Musing from a new Scamp owner - Page 6 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 04-22-2016, 08:06 AM   #101
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An entry level 13' scamp is less than 10k. That's what I was refering to.
That's the base price of $9,995. If you want electric brakes or a screen door or a grey-water tank, or whatever, they're extra:

http://www.scamptrailers.com/images/...14_Catalog.pdf

Reminds me of the days when an oil filter was an extra-cost option on a Chevrolet.

The Scamp 16 with the side dinette and bathroom (Layout 6), which is what we would like, with its Option Package is $15,895. Additional options, like roof fan, AC, furnace, awning, etc., etc. will push the price toward $21k. At that point, a 10-15 year old Scamp or Casita starts to look easier on the wallet. I only wish they were easier to find where we live!

But hey, it's all relative. The first molded fiberglass trailer I looked at on-line was the Oliver. Pretty neat, I thought, with the double-walled hull and all. The Oliver is a brilliant implementation of fiberglass construction, with much of the interior molded as well as the exterior, making for a clean, elegant look with minimal fasteners and attachments to come loose, rattle, and leak. I emailed to ask about the cost. Glad I was sitting down: base price: $45,000!

Well, at this point, for a vehicle we're not going to use every day, or even every month, $10k seems more in line with our needs. Obviously YMMV (as it were).

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Old 04-22-2016, 08:41 AM   #102
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That's the base price of $9,995. If you want electric brakes or a screen door or a grey-water tank, or whatever, they're extra... Reminds me of the days when an oil filter was an extra-cost option on a Chevrolet...
Not everyone has the same idea about what camping entails. Some of us like the simplicity of a very basic unit. And we appreciate that Scamp still gives that option.

But I agree, a fully-loaded Scamp can get pricey, and takes you close price-wise to some of its popular competitors. Of course, many of those other items you mentioned- AC, awning, furnace- are extra-cost options on the competition, too.

It it were easy, this forum would be dull!
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Old 04-22-2016, 10:21 AM   #103
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Originally Posted by Jon in AZ View Post
Not everyone has the same idea about what camping entails. Some of us like the simplicity of a very basic unit. And we appreciate that Scamp still gives that option.

But I agree, a fully-loaded Scamp can get pricey, and takes you close price-wise to some of its popular competitors. Of course, many of those other items you mentioned- AC, awning, furnace- are extra-cost options on the competition, too.

It it were easy, this forum would be dull!
If you plan to travel anyway, a fully loaded Scamp13D is free (in a few years).
A couple of years ago, I stayed in a Holiday Inn Express... with tax the bill was $114 in a rural small town along the Interstate.

Saving just half of that rate, my fully loaded Scamp was paid for in less than five years with moderate use. Just two years at the full rate.
So it has now paid for itself between 3 and 6 times.

The camper has more accommodations than most motel rooms and you don't have to carry luggage up and down. Motels start looking icky after you get used to your own bed and shower.
We have even found the our camper to be free to tow, although a bit slower than travel without it.

Private vehicles require a little maintenance but they sure beat taking the bus.
Travel trailers require a little maintenance but they sure beat a motel or a tent
All that and the trailer still has value.

Some of the above applies to most fiberglass trailers.


What popular competitor offers anything which compares to a Scamp13D?
Go larger and the choices broaden,but their is an incremental increase in expense and loss in versatility.
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Old 04-22-2016, 10:45 AM   #104
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Priceless!

Floyd, that is exactly what got us into camping (or back into camping, in my case) in the first place. When my sister-in-law decided to rent out her condo in San Diego, we started with motels. Not too bad during the recession, but that's over, and rising prices forced us further inland, which kind of defeats the point. That led us to tenting, and then (quickly) to the Scamp. I didn't buy a Scamp because I believed it to be the best RV on the planet. I bought it because it was the very best among the alternatives I could afford. I still think that.

Four nights at the Hilton Garden Inn in Carlsbad, across a 4-lane divided highway from the beach, about $1000. Four nights at South Carlsbad Beach State Park, one flight of stairs from the same beach, $150. Five trips and the Scamp is paid for, including the added gas to tow. And the Scamp is worth more now than I paid for it! Morning coffee on the beach, priceless!
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Old 04-22-2016, 11:32 AM   #105
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Living in a Scamp

I haven't read every post in this thread, but I feel compelled to add to the conversation.
My '72 Scamp 13 is one of the first ever built. The first season that I lived in it, I had the original fiberglass cabinets. I found it hard to believe that they cut the outlet boxes out of square. In other words....crooked. A simple job to do right. But they didn't, and I couldn't help seeing it every day. I spent that season being a little ticked-off at that unseen, but imagined, employee, doing a sloppy job on a Friday afternoon. In retrospect, the buck stops at the owners of the company and their lack of supervision, or their lack of interest in quality. They still have a fine product, but obviously, attention to detail is not their strong point.

