Moving the Scamp's "kitchen" to the outside, freeing up

[Tirah]

Hi All,

With summer coming, I'm beginning to think about all the mods I want to do to our 13' Scamp this summer, now that I have a carpentry and plumbing class under my belt.

One idea I've been thinking about is to either remove our Scamp's "kitchen" or make it much smaller (just a sink) so that that space could be used to make both the double and the bunk beds larger.

Even better might be some kind of flip-out kitchen like the ones on teardrop trailers.

Has anyone ever seen this type of thing done to a fiberglass trailer?

[Donna D.]

I don't know why it wouldn't work. Just remember, you have to leave something on that side to support the roof. Maybe by the door, you could build a floor to ceiling bookshelf-style support? Or is the kitchen on the other side? At any rate you still need something.

This should be an interesting mod to follow along..

[Raya]

There was a thread exploring this idea --- maybe about a year ago? Complete with computer-drawn layouts. Can't remember what it was called. But I do know that towards the end there were photos of a member's Scamp 13 deluxe (which has a larger bed and a kitchen that wraps around to the front wall), if that helps to find it (I'm sorry, I don't have time to search it right now).

Raya

[Mike Watters]

If you're considering an outside kitchen, you might consider just building a boy-scout-style chuck box. Certainly a lot simpler than trying to make it come out of the trailer. Whole separate issue than shrinking the kitchen cabinet inside. I think that's be great. Were you thinking of cutting down the size of the curbside closet as well or just having a wedge shaped bed?

[Frederick L. Simson]

[b]Just remember, you have to leave something on that side to support the roof.

I have seen trailers where the [b]Ice Box and the [b]Stove have been removed. BUT, the cabinetry remained to provide counter top and storage space. I see by your avatar that you have vents, indicating an optional propane [b]Fridge instead of the standard [b]Ice Box. Is that working? I would hesitate to remove that if it is.

[Raya]

I see by your avatar that you have vents, indicating an optional propane [b]Fridge instead of the standard [b]Ice Box. Is that working? I would hesitate to remove that if it is.

First of all, I'll have to admit that I'm one of those people who suffers(?) from a compulsion to preserve things that are in good, original condition - so from that point of view I hear you, Frederick. On the other hand, I always admire folks who can get "past" that and customize their trailers to suit themselves. So that side of me says to go ahead and make it "yours"!

And it's not like you have a brand new, $30,000 Oliver that you are proposing to "tear apart." I looks like your basic 13-er (almost a blank canvas )

There are a number of ways to keep the structure from sagging*, so I would say that it's not so much a matter of being sure you keep the original support, as it is understanding that you need to have some (correct) support in there, however you go about providing it.

The propane fridge is a sought after item, and relatively expensive to replace, so you do want to think about that. But I wouldn't say it's a deal-breaker if you're not planning to sell the trailer soon (as I imagine you're not if you're going to customize it). And you could certainly sell it here.

Raya

*for example to keep the roof of a house from flattening outwards (as it is wont to do), you can have the usual ceiling rafters, or collar ties, or even a structural ridge (and I'm sure there are more ways). Triangles are good, however you get them

[Raya]

Tirah,

Aha! Found it! This thread (started by Kevin K.) expands a bit on the diminished kitchen idea (and includes photos of Lorene's droolworthy Scamp 13 Deluxe - I can only console myself that it's heavier than a regular one ).

Raya

http://www.fiberglassrv.com/board/index.ph...mp;#entry286718

[Kevin K]

This is the way I would like my Scamp setup. (Bed 5' 5" wide and 6' 2" long)

















I have a 13' Scamp now that's in very good shape and I don't want to take it apart to make it look like this. So I have been looking for a fixer upper.

[Raya]

I've thought about changing mine that way too, Kevin (I love your sketches, btw). I like the table and bed together vs. dinette up front and bed in back (said as if they were miles apart )

Since I travel solo, I had though that with a mod like this I could use the back-wall part as a crosswise bed, and then have two "jump" seats and the table take up the forwardmost bed portion (like in the photos of Jim U.'s Casita when he had it for sale). I also like the idea of the big window over the kitchen counter, as I've never liked having upper cabinets when I'm working (have removed them in houses and subbed with a pantry to pleasant effect). Right now I'm suffering from "original-fever" though, as my Boler is very unchanged, so not sure.

For just me, I had another idea I liked even better, but it wouldn't work without moving/removing the propane fridge, and I'd like to keep it where it is. That idea consisted of one ample (32" wide) single bed running lengthwise from the back on the driver's side, with the table more-or-less where it is now (a bit narrower) and then the original seat on the passenger side. Then the kitchen in front with a closet by the door. Original closet remaining as-is. This would give me my "main settee with table alongside at my right hand side" that I really like. Also, for two, the original across bunk could be used (taking down dinette table). (Original above-kitchen cupboards could remain, and support could be devised.)

The trouble with that plan is that there is only about 68" before I run into the fridge. Rats. It will stay just a plan for now, I guess.

I have been thinking of one other thing I might try - something that's easy to do without making anything more then very temporary changes. It would address the "where's my comfortable chair" question.

That would be to sleep on the front bench (with the bunk top removed, it's 28" wide at the hip area - I'm used to boats so that's actually generous. I already have a "sits in place with no screws" counter running across from the stove to the front wall, which could stay if I have my feet at that end.

Then instead of the dinette (which has two benches and a table, when I could use two tables....) have "counters/tables/desks" above where each of the benches now (I already have one mocked up at the foot of the double bed next to the kitchen), and a comfy office/swivel/lean-backy/with arms chair in the middle.

That's probably too radical, but I don't mind trying things that only involve cardboard or 1/8" scrap ply mockups and no permanent marks Might be nice for a solo/project/writing sort of traveler. Multiple people could still sit inside if the front bed were made up as a couch (although it seems that more often multiple people sit around outside).

