abnormal tire wear on Scamp 16

[beardrum]

After 5,000 miles on a new trailer and tires, I noticed the passenger side tire is BALD for about 2 inches from the outside edge. I've changed the tire, and got the rig to a shop in order to have the alignment and wheel bearings checked.

I asked Kent at Scamp about the issue, and he tells me 90% of the time abnormal wear on the outside of the passenger tire is because of alignment issues or damage caused by hitting something along the road. I have no recollection of hitting anything (I think I would have noticed a bump big enough to put the tire that far out of whack.)

Does anybody have any advice or other possible diagnosis on what may have happened? I'm really hoping it is a simple issue (like alignment or wheel bearings)

I wanna go camping!

Thanks for any thoughts

Chuck

[SteveV]

It may be just the camera angle but it looks like a broken belt in the tire going by how the outer edge looks like a larger diameter than the inner edge.

If the wheel is off of the trailer you can roll it across your driveway. If it rolls like a tire off of a clown's car with a lot of run out then it has a broken belt. If it was fairly new you may be able get the tire manufacturer to warranty it.

[Carol H]

Have you checked inside the wheel well to see if its rubbing on anything?

If not then take into a tire dealer as Steve suggests and see if they can see anything wrong with the tire itself.

If they can't see anything then taking a look at your wheel bearing is a good idea.

I BTW always get my trailers tires balanced when changed out, not sure if Scamp does that or not when they put them on new.

[floyd]

Passenger side can also known as curb side. that is the side most likely to be struck. If the front of the tire strikes the curb hard enough it could bend it in such a way as to induce excess tow-in which would result in wear as shown on your tire.
If it strikes the curb squarely at the bottom it could induce excess positive camber which would result in the same wear.

The places where the body of the tire shows cracks are the result of the wear about to expose the edge of the belt.

[Eddie Longest]

Chuck
I was reading a post just the other day like yours. The had someone check the alignment and it was out of alignment. They had a bolt on axle which you should also have. They were able to unbolt and reposition the axle and all was good. But I have also seen a bad axle wear like that too.
I guess you will have to get the alignment checked first. I would try to deal with Scamp first. If no satisfaction with Scamp then go to the axle mfg. Dexter has a square tube, ALKO has a 3 sided tube. Dexter will have a decal with their mfg. info on it. The axle will also have the info etched on the tube. Just hope you don't have an ALKO with issues, they were just bought out by Dexter I don't know what they are doing about warranty on the ALKO axles.
Eddie

[beardrum]

Hi Folks,
Thanks for your comments. It's actually a Lippert axle I believe. As I said above, Scamp is involved in the discussion. At this point, we're waiting for the shop I took it to to make their diagnosis.
Steve, exactly what do you mean by "a lot of runout" ? The tire is lopsided as you suggest, or will it wobble as it rolls? It sounds as if it might be worthwhile to go pick up the tire and take it to a tire shop for their comments.

Thanks again

c

[Borrego Dave]

Hey Chuck, I've had a couple tires over the years have separation problems. The last one, on a truck had a 1/2 inch lift to the tread from center to the outside and no tread ware issue like yours. Only 10K miles on them too. To me, from your pic, it does look like it has higher tread height on the outside edge.
I have no idea how much of a hit it would take to bend an axle or stub enough to cause your tread problem. Might not be much but a lot of miles later with scuffing....
Let us know what you find out cuz this has come up before.

[SteveV]

Chuck,
Here's a pic of a tire w/a broken belt. Usually when this happens the tread is no longer round or true causing vibration & handling problems. There's no set reason for the belt breaking/separation failure but age of the tire seems to be the biggest cause.

If possible, spin it either on the trailer hub or have a tire shop put it on their spin balancer. You should quickly see the tire defect if there is one. If the trailer & tires are fairly new I would think there should be some warranty on the tires covering a belt separation issue.

As others have mentioned checking the alignment would be a good idea also.

[Mikmay]

Originally Posted by beardrum

Attachment 85220

After 5,000 miles on a new trailer and tires, I noticed the passenger side tire is BALD for about 2 inches from the outside edge. I've changed the tire, and got the rig to a shop in order to have the alignment and wheel bearings checked.

I asked Kent at Scamp about the issue, and he tells me 90% of the time abnormal wear on the outside of the passenger tire is because of alignment issues or damage caused by hitting something along the road. I have no recollection of hitting anything (I think I would have noticed a bump big enough to put the tire that far out of whack.)

Does anybody have any advice or other possible diagnosis on what may have happened? I'm really hoping it is a simple issue (like alignment or wheel bearings)

I wanna go camping!

