Jalousie torque arm misalignment - Fiberglass RV


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Old 06-26-2021, 02:04 PM   #1
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Jalousie torque arm misalignment

While reworking the front double window on my 1976 Trillium 1300 I noticed the torque arm misalignment shown in the attached pic. Notice the arm at the far end of the rod is vertical and the arm in the foreground is rotated CCW a few degrees. The rod is straight and does not appear to be damaged in any way. This is a double window so there are two of these assemblies. They both have the same issue. Almost. The other one is twisted in the CW direction by the same amount. Is this a result of constant operator torque being applied for 45 years or is there another reason for this?

Not sure why the pic is appearing rotated.
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Old 06-27-2021, 05:49 AM   #2
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?

Going to check ours in the front window to see if they are also like yours after the rain stops.
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Old 06-27-2021, 09:17 AM   #3
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I would say it's been over torqued.
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Old 06-27-2021, 10:00 AM   #4
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Over torqued was my initial assessment as well, Eric. There are two of these rod assemblies. One for each window. Each rod assy displays this same mystery "twist", but in opposite directions. This would be expected, as the crank mechanism for the left win is on the left and for the right win the mechanism is on the right. The problem in my mind is that the angle difference of the torque arms of each assembly appears to be exactly the same, all components are tight, and the extrusion marks in the tube show no signs of twisting.

I'm guessing this is a design feature. As a window is cranked closed the "twist" profile ensures the linkage at the far end of the rod will always force the window closed even after a little wear.

Surprised I haven't been able to find any discussion about this.
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Old 06-27-2021, 10:30 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cocorom View Post
Over torqued was my initial assessment as well, Eric. There are two of these rod assemblies. One for each window. Each rod assy displays this same mystery "twist", but in opposite directions. This would be expected, as the crank mechanism for the left win is on the left and for the right win the mechanism is on the right. The problem in my mind is that the angle difference of the torque arms of each assembly appears to be exactly the same, all components are tight, and the extrusion marks in the tube show no signs of twisting.

I'm guessing this is a design feature. As a window is cranked closed the "twist" profile ensures the linkage at the far end of the rod will always force the window closed even after a little wear.

Surprised I haven't been able to find any discussion about this.
Think your assessment makes sense as a design feature.
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Old 06-27-2021, 11:44 AM   #6
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The plot thickens. I have tried all combinations of arms and bars and have not found any combination that produces two bar assemblies with same arm orientations. There is always a right and a left bar assy.

I checked the remaining three windows with an angle copier and they all demonstrate this same angle offset between the two torque arms (about 2) -- the torque arm furthest from operator will apply more pressure on that side of window when closing.

If this "twist" were a design feature you would think you would have to specify right or left operator when purchasing a new rod. I have not found this to be the case.
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Old 06-27-2021, 05:53 PM   #7
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So I walked out to my 1980 Boler and looked the the two window and one has the twist and the other doesn't. Time to call in Scooby and the gang because we have a mystery.
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Old 06-28-2021, 09:00 AM   #8
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I believe the arms have two tabs that fit into the slot on the torque bar. With a little lubrication you might be able to slide the arm to the end of the bar and examine the tabs to see if they are bent.
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Old 06-28-2021, 09:16 AM   #9
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The tabs you speak of, Raz are the torque arms. The torque bars and arms are like new. No signs of wear including twisting. The torque bar assemblies are tight like new. The "misalignment" appears to be by design.

There is an easy way to check for this "misalignment" even if you don't have any fancy measuring tools. Simply close your window(s). Then from the outside try to pry open one of the louvers from its bottom corners. If yours has this "feature" you should notice the corner furthest from the operator held tighter to the window frame and the corner closest to the operator a little looser.
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Old 06-28-2021, 09:31 AM   #10
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On mine I can wiggle the arm. Removing the torque bar, I can slide the arm off the end. Mine are a much newer model so yours is most likely different. Also, the arms line up on mine.
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Old 06-28-2021, 11:42 AM   #11
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I can slide the torque arms off their bars as well. When assembled there is no play between the arms and bar at all.

Upon closer inspection I notice one of my other windows has been reworked. Its bar and arms are rusted a bit. Looks like the torque bar assembly has been replaced sometime along the way with an assy made with infieror material. This bar assy has the arms perfectly aligned.

I can sort of see how this might have happened. I am a product designer. Evolution is the name of the game. Years ago I can see how applying more force at the far end of the bar might have made sense. This extra force (travel) may have been imagined to accommodate the excess travel brought on by the remaining linkage wearing over time. By the mid eighties or sometime in their future they realized this wear didn't really happen the way they imagined so they removed the offset. This may be why my rusted replacement and your arms, Raz appear to be aligned.
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Old 06-28-2021, 12:11 PM   #12
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So what causes the offset, the tabs or the grooves? If you draw a line along the center of the arm, are the tabs perpendicular? If not, could an arm have been put on "backwards"? I get suspicious when I hear something has been "worked" on before.
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Old 06-28-2021, 12:55 PM   #13
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The slots cut into the two torque bars cause the offset. All four torque arms are identical in every way. They each have the same part number stamped on them.

This phenomenon prevents one side of each pane from sealing as well as the other side. This phenomenon may be partly to blame for the bad reputation these window have for sealing.

Sure would be nice to hear from someone who has been aware of this phenomenon through the years.
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