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05-20-2015, 05:44 PM | #47 |
Member
Name: Steve Trailer: 2005 Casita 17 LD
Florida
Posts: 56
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If the J2807 is all that great, how do all the ratings come out to a nice round number? It seems that it is probably a minimum performance standard to address overstating capacity. It appears to allow the manufacturer to understate capacity at will. How can a vehicle have NO towing capacity if measured by an objective engineering standard?
If that is the case we will continue to rely on "you're gonna get sued" and "God will strike you down" if you exceed the manufacturers rating. Edit. Item 1 discusses the use as a minimum standard and 1.1 gives plenty of latitude. It is not going to guarantee consistent tow ratings, only that the vehicles are tested at their published rating at a minimum. |
05-20-2015, 05:50 PM | #48 |
Senior Member
Name: Wayne Trailer: Airstream Sold, Nest Fan
Ontario
Posts: 2,002
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A good question Steve. All mini vans get a 3,500 lb rating. Most cars in North America get an exact 1,000lb rating. A bit of a lark considering many of them when set up optimally are towing 5,000lbs plus and perform better than many vehicles with a tow rating 5 to 7 times that of the cars.
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05-20-2015, 06:47 PM | #49 |
Senior Member
Name: JD Trailer: Scamp 16 Modified (BIGLY)
Florida
Posts: 2,445
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Since many cars are the base platform for minivans and crossover SUV one wonders why the cars that make the foundation are not rated?
Both the Tiguan and Golf are based on the PQ35 platform. The Tiguan is rated 4000 lbs towing in the US and the Golf rated maybe 1000. Not much difference in Europe though. Most of the other CUV are also based on passenger car platforms. Ford and Madza also share platforms. Most likely the manufacturers just want the higher margin units rated and the less expensive not. There without a doubt some added heavier duty parts like transmission coolers etc, but these items could be just as easily added to sedans and wagons. The VW DSG transmission when fitted to the higher dollar Audi has a slightly larger transmission cooler. It happens to use the engine cooling for transmission cooling just as likely to raise the temp when the transmission is cold. $250 will get the bigger cooler for the VW. |
05-20-2015, 06:58 PM | #50 |
Senior Member
Trailer: Class A Motorhome
Posts: 7,912
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Automatic transmission "Intercoolers", located in the bottom tank of the radiator, have been around since at least the 60's, nothing new there, except when your engine gets hot, so does the transmission.
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05-20-2015, 07:41 PM | #51 |
Senior Member
Name: JD Trailer: Scamp 16 Modified (BIGLY)
Florida
Posts: 2,445
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Actually this cooler is located on the top of the transmission, but the effect is the same. There are adapters to add air to oil coolers, but not many have had the need for it.
The transmission is basically the same as a manual with no torque converter to add much heat. |
05-28-2015, 11:44 AM | #52 |
Senior Member
Name: Christian Trailer: Escape 2017, 17B
Florida
Posts: 257
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Hello again, still shopping, but closer to a buy. One more question for you all, what do you think of manual vs automatic transmission. I prefer manual but am having difficulty find one in the used market.
Sent from my C6530N using Fiberglass RV mobile app |
05-28-2015, 12:56 PM | #53 |
Senior Member
Name: Wayne Trailer: Airstream Sold, Nest Fan
Ontario
Posts: 2,002
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Hi Lisa. I too prefer a manual (fun to drive) and have had many over the years.
But a wise man (one who has towed 1,000's of various combinations over 45 years) once told me that when towing you have enough things to be aware of and that is where the simplicity of an Automatic kicks in. He also said that at times it takes a few forward and backward moves to get backed into a campsite. That clutch in the manual vehicle can really heat up. I agree with that wise man. Want a manual but use an Automatic. |
05-28-2015, 03:53 PM | #54 |
Senior Member
Name: Christian Trailer: Escape 2017, 17B
Florida
Posts: 257
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05-28-2015, 04:02 PM | #55 |
Senior Member
Name: Robert Trailer: 2015 Escape 19 "Past Tents" 2018 F150 Lariat 2.7L EB SuperCrew
Arkansas
Posts: 1,298
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Hmmm. Towing Capacity - high. Toilet - nice one. Rivets - have none. No wonder I don't have any hot-buttons!