Now if only I had accompanied this with nifty Google Sketchups!

Raya

Raya

[Tirah]

Tirah,

Aha! Found it! This thread (started by Kevin K.) expands a bit on the diminished kitchen idea (and includes photos of Lorene's droolworthy Scamp 13 Deluxe - I can only console myself that it's heavier than a regular one ).

Raya

http://www.fiberglassrv.com/board/index.ph...mp;#entry286718

Thanks for that link! That string is really useful, and that trailer is absolutely fantastic with all that good use of the space. I can't believe they have that much storage space!

[Tirah]

I don't know why it wouldn't work. Just remember, you have to leave something on that side to support the roof. Maybe by the door, you could build a floor to ceiling bookshelf-style support? Or is the kitchen on the other side? At any rate you still need something.

This should be an interesting mod to follow along..

Hmm, I'm glad you mentioned that, because I hadn't really even thought about the fact that the cabinetry is also supporting the wall/roof. The kitchen is indeed on the far side (not the doorside).

I like the idea of floor-to-ceiling bookshelf support (especially if the upper shelves could be useable). With two kids and two adults, we have absolutely no storage space in there.

[Roger C H]

It reminds me of a T[at]B:

http://www.tab-rv.com/specs/Lfloorplan.php

Looks good, but a little on the heavy side.

You should have used balsa wood.

[Tirah]

If you're considering an outside kitchen, you might consider just building a boy-scout-style chuck box. Certainly a lot simpler than trying to make it come out of the trailer. Whole separate issue than shrinking the kitchen cabinet inside. I think that's be great. Were you thinking of cutting down the size of the curbside closet as well or just having a wedge shaped bed?

I was thinking about that chuck box idea. Ideally, something like a lightweight, portable "island" that had propane stove, electrical outlet, water, and grey water-sewer hookups.

I was thinking of modifying that closet, too, after I do the kitchen mod. Our closet space currently holds a microwave and a/c, so the empty space below those could be used to accommodate the larger bed.

[Tirah]

I have seen trailers where the [b]Ice Box and the [b]Stove have been removed. BUT, the cabinetry remained to provide counter top and storage space. I see by your avatar that you have vents, indicating an optional propane [b]Fridge instead of the standard [b]Ice Box. Is that working? I would hesitate to remove that if it is.

That fridge does work, but we never use it. We typically prepare food outside and use a large ice chest. Our two kids sleep on two, portable wood platforms on the floor under the fridge (which essentially creates a twin-sized bed on the floor), and since we like to keep the beds setup during the day, it makes it a little inconvenient to get into the fridge.

I'm thinking that if I reconfigure the trailer now, I'll keep in mind that someday down the road when/if we resell, I might want to reconfigure it back to the original plan. So I'll save the old appliances/cabinetry and try to do this mod so that it's not too difficult to bring back to original configuration.

[Tirah]

First of all, I'll have to admit that I'm one of those people who suffers(?) from a compulsion to preserve things that are in good, original condition - so from that point of view I hear you, Frederick. On the other hand, I always admire folks who can get "past" that and customize their trailers to suit themselves. So that side of me says to go ahead and make it "yours"!

And it's not like you have a brand new, $30,000 Oliver that you are proposing to "tear apart." I looks like your basic 13-er (almost a blank canvas )

There are a number of ways to keep the structure from sagging*, so I would say that it's not so much a matter of being sure you keep the original support, as it is understanding that you need to have some (correct) support in there, however you go about providing it.

The propane fridge is a sought after item, and relatively expensive to replace, so you do want to think about that. But I wouldn't say it's a deal-breaker if you're not planning to sell the trailer soon (as I imagine you're not if you're going to customize it). And you could certainly sell it here.

Raya

*for example to keep the roof of a house from flattening outwards (as it is wont to do), you can have the usual ceiling rafters, or collar ties, or even a structural ridge (and I'm sure there are more ways). Triangles are good, however you get them

I think we plan to hang onto the trailer until our retirement, when we'll be ready to start spending more time camping and are ready to buy a more powerful tow vehicle (and sadly, we have probably another 30 years until retirement..hehe).

Our trailer is pretty "dumpy" inside (it was lived in full-time for a while by the previous owner), so I'm not too terribly worried about making any changes. I'll definitely be keeping all the appliances and cabinetry that I remove for this mod- with the knowledge that I'll have to put it all back in when we're ready to sell the trailer.

[Roger C H]

Here is a chuck box:

http://www.camping-boxes.com/Catalog/Class...cfm?refer=yahoo

[Tirah]

This is the way I would like my Scamp setup. (Bed 5' 5" wide and 6' 2" long)


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I have a 13' Scamp now that's in very good shape and I don't want to take it apart to make it look like this. So I have been looking for a fixer upper.

That's exactly the bed setup I'm thinking of. I know what you mean about not wanting to change a perfectly good trailer. Ours is a mess already, so any modifications are a step up from what we currently have.

We have the bunks on the far side of the wall, so I'd also love to be able to make them a little wider, so the kids might actually want to sleep in them rather than with us or on the floor.

[Tirah]

Here is a chuck box:

http://www.camping-boxes.com/Catalog/Class...cfm?refer=yahoo

Ooh! Neat! Throw in a sink, and that would be exactly what I have in mind!

[Tirah]

I'm thinking of this:

[Vi Turner]

It reminds me of a T[at]B:

http://www.tab-rv.com/specs/Lfloorplan.php

Looks good, but a little on the heavy side.

You should have used balsa wood.

Tab is really neat, but with an interior height of 5'9", it would give me claustrophobia! Cute floor plan, though. Has anyone seen one of these?