So, what do I think? I think it's a durable shell that lends itself to your own modifications. I didn't mind gutting out most of it. There wasn't much to loose. Now it's my full time home for 5 months of the year, and it's hard to say if it's become me, or I've become it. But there seems to be a love affair going on here. I wouldn't part with it for anything.

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Old 04-22-2016, 03:35 PM   #106
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I understand, Gordon. I had a love/hate relationship with my Scamp. But hate won out, so we got "divorced!" Her replacement is built better, looks better (although I will concede that beauty is in the eye of the beholder), more reliable (not as high maintenance so she gives me far fewer headaches), definitely has a better bed, and her "parents" are a whole hell of a lot easier to deal with than Scamp's were. It's a pleasure to go places with her, with Scamp, not so much. With her, there was always something wrong.


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Old 04-22-2016, 04:25 PM   #107
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CPW,

I'm glad that traveling has become more enjoyable for you. Those Escapes are beautiful.

Maybe, the fact that nothing original remains inside my Scamp but the closet (and who knows how long that will last), has given me the realization that there's not much left to go wrong that I can blame Scamp for. I can blame myself, now.

If you can think of an old Scamp as a "Handyman's Special", then it's OK. But, I too, would be unhappy if I bought a new one with unacceptable flaws.

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Old 04-22-2016, 04:27 PM   #108
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I understand, Gordon. I had a love/hate relationship with my Scamp. But hate won out, so we got "divorced!" Her replacement is built better, looks better (although I will concede that beauty is in the eye of the beholder), more reliable (not as high maintenance so she gives me far fewer headaches), definitely has a better bed, and her "parents" are a whole hell of a lot easier to deal with than Scamp's were. It's a pleasure to go places with her, with Scamp, not so much. With her, there was always something wrong.
For a second there Carl I had flashbacks of my EX
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Old 04-22-2016, 06:14 PM   #109
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Gordon,
I forced to be totally honest, while the flaws were many and could have been avoided had Scamp had any type of quality control, I begrudgingly addressed all the flaws which should not have been there in the first place. But there were two things that could not be addressed. First, to add a second axle as Merle did would have been a major reconstruction. I wasn't "mentally comfortable" with only one axle. Second, with the bed configuration in the 19 deluxe, my significant other would always have to climb over me if she wanted to get up in the middle of the night. Plus, foam pads as a mattress suck when you want to sleep well and not wake up with aches and pains, especially if you are middle age or older.


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Old 04-22-2016, 06:27 PM   #110
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For a second there Carl I had flashbacks of my EX

Sorry, Dave. Didn't mean to remind you of any unpleasant moments in your past!


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Old 04-22-2016, 08:56 PM   #111
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I bought a 1985 16' Scamp kit.
Really the only thing hinges I was able to use was the idea, shell, and back half of the frame.
The floors go away due to leaks (deserved or otherwise)
Now I am the only one to blame for any problems on my "Scamp".
I have around $7000 in my rig and it has the features I wanted and whatever problems I designed and built in.
I don't think I could have bought what we wanted with twin beds and front bath anyway so I guess you get what you pay for if you are lucky.
Our setup is heavier than the original but it is lots stronger too.

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Old 04-22-2016, 09:12 PM   #112
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Well...after reading all of this

I guess after reading all of this...I better just leave my 2016 - 13 Deluxe out by the curb for the Monday trash pick up.

So if anyone is looking for an almost new.."SURE TO LEAK" ..too expensive POS..(at least that's what a lot of people are inferring)...then stop by the house and pick it up before waste management gets it...

I am so sad that I don't have as much $$ as Dave...

I am so sad...I just picked it up in Backus on Jan 2nd....and now after reading all of this...oh my...I am surprised that it has even held together this long...oh Whoa is me
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Old 04-22-2016, 10:43 PM   #113
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I guess after reading all of this...I better just leave my 2016 - 13 Deluxe out by the curb for the Monday trash pick up.