__________________
"You can't buy happiness, but you can buy an RV. And that is pretty close." |
05-28-2015, 04:58 PM | #56 | |
Senior Member
Trailer: Class A Motorhome
Posts: 7,912
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Automatic vs. Standard Transmissions
Quote:
And really, if one can't tow a trailer and shift a transmission at the same time it might be time to start thinking of some other mode of transportation. Me thinks that to be a bit lame... Bottom line though is that some vehicles do have a higher tow rating with an automatic than a standard transmission, something to consider in your search. BTW: If you do find the TV you want, and it's a standard transmission, be sure to tell the seller that you really wanted an automatic, just to drive the price down. It's worked twice for me with dealers and I knew that both vehicles were the 5 speeds that I wanted before I ever got to the lot!!!! Dealers DO NOT like having standard transmission vehicles, new or used, on the lot, most customers won't buy them. But there is nothing smoother than a nice T-5, it's like buttah... LOL |
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05-30-2015, 02:00 PM | #57 |
Senior Member
Name: Patrick Trailer: Shopping for new RV
North Carolina
Posts: 702
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Suggest tou go for the automatic trans with the addition of a quality trans-cooler...have it installed by a qualified transmission shop and not the dealer as they will only send it out to a transmission shop and charge you more than going direct.
If you elect to go with a standard transmission be sure you have a tach and keep the RPMs at the proper level or you will destroy the clutch and engine in the process. This is not a concern with today's automatics as the are computer controlled and maintain the correct RPMs. Good luck and Happy Camping! |
05-30-2015, 03:13 PM | #58 |
Senior Member
Trailer: Class A Motorhome
Posts: 7,912
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Quote: "If you elect to go with a standard transmission be sure you have a tach and keep the RPMs at the proper level or you will destroy the clutch and engine in the process." (Italics added)
And why/how is that? I can't say that I have ever heard that in some 50+ years of driving. And for about 1/2 of those years we didn't even have tach's in most cars. It sound like you may have been victim of a scare tactic by the pro-automatic crowd. BTW: Automatics do not maintain the correct RPM, Only the driver or the cruise control has any say over that. But they can maintain the correct gear for the load. |
05-31-2015, 09:13 AM | #59 |
Senior Member
Name: Patrick Trailer: Shopping for new RV
North Carolina
Posts: 702
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For Bob Miller, All the information I have about the RPM/gear relationships when towing came from automotive experts and truck drivers who did the majority of their driving while towing in the Rocky Mountain States. Maintaining the proper RPMs is critical. Today's automatic transmissions utilize a computer to achieve this...if you drive a standard shift transmission that job fall on the driver.
Even the owner's manual often states to avoid driving in overdrive gear when towing with an automatic in hilly areas. I drive a Toyota product with a 5 speed automatic...in hilly areas I set the transmission to lock out the 5th gear. When I do that my engine's RPMs rarely fall below 2,000 RPMs...this is all computer controlled in Toyota Products. Setting the selector in the "D" position results in constant down shifting trying to maintain RPM in hilly conditions.....I do use the "D" position when running on flat and/or less hilly roads to increase gas mileage. I did tow with a standard transmission and tach many years ago and found it to be a real pain in the a** !!! Most knowledgeable automotive professional feel that an automatic transmission is stronger than a standard transmission....this applies to today's automatics....the industry now shows better gas mileage on all its' automatic transmissions vs. standard shift transmissions....this is illustrated on the window stickers found on new cars and trucks. Every year automatic transmissions get better and better...not so on standard shift models....they are "old school". Happy Camping....no matter what you drive. |
05-31-2015, 09:19 AM | #60 |
Senior Member
Name: Wayne Trailer: Airstream Sold, Nest Fan
Ontario
Posts: 2,002
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Uplander.... You have the right info!
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