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Old 08-06-2017, 02:17 PM   #21
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Name: Jann
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[QUOTE=Borrego Dave;654725]
Quote:
Originally Posted by k corbin View Post
I just wanted to survey for answers of where the common entry points of the gas line through the shell are.
I am a professional aircraft mechanic. QUOTE]

I think your answer is that any RVs LP lines are installed in a general area, run from the tank, under or in the RV and then come up through the floor close to the first unit needing LP and tees to other LP users. Your choice with your TTs layout. With millions of Rvs travelling many millions of miles out there, adding protection to the LP line for any road rash may be a bit overkill. I've never heard of any RV having a problem with that, rocks or salt. Now if our little eggs could fly I may have a different opinion on that but LP isn't rocket science either .
K Corbin was asking where to put the lines and was concerned about damaging the line. Putting a thin light weight insulation like the wires in your vehicle are encased in was to let him know what a possibility was. I am happy my RV has the insulated tubing.
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Old 08-12-2017, 01:28 PM   #22
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For what it's worth the copper lines on my 1999 Casita are clamped to washers welded to the frame with plastic lined clamps like what would be used for wires. The appliances all have their own lines and they enter the body in areas close to the appliance they serve and ALL joints other then where they attatch to the appliances are accessible from underneath the trailer, no other fittings inside.

Joe
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Old 08-12-2017, 02:27 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by k corbin View Post
I am working on renovating my circa 1970 Campster. The original propane installation comes up through the floor in the kitchen area. That meant the propane line ran underneath the trailer for more than a 6 foot distance. I am not sure that is a great idea to have a soft copper tube or a rubber hose run exposed for that long a distance underneath a trailer without protection. A previous owner had cut the propane line off underneath the trailer just before it.
My previous trailers and others I've looked at had black 1/2" sch 40 piping under the trailer that had brass flare fittings screwed into black tees near the appliances. Then copper came up through the skin of the trailer.
My Oliver has copper running all the way back and flare TEEs where it then branches to feed up to the appliances. The copper along the frame seems pretty vulnerable to me.

Not sure either method is perfect, but manufacturers seem to want the lines outside for as far as possible and that also makes the run more direct. If I was re-plumbing my propane, I'd run the 1/2" copper inside a 1/2" PEX tube, EMT conduit or sch 40 PVC for protection. As you know, copper is so easily dented.
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Old 08-12-2017, 08:15 PM   #24
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In the Casita I am working on, theline comes in the front, just under where the electric enters. The rubber switches to copper in that entry area, and the copper then runs around the front to the side where the appliances are, then to the back where the water heater goes
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Old 08-12-2017, 08:40 PM   #25
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I'm no expert, but it was my understanding from past discussions that codes in at least some locations REQUIRE that all gas fittings (T's and such) be located outside the living space other than the final connection to the appliance itself. Even if not true, that makes sense to me from a safety standpoint.
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Old 08-12-2017, 08:46 PM   #26
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My Casita is 1988 so regs may have changed.
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Old 08-12-2017, 09:29 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Romas View Post
KC
For what it's worth the copper lines on my 1999 Casita are clamped to washers welded to the frame with plastic lined clamps like what would be used for wires. The appliances all have their own lines and they enter the body in areas close to the appliance they serve and ALL joints other then where they attatch to the appliances are accessible from underneath the trailer, no other fittings inside.