So if anyone is looking for an almost new.."SURE TO LEAK" ..too expensive POS..(at least that's what a lot of people are inferring)...then stop by the house and pick it up before waste management gets it...

I am so sad that I don't have as much $$ as Dave...

I am so sad...I just picked it up in Backus on Jan 2nd....and now after reading all of this...oh my...I am surprised that it has even held together this long...oh Whoa is me
You hit the nail on the head dude!
Kinda begs the question...don't it?
Gratuitousness defined.
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Old 04-23-2016, 04:00 AM   #114
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I guess after reading all of this...I better just leave my 2016 - 13 Deluxe out by the curb for the Monday trash pick up.

So if anyone is looking for an almost new.."SURE TO LEAK" ..too expensive POS..(at least that's what a lot of people are inferring)...then stop by the house and pick it up before waste management gets it...

I am so sad that I don't have as much $$ as Dave...

I am so sad...I just picked it up in Backus on Jan 2nd....and now after reading all of this...oh my...I am surprised that it has even held together this long...oh Whoa is me
Wow
I sure hope this is an attempt at humor, because if you really came to that conclusion after reading this thread, and especially my posts, you missed the mark by light years.

Sure to leak? Who said that? I had four leaks in the first six months, that's a stone cold fact. One was clearly caused by shoddy work while the others could have differing causes.

By the way, the 13 Deluxe is quite a bit different from a 16 Standard, so it is not a good comparison. (And I would almost bet you store it under cover, out of the rain)
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Old 04-23-2016, 04:31 AM   #115
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Wow
I sure hope this is an attempt at humor, because if you really came to that conclusion after reading this thread, and especially my posts, you missed the mark by light years.
Sure to leak? Who said that? I had four leaks in the first six months, that's a stone cold fact. One was clearly caused by shoddy work while the others could have differing causes.
By the way, the 13 Deluxe is quite a bit different from a 16 Standard, so it is not a good comparison. (And I would almost bet you store it under cover, out of the rain)
I have to agree with you Gordon, your posts from the start has been nothing but comments of your experience and not a tissy fit against the brand. All things may have different problems from the start. I bought a brand new GM car that started falling apart 30 days after I brought it home. Long story but I won't have another Gm vehicle. Must have been a Friday build .
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Old 04-23-2016, 05:12 AM   #116
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Yup. Reality is that it's human nature to roll your sleeves down a bit in Friday when it's 5 o'clock somewhere. Unfortunately the consumer you don't know or have any attachment to lives with your quest to bring on the weekend!

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Old 04-23-2016, 05:18 AM   #117
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Wow
I sure hope this is an attempt at humor, because if you really came to that conclusion after reading this thread, and especially my posts, you missed the mark by light years

Gordon, I wouldn't worry to much. What you are seeing is the typical reaction of some members of this forum who rally around Scamp the moment anything remotely negative is stated about their beloved trailer brand. They often do so with sarcasm because it is primarily a defensive weapon employed by those who find it difficult to use rationale rather than emotion to rebut any statement made by another person that is contrary to their own personal belief (doesn't have to be about Scamp; it could be a favorite beverage, TV show, college sports team, political candidate, religious leaning, etc.). It isn't enough for them to respond by saying "I'm sorry you've had those problems with your Scamp; I haven't had that kind of experience with mine." Instead they feel compelled react in a method that implies you are being untruthful or unfair even though you are simply relating facts pertaining to your particular (individual) experience. You see it in human interaction all the time. It is not unlike the parent who, when told of their offspring's transgression immediately comes to his defense, "My child wouldn't do that, he is a good boy." They simply cannot accept the fact that other people have differing opinions or attitudes, and seemingly make it their goal to convince them to change their mind (which isn't going to happen 99% + of the time) or to prove to everyone else that only their belief is valid. It is the adult version of "playground behavior."


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Old 04-23-2016, 07:03 AM   #118
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I guess after reading all of this...I better just leave my 2016 - 13 Deluxe out by the curb for the Monday trash pick up.

So if anyone is looking for an almost new.."SURE TO LEAK" ..too expensive POS..(at least that's what a lot of people are inferring)...then stop by the house and pick it up before waste management gets it...

I am so sad that I don't have as much $$ as Dave...

