Pleez help me find a post

[Vickie B.]

Several days Kevin K. posted a really neat idea about extending the front bunk to make it wider. The next day (or so) another post showed up with a similar set up using 4 legs to hold up the extension (rather than pvc pipe.) I cannot find that second post! I can't remember who the poster was or anything.

Just remember the plywood extension to the front bunk, and the 4 legs holding it up.

Thanks for your help!

[Kevin K]

This is it. http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...ing-42641.html

[Vickie B.]

Thanks Kevin! I'm trying to get up the nerve to make my front bunk into a dinette like that, AND have the bed, AND have your extension!

I'd almost rather just take out the fiberglass piece and make a separate dinette/couch frame, so as not to ruin the original fiberglass front seat.

Under the front seat of the Perris Pacer there is a "hump" on each side. It does not look like other campers have these in the way, because some people have built in a porta potty under the front bunk on the door side. Mine almost look like wheel wells, but there are no wheels there!

[Lizbeth]

Vickie, many Bolers have those humps including mine. I keep my potty under the back dinette which is a permanent bed. My front area fiberglass is U shaped and has a low spot in the middle for a potty which is the foot well for the dinette mod. We also use it as a bed for hubby, the back bed is just not big enough for both of us to be comfortable.

Is yours just a couch with no opening in the front of it?

[Vickie B.]

Hi Lizbeth,.

Yes, luckily there is a door and some pretty nice storage space under the front couch, but it would be nicer if those 2 "bump"s weren't there!

[Frederick L. Simson]

Originally Posted by Vickie B.

Yes, luckily there is a door and some pretty nice storage space under the front couch, but it would be nicer if those 2 "bump"s weren't there!

Those aren't "bumps" actually. The floor does not rise in the corners, it drops in the center to make the potty cupboard. While you may think "same difference", it is a significant distinction frame-wise. I searched for a post about a frame-off restoration with pictures to illustrate my point, and I think I found it:

http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...off-41934.html

That drop in the floor was designed so the trailer could be low enough to fit inside a garage.

[Vickie B.]

That makes sense, Frederick. Am I right in thinking I have seen some trailers who don't have those "whatevers"? Like the built-in potty Robert Johans put in his camper----it's over by the front door.

[Frederick L. Simson]

Originally Posted by Vickie B.

Am I right in thinking I have seen some trailers who don't have those...

Yes, as have I. I don't remember what the distinction is, though... Why some do and some don't.

[Vickie B.]

Well, at least now I know I'm not crazy

[Roy in TO]

Originally Posted by Frederick L. Simson

Yes, as have I. I don't remember what the distinction is, though... Why some do and some don't.

From what I've observed the earlier trailers did not have the floor extend under the seat. (Which makes the bumps) Then they started doing it to allow more height under the bench for a porta-potty. You can't have the floor lowered across the whole trailer because the frame is there.

[Raya]

To expand on what Roy said:

I have not seen any Bolers or Scamps that do not have the dropped floor design (but I have not seen a Perris Pacer, even though it looks like a Boler clone). In other words, all of these have a dropped floor in the center of the trailer. Meaning it is "dropped" into the frame rails. The rest of the trailer (dinette area, under the kitchen, under the closet, under the front couch) is at "normal" height on top of the frame. So, although it seems like parts of the trailer are "bumps" or raised, it is actually that the middle is lowered.

The exception to this is the entryway, which is an extension of the dropped area so that you can easily go in and out. This is a built in "jog" in the frame rail on that side.

Now, where you have variations is in the front couch area. Early Bolers just have a straight-across frame member there, so the dropped floor ends at the front couch completely. In other words, the whole front couch is at the "upper" level on top of the frame, and not dropped. Thus in these trailers there is no central Porta-Potti compartment under the couch (where you can slide a Porta-Potti in and out from the main floor). If someone builds a Porta-Potti into one of these trailers, it will be about 5" higher than the main (dropped) floor.

Photos of this type:

Boler solid bench small 2.jpg Views: 10 Size: 48.4 KB ID: 30936" style="margin: 2px" />

Later/some Bolers (and all Scamps, from what I have seen), have an additional "dropped" box built into the frame, under the center of the front couch. This is the aforementioned, floor-level Porta-Potti compartment. These have a door in the base of the couch, but the top of the couch platform goes all the way across, with just lift out panels to access the side compartments.

