Towing Pkg H.D." The differential ratio is real important and the extra coolers really help in the summer temps, when climbing especially. The little extra it weighs over the 19 will make little difference if you get set up well and the fact that you are involved in discussions such as this proves that it will be done right. You must avoid that nagging part of our brain that will bug you with..... "I wish I would have gone bigger".
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Old 11-27-2018, 07:01 AM   #37
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Name: Richard
Trailer: Escape 2019 21. Tow Vehicle 2019 4Runner
Pennsylvania
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Originally Posted by Travelin2 View Post
Richard, I think you will be fine towing the 21 with the Highlander. It would be good if it has all the equipment included in what is normally called "Towing Pkg H.D." The differential ratio is real important and the extra coolers really help in the summer temps, when climbing especially. The little extra it weighs over the 19 will make little difference if you get set up well and the fact that you are involved in discussions such as this proves that it will be done right. You must avoid that nagging part of our brain that will bug you with..... "I wish I would have gone bigger".
You wrote: "You must avoid that nagging part of our brain that will bug you with..... "I wish I would have gone bigger"."

That's pretty funny. Just the sort of sentiment that I've read numerous times on various threads. Particularly those titled something like: '21 vs 19?'.
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Old 11-27-2018, 10:05 AM   #38
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You must avoid that nagging part of our brain that will bug you with..... "I wish I would have gone bigger".
This should do it!
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Old 11-27-2018, 11:05 AM   #39
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Name: Richard
Trailer: Escape 2019 21. Tow Vehicle 2019 4Runner
Pennsylvania
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This should do it!
Ideal set up for boondocking. Who's the MFG? I still haven't signed off on my build sheet.
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Old 11-27-2018, 11:19 AM   #40
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Name: John & Gloria
Trailer: Bigfoot 21RB
Florida
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I wonder if he has his WDH adjusted properly?
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