I am so sad...I just picked it up in Backus on Jan 2nd....and now after reading all of this...oh my...I am surprised that it has even held together this long...oh Whoa is me
I understand the frustration over the leaks in the new Scamp and I also understand the difficulty in building it with NO leaks.
The type of construction would seem to be less prone to leak and it is...REALLY.
The devil is in the details in these things.
The fit of the interior bulkheads with the outside (or inside for that matter) is not and cannot be perfect. The pop rivets cannot pull these really tightly together and there is the insulation whether or not it is the Ensolite or the Reflectex and Rat Fur. This means that there is the very good chance that these junctions between the bulkheads and furnishings with the flexing of the trailer.
These relative movements will "work" the pop rivets and have a good chance to leak. If a rivet gets loose this is a pretty good indicator of that flexing.
The Deluxe models with "wood" bulkheads and cabinets actually provide a better backing and a tighter connection between the shell and the interernals.
When they pull up tight they also help provide a backstop (of wood unfortunately) against leaking.
If you have or want a Scamp then I think you have to be vigilant about leaks both through the many penetrations for the pop rivets, cables, water, and windows.
I put my Scamp together with SS screws into oak or pine internals with polyurethane glue for a sealant under countersunk washers and on the shank of the screws and still had one or two leaks.
Also the windows had some leaks that had to be redone.
Since I did these for myself and not (all) on Friday and and some leaks it can happen to anyone.
HOWEVER while old Scamps abound they (over 20 to 30 years) many have rotten floors. A small leak WILL rot out the floor! So it is vital to keep a check on leaks from any source.
I think a lot of these old trailers have been rode hard and put up wet and been disused and semi-abandoned for a long time.
Stickies fair (usually) much worse. The long seams tend to leak with use and sitting as well and the total area if available leaking space is much greater and you see few really old ones (other than Airstream) surviving.
The Scamp is more expensive to build and undoubtedly could stand a better acceptance testing procedure at the factory. If you want something like this with the advantages then you have a decision, because they are what they are. Compared to a 16' Airstream they are really cheap (look in the 16' Bambi and you can see why!)
I would not have had the parts to start with if I had chosen a 1985 sticky trailer. And it would be less aerodynamic. I can't speak for the lightness since I reinforced the frame relentlessly (probably overkill, but I couldn't help myself).
My advice is to fix the problems and then try to accept the limitations and get on with life. It's too short to worry about a few fixable items on a new trailer. If you can't get past it then there are probably folks here who would give fair money for a shook down Scamp ready to camp.
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Old 04-23-2016, 08:21 AM   #119
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...
The type of construction would seem to be less prone to leak and it is...REALLY.
The devil is in the details in these things.....
Well said, and good information in your post.

My goal was (and is) to provide information that will help primarily new customers come to the table with reasonable expectations and be prepared with the knowledge to deal with issues like those I have come across.

Although I would not be surprised to get a leak or two on a new trailer, I do think that four in six months is a bit much. Of course some people get more, some get less, some get none, so it all evens out.

But I am not blaming Scamp entirely. In fact, here is my assessment of the causes:

Leak #1: Obviously caused by incomplete caulking where a gap was clearly visible and should have been caught by the worker or in an inspection.

Leak #2: I never did determine the source so I cannot say but in the process of adding caulk to a number of possible problem locations I did see some work that I thought was not sufficient. In particular, the sealant where the wires for the upper (2ed set of) tail lights on the starboard side enter the body appeared from the outside to be insufficient. However if one could check it from the inside (under the rat fur and insulation) then perhaps it would be found to be sufficient.

Leak #3: This does appear to be caused by a rivet flexing over time and causing a leak after some time and miles. It was OK before and never would have showed a problem in an inspection. Chalk it up to normal maintenance.

Leak #4: Caused by bad caulk in the front window but it rather looks like something was wrong with the caulk and not so much with the application of it. It looked like it could have been contaminated by some chemical. Probably an anomaly and not something one would see very often in a new trailer.

As for the flexing of the trailer on the road and itís effect on the rivets, it looks like that caused a perfectly good rivet to lose itís acorn nut on the bath wall, and in these photos you can see that the bath wall has flexed enough to cause the caulking to separate. This would of course allow water to leak out during a shower. Iím not complaining about this however, itís part of maintaining a rolling home. Itís a pretty easy fix and I donít plan to use the shower anyway. I just thought it is good information for new buyers.
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Old 04-23-2016, 08:52 AM   #120
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Hi: gordon2... You can take some solace in the fact that no one wants to arrest you over your "Leaks".
Alf S. North shore of Lake Erie
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