Photo of Scamp-type, with frame cutout but upper bench straight across:
boler door hinge strengthening idea.jpg Views: 7 Size: 126.5 KB ID: 30933" style="margin: 2px" />

I think that although Robert has a Scamp, so it does have the central dropped area in the front bench, he built his potti area on top of the frame to the side of the cutout (correct me if I'm wrong):

Photo of Robert's Scamp:
scamp 4.jpg Views: 9 Size: 31.5 KB ID: 30931" style="margin: 2px" />

Later/some Bolers have not only the additional dropped frame compartment under the front couch, but also have the upper couch platform molded with a U-shaped cutout, which enables easy conversion to a dinette (just lift up the U-shaped cutout's lid and Voila!). I have not seen this on any Scamps (doesn't mean it does not exist, but I have not seen it).

Photos of later Boler type (from some mfg. plants) with fully U-molded bench:



I have seen folks with the early "solid" Bolers have a forward box welded in during a frame-off, and in at least one case it was even a bit wider than the standard one. Of course you have to balance it with ground clearance.

As I said above, I don't know how the Perris Pacer is made, frame-wise, even though it looks like a Boler clone - so it may be different.

Raya

[Pam Garlow]

GREAT Explaination, Raya! It's so cooool to see all the different construction methods, and modifications. If only this website could be turned into a book.....

[Vickie B.]

No Kidding---thanks so much for all the great info---inquiring minds want to know---and the more I know about what's going on, the less "terrified" I'll be to do mods, etc.! I so want to be like some of you guys and gut it and make it like new

[Raya]

Vickie,

Can you explain how your Perris Pacer's frame/floor and front couch are set up? Does it have the dropped center section like the Boler/clone? A Porta-Pottie "slot" in the couch base?

Thanks,
Raya

[Vickie B.]

Hi Raya,

I'm going to go take some pics tomorrow. I never thought of it as a dropped floor--I thought of those dang bumps as raised! So I'll take some pics and really look at it!

It does have the door and space for the porta-potty, however the sellers warned me not all pp's fit under there---and I had purchased a Pett system--which fits fine when in the folded legs position, but set it up and it's almost a regular toilet height---so it definitely doesn't fit that way!

[Vickie B.]

Hi Raya,

Here are some pics, don't know if they show what I was trying to say. The bench is 15" tall. In the middle is storage space, but on either side are the raised areas. So if we cut the middle out to make the front dinette mod, there would be little or no storage under the remaining seats.

Another question: are many other people's benches unfinished underneath, like mine???? The newbies from KC that have been posting pics of their Boler restoration, have a beautiful yellow finished look, underneath all the benches and cabinets they have removed. (Sorry folks, can't remember your name) It's Sam and Jess------

[Vickie B.]

OH, yea, see where the light is shining thru little holes in the fiberglass---how do I fix that? Slap some fiberglass on the inside, paint, ???????

[Raya]

Hi Vickie, and thank you for the photos. From what you are saying the Perris Pacer has a similar design to the Boler, which makes sense since the shell looks like it's a Boler clone.

On the nice smooth liner inside the bench: The Boler 13 floor (at least all the ones I've seen), is molded so that the nice, shiny gelcoat is on the inside, and the rough side of the fiberglass (away from the mold when they make it) is on the bottom (under the camper).

What this means is that the inside floor (in the living area) and the bottom (floor) of the storage areas (plus the wheelwell humps) are the same shiny gelcoat. So is the riser around the sunken area of floor (which makes the kitchen baseboard, and the front of the step to the dinette, etc.

I think I have read that the Pacer is more of a "bathtub" floor, like the Trillium, so that would (or could) mean that the shiny gelcoat side is underneath, facing the road.

Note that the Boler walls on the inside (under the Ensolite) are also the "rough" fiberglass, because the outside (of course) is the molded gelcoat.

What I don't recognize is that "curb" around your photos. I'm not sure what that is or exactly where it is on your camper (?).

If you are seeing light through the shell, that may simply mean that there is a chip in your outside gelcoat. The basic fiberglass that our campers are made of is translucent, and only gelcoat or paint on the outside makes it opaque (or more opaque anyway). Now, I'm not saying you don't have a chip or a thin spot that needs repair because I can't see it in enough detail. But there are plenty of times you can see light through fiberglass and it is just fine, but simply has some paint rubbed off or a gelcoat chip, etc. (maybe in your photo those are chips from rocks, if it is the front lower section of the Pacer?)

Raya