Joe
Casita will not put a fitting inside their trailers. When we bought our 2007 we had found out that the stove sat so that the burners were side by side. The knobs were positioned so that when you lit the front burner you could get burned. I brought this up to our salesman. He said that they would not turn the stove so that it was front to back burners with the knobs on the left side because they would have to put a fitting under the stove top. After much argument on this I ordered my trailer and told him I would not accept it with the stove the wrong way. When we went to pick it up I asked about the stove the first thing and he said we'd go look at it. Well they had turned the stove the way I wanted because one of the men that demonstrated the units got a bad burn on his arm just like I said would happen. They had to bend the tubing different so that it did not include a fitting. Sometimes the customer is right and unfortunately it took a bad burn to make them see that.
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Old 08-12-2017, 09:40 PM   #28
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Texas code has it's quirks. When I asked about deleting the stove hood from a new trailer I was told it was mandatory by code to have the exhaust over a propane cooking surface and Casita would not delete it.
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Old 08-12-2017, 11:48 PM   #29
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Name: Steve
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I have an Escape 5.0 TA built in June/July 2017. The propane bottles are stored in the front of the trailer in an enclosed storage area. There is a hole in the floor of that box with a plastic tube which vents the box in case of a propane leak. At the back of that box (storage area), the propane line sticks thru the floor behind a metal frame area and travels backwards and diagonally towards the drivers side. It then goes straight back along a frame member and has 3 T unions on the drivers side. One T allows the line to go up into the furnace, one T for the refrigerator, an elbow for the hot water heater and another T sends the line across to the passenger side where it meets a 90 elbow and goes up to the propane stove. The lines are copper with brass T and 90 degree elbows and they are very well wrapped with the black plastic electrical flex tubing. They are tucked in above the frame so I don't worry about rock strikes damaging them. I also noticed that the slit in the flex tubing is on the bottom presumably so any propane leak can easily escape and not collect within the tubing. Lots of black tie wraps holding the plastic flex tubing to the copper line.
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Old 08-13-2017, 11:27 AM   #30
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Trailer: 1987 Casita 16
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questions

Would you mind telling us what you decide to do? Also, what you will be using. I am working on a 88 Casita, and it has copper inside with fittings. I ask my neighbor who has been in Heating and A/C for many years, and he said it's fine, except that flare fittings might after time leak. since currently all the fittings are inside, I was thinking about bringing them up through the floor as some others have said their lines run. Smart? or Unnecessary?
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Old 08-13-2017, 01:05 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tractors1 View Post
Texas code has it's quirks. When I asked about deleting the stove hood from a new trailer I was told it was mandatory by code to have the exhaust over a propane cooking surface and Casita would not delete it.
I was not trying to get Casita to delete the stove hood. I was trying to get them to turn the stove so you didn't have to reach over the burner to light it. If you look at 2006 and early 2007 models the stove is turned different.
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Old 08-13-2017, 05:34 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jann Todd View Post
I was not trying to get Casita to delete the stove hood. I was trying to get them to turn the stove so you didn't have to reach over the burner to light it. If you look at 2006 and early 2007 models the stove is turned different.
Turning the stove 90 degrees is a popular option among Escape buyers. Some also swap the cooktop and sink locations. They are very accommodating with customizations like this. Perhaps you should check them out if you want more customization options than Casita offers.
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Old 08-14-2017, 07:48 AM   #33
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Remember that with running propane, the only connection allowed inside is the one at the appliance. All other connections need to be made outside the trailer. This is the main reason why you will find manufacturers will run a trunk line and tap off it for fridge, furnace, stove, water heater, etc.

Most trailers, like mine, have those four main appliances, and to run all the lines inside without any connections but those at the appliance, would certainly make it difficult. Plus, they could be in the way.
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Old 08-23-2017, 12:00 AM   #34
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JUst a quick note on why the copper is covered when with in the frame work of the trailer. If copper touches bare metal, there will be a reach and the copper will eventually leak. That is why most plumbers that deal with copper piping alwats strap the copper lines with copper hangers and nails. My neighbour had a bad leak all caused by a nail that had come in contact with the copper water line.
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Old 08-23-2017, 01:42 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Bennett View Post
Remember that with running propane, the only connection allowed inside is the one at the appliance. All other connections need to be made outside the trailer. This is the main reason why you will find manufacturers will run a trunk line and tap off it for fridge, furnace, stove, water heater, etc.

