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Old 12-20-2005, 03:13 PM   #21
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Didn't find anything on ODP valves, so I'm guessing you mean OPD, Nick. According to everything I've read on these Overfill Protection Devices, they are a backup safety measure, not a substitute for monitoring the weight of the cylinder. I'm referring to web sites such as that of the Propane Education & Research Council, which says

Perhaps Frederick's KOA is depending on the OPD, but that doesn't sound like a good idea to me; maybe I still don't understand what they are doing or what an OPD is for.

Donna, I don't see how a propane fill nozzle can shut off automaticallly (like a gasoline pump nozzle does), since the tank is supposed to have about 20% empty space left; could your station be depending on the OPD in the tank as well?
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Old 12-20-2005, 03:16 PM   #22
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Darwin, I realize that in many places the "new" OPD is required, but my understanding is that this is a backup safety device, not a way to normally determine when to stop filling. By the way, the OPD is not required here in Alberta, and new tanks are readily available without one.
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Old 12-20-2005, 04:36 PM   #23
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Darwin, I realize that in many places the "new" OPD is required, but my understanding is that this is a backup safety device, not a way to normally determine when to stop filling. By the way, the OPD is not required here in Alberta, and new tanks are readily available without one.
The OPD is a law enacted for consumer protection in the United States by the National Fire Protection Association...look out, from what I understand it's coming to Canada shortly (CMA). [b]OPD stands for [b]Overfilling [b]Protection [b]Device...it will NOT allow a propane tank to be overfilled.

This is from the National Fire Protection Association's website:
Quote:
Which cylinders must have an overfilling prevention device (OPD)? When must they be installed?
The OPD, a new safety device required in the 1998 edition of NFPA 58 must be installed in all cylinders of 4 40 pounds propane capacity. The OPD must be installed in all new cylinders manufactured after September 30, 1998. Other cylinders must have an OPD installed when the cylinder is requalified. Cylinders requiring an OPD can not be filled until one is installed, but the can continue to be used until empty. Refer to 2-3.1.5 for the complete requirements
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Old 12-20-2005, 05:30 PM   #24
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Frederick, I can believe that a 20-lb tank holds about five gallons, but I don't understand how that KOA can fill a portable cylinder without using a scale: how do they know when it is correctly filled, if they don't know how much space was in the tank? It's not like a fixed tank on a vehicle with the various fittings to manage filling. Maybe I've misunderstood something here...

I'm all for being charged just for what I get, but it seems to me like that means using a scale and charging by weight added.
Brian B-P,

The way it works here is that the [b]80% bleed valve is opened during filling, when it starts to vent liquid instead of gas, the tank is full (to 80%). The pump usually has a meter measuring gallons dispensed. Some places without the meter still use a platform balance scale.

I went to one place where the person did not open the [b]80% bleed valve, he depended on the OPD valve. That's not good practice because the bottle can be overpressurized.

Some or none of this may apply in Canada or in any particular province.
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Old 12-20-2005, 05:50 PM   #25
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Thanks Morgan. Very well said.
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Old 12-20-2005, 06:06 PM   #26
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Brian B-P,

The way it works here is that the [b]80% bleed valve is opened during filling, when it starts to vent liquid instead of gas, the tank is full (to 80%). The pump usually has a meter measuring gallons dispensed.
That's how Greater San Diego KOA is doing it.
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Old 12-20-2005, 08:16 PM   #27
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Ah, so there is a bleed valve connected to a dip tube leading to the 80% full level -- thanks Morgan, now I understand how these fill stations are determining appropriate level, and I know what to look if someone is filling my cylinders without using a scale. I assume this is just like fixed tanks in vehicles, which is what I meant by "various fittings" on the tank.

I hope Donna's supplier is really using the bleed valve to determine the shutoff.
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Old 12-20-2005, 09:09 PM   #28
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Brian B-P,
Natural gas is not available in the mountains where we live. So when our 298 gallon propane tank is filled, the same method Morgan described is used. There is a bleeder on the fill nozzle and also one on the tank. Between the two of them it would almost be impossible to ignore the spewing liquid propane. The reason for allowing the 20% "air space" is to provide expansion room in case the ambient temperature should rise after the tank has been filled. The volume of liquid propane expands considerably when the temperature rises. I've had it expand so much that the pressure relief valve on the tank opened and the escaping fuel stunk up the entire neighborhood. Not supposed to happen and cost per gallon is close to that of gasoline,but with a sufficient increase in temperature Fortunately it didn't leak for more than a few moments.
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Old 12-22-2005, 10:31 AM   #29
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We have Suburban propane gas for our home. They will fill a 20, 30, or what have you at our door and also at our cottage for the same price. currently that price is 1.49 per gallon. but again , we use it for heat at home . One gallon is about 4.4 pounds.A 20 lb tank is about 5 gal. Hope this helps.ALSO , HAVE A GREAT CHRISTMAS. AL.
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Old 12-22-2005, 08:27 PM   #30
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Went past a propane place where I fill my barbeque tanks and their sign reads: propane tanks filled $15.99 .......I don`t know of another place in our area that still fills tanks.....Anyway...a Merry and Peaceful Christmas to all....at least I think that we can still say that...... ...Benny & Alice
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Old 12-22-2005, 08:52 PM   #31
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I did not realize that buying propane has become somewhat of a scam. Where I live, they do not use scales (never even seen a scale used) it is sold by the gallon. Also, you only pay for what you need. Whoever started selling at a fixed price regardless if you do not need that much seems like an illegal act to me. Could you imagine a gas station doing that with vehicles? In California, if you do not have the OPD valve/device, you will not get your bottles filled.
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Old 12-23-2005, 10:16 AM   #32
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I did not realize that buying propane has become somewhat of a scam. Where I live, they do not use scales (never even seen a scale used) it is sold by the gallon. Also, you only pay for what you need. Whoever started selling at a fixed price regardless if you do not need that much seems like an illegal act to me. Could you imagine a gas station doing that with vehicles? In California, if you do not have the OPD valve/device, you will not get your bottles filled.

the OPD is required in ND also. When I was in Cal some places sold it for .75 per gallon with a $2 or $3 min. It doesn't pay to file in a gallon
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Old 12-23-2005, 11:57 AM   #33
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OPD device is required everywhere in the U.S. It's a federal law, not state or local. And from what I've read on the WWW it's coming to Canada before too long.
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Old 12-27-2020, 07:44 AM   #34
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Recertification of Tanks

Hello,

For determining the level of the propane in the 20 lb bottle you just wait till the day warms up and then run your hand down the tank to determine the temp. When it gets cold there is the propane. If you have trouble with that, using an inexpensive infrared thermometer would work. When the day warms up just run the thermometer down the tank .... when the temp drops there is the level. In warmer climates the warm water may be required.

As a back up I carry a 10 lb tank to use while filling up the 20 lb tank on the Trill. The little tank is also handy to use if you want to cook outside on a propane camp stove. It saves wasting money on buying those little disposable bottles.

BTW... Overstock has 10 lb tanks for $60 now...

https://www.overstock.com/Home-Garde...010%20lb&rfmt=

Uncle Larry
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Old 12-27-2020, 11:33 AM   #35
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I bought a propane bottle connector ( coupling ) at Harbor Freight and use a grill or RV propane bottle to fill the small green bottles or propane torch bottles.
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Old 12-27-2020, 02:27 PM   #36
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I have two tanks on the Scamp and two for the home grill. When one is empty, I have it filled. Most places here in Rochester, NY charge by the refill, not gallons. BJs and Costco usually have the best price. Tank exchanges contain only 15# of fuel.
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