Most trailers, like mine, have those four main appliances, and to run all the lines inside without any connections but those at the appliance, would certainly make it difficult. Plus, they could be in the way.
Not how they did it in my Sunrader. Different makers did not always do things exactly the same.
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Old 08-23-2017, 02:08 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by EricAllyn View Post
Would you mind telling us what you decide to do? Also, what you will be using. I am working on a 88 Casita, and it has copper inside with fittings. I ask my neighbor who has been in Heating and A/C for many years, and he said it's fine, except that flare fittings might after time leak. since currently all the fittings are inside, I was thinking about bringing them up through the floor as some others have said their lines run. Smart? or Unnecessary?
I have decided that I am going to bring my propane line through the front wall. Then it will have a protected pathway inside of the under bench cabinets over to the kitchen cabinet where I am, for now, going to install a shut off valve inside of the cabinet with a quick disconnect fitting that is easy to attach to a flexible propane hose. That hose will come up through the counter in one of the wiring grommets like they use for table and desks. I know it sounds odd but I am not putting in a standard, drop in propane stove as part of my renovation. I have a Nordic DT stove/heater that will be my normal means of heating and cooking, it uses diesel fuel. But I do want a backup source of heat "just in case". Plus I want propane ready for the next person should I ever decide I need to sell. Not having propane will turn off many potential buyers.

As for protecting the tube we have a bunch of PVC cable raceway on hand. It is attached to the walls inside the cabinet and will protect the tubing but at the same time it is not hidden behind any walls so no code violations. This is what the raceway looks like. I have a lot of material resources on hand that might differ from what other people have to use. Obviously the cover can be labeled with warning stickers as to what is in there and I have a label printer to do that
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Old 08-23-2017, 04:58 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k corbin View Post
Not how they did it in my Sunrader. Different makers did not always do things exactly the same.
It is required in RV construction. If you find something different, it is not done to code. I have discussed this a bunch with Reace from Escape, as I added some gas lines of my own. Basically he said what he needed to do as a manufacturer, but an owner can do what they like. There is good reason to keep gas connections to a minimum inside our rolling shaker boxes.
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Old 08-23-2017, 06:08 AM   #38
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Copper tubing comes in different grades...If you can find some that is know in the trade as "K" this is what you want to used. This has a much thicker wall and is used for lines to be buried in the dirt. and also what people have said about covering it with something like a garden hose wont hurt too. Just make sure it is secure to the frame in as out of a way of any rocks or such could come off tires and damage it and you'll be fine
Remember, "K" copper.
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Old 08-23-2017, 11:00 AM   #39
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"K" may not be the best choice. It's stronger, but it is more expensive harder to find and has a smaller ID. Also it is designed to be more corrosion resistant, because of it's thickness, but you can easily match it's mechanical resistance by sleeving it, which should be done anyway. Corrosion is not likely the problem we will face in RV applications, that mainly comes from being buried in the ground.

In 1/2" OD "K" can reduce the delivered BTUs by about 20% over thinner wall copper, so be careful on your sizing if you use it. You might have to go to the next bigger size.

Probably best to use "L", route your tubing carefully and protect it with a sleeve.

When you're discussing copper "tubing", you are discussing the OD of the tube. But you can usually also discuss it as "Pipe", but it will be the next size smaller. For instance: Type 'L" copper pipe in 1/4" is 3/8" copper tubing. Type L copper "pipe" is readily available in 60' lengths. But 3/8" copper tubing in "L" will probably be in a different length roll and probably be called out in wall thickness instead of "L" or "K" or "M". Sometimes it's just referred to as "refrigeration tubing", but be careful of the wall thickness.

Best to go to a good plumbing supply house and talk to them about what you want. Heavy wall, 1/2" OD, etc.

Then make sure you have a good flaring tool kit and know how to use it. You can also get this at the plumbing supply.

PS. I know K Corbin already knows all of the information mentioned in my post and has said so repeatedly, but it might help others. There has been a few new ideas introduced into the conversation that are outside his original post.
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Old 08-23-2017, 12:33 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boler77 View Post
JUst a quick note on why the copper is covered when with in the frame work of the trailer. If copper touches bare metal, there will be a reach and the copper will eventually leak. That is why most plumbers that deal with copper piping alwats strap the copper lines with copper hangers and nails. My neighbour had a bad leak all caused by a nail that had come in contact with the copper water line.

When doing boilers we took short pieces of schedule 40 PVC and ran the copper lines through the pvc sleeves and put straps around the pvc to prevent galvanic action.
Plus if the copper expanded it could slide in the pvc
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