Thanks for any thoughts

Chuck

I just finished a 3000 mile trip from windsor ont to Los Angela's with my 1300 trillium I left with fairly good tread on the tires and checked the tires often an the trip they seemed fine until the last 50 miles of the trip when I noticed the trailer wasn't pulling right. When I arrived at the happier camper lot I looked at the tires to my astonishment the curb side tire had completely torn apart and when I removed the tire tire there was a 6 inch chunk completely torn out right down to the steel belt . I also checked the bearings and axel and all seemed fine so I assume I hit something which caused a chain reaction on the tire. I can't believe I made it here after seeing the condition of the tire . Maybe your tire also hit something and caused the problem

[Chris Z]

Looks exactly what I saw in first Trip with our used Scamp 16.
I put spare on and 1500 miles later we were home. Decided we wanted a Casita and we sold it like that. I figured it was out of alignment.

[Bobby Kirk]

The curb side tire on my 2008 Casita looked exactly like yours.
It was fine when we left Ontario but worn when we arrived in Pensacola.
Took it to two tire experts and ended up replacing both tires.
The experts suggested all the above mentioned; bearings, alignment, broken belt, but they concluded that the tires were just too old . I guess 7 to 10 years is the life of a tire because we drove home on the new ones and all seems fine.

[gordon2]

Originally Posted by Bobby Kirk

... I guess 7 to 10 years is the life of a tire ...

Actually that's well over the expected life of a camping trailer tire.

[MC1]

Originally Posted by gordon2

Actually that's well over the expected life of a camping trailer tire.

Agree, and as pointed out before the thought needs to be said again. ST trailer tires are of the lowest grade of tire made and do not last as long as most other tires. If you are using them replace them often.

[gordon2]

answer here:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tirete....jsp?techid=11

[Wayne Collins]

Had the same wear on curb side tire, with our 2000 16 ft Scamp. But only after 4 years and many long trips. I changed it with the spare and have not seen that problem since. Have replaced both tires a couple years ago with better quality ones, no sign of adverse wear.

[Roger C H]

I would think that either wheel being misaligned via toe in/out would cause equal wear on both tires. A car has the rear wheels and the good front wheel to cause the fourth wheel to drag, but a trailer with only two wheels would find the path of least resistance which should produce the same drag on both tires.
Maybe you could have a friend drive behind you whilst towing and have him give the alignment an eyeball. Or maybe you could drive straight in a parking lot, stop and take a look at how your trailer is aligned with the car. Driving through a wet patch would produce tire tracks...
Do you know what it means when a car "dog tracks?" That is when the rear axle is no longer aligned with the front axle and the car goes down the road at an angle. I would think a trailer would do the same.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmKkmcmi4_k

I understand it is also called "crabbing."

[Carol H]

Originally Posted by beardrum

Hi Folks,
Thanks for your comments. It's actually a Lippert axle I believe. As I said above, Scamp is involved in the discussion. At this point, we're waiting for the shop I took it to to make their diagnosis.
S

Will be interesting to hear what they say. Was it a shop Scamp suggested you use?

Just as a side note I know a party who had a new very popular FG trailer who after a few thousand miles of travel noted unusual tire wear. The tire manufacture replaced the tire. Happened again in very short order - this time the trailer manufacturer replaced the axle as it was thought "possible" to be the issue & the manufacturer decided to be pro active and eliminate it as the possible cause and changed it out quickly so as not to inconvenience the customer further. Odd tire wear happened again. This time around a closer inspection was done on the first axle that came off the trailer, as well as the second one on the trailer - turns out both axles which had come from a well known axle manufacturer had been incorrectly manufactured (something was misaligned in the assembly).

[Perry J]

Four years ago I went on a 4200 mile trip with my Scamp 16.
I noticed the same wear on the outside edge of the passenger side tire.
I had a tire shop reverse the tire on the wheel and for some reason the tire wore well for the rest of the trip.
Don't ask me why!!


John

[beardrum]

Steve: I visited poor Scamp yesterday at the shop, and took the tire out (I had left it in the trailer for diagnostic purposes) and rolled it across the parking lot, per your suggestion. With the wear on one side like that, i expected it to track to the right side, but it rolled straight and true, with no gallop or wobble.

Carol: I use a trailer manufacturer here north of Seattle, and Kent at Scamp seemed ok with them, but he did not actually recommend them. They have the trailer in their queue.

I've also heard back from Lippert, the axle manufacturer, but so far it seems to be only the stock canned email responses, requesting more info and pictures. Lippert wanted a picture of the leaf springs...(seriously). I sure hope this can be fixed with an alignment/bearing/balancing adjustment.

As soon as I get some useful info from the shop, I'll be sure to update this thread. It is encouraging to hear that other folks have had the same issue, and it was easily fixed.

Thanks everybody.

Chuck

[RogerDat]

Picture of leaf spring - On the leaf spring there is probably an alignment pin that if it snaps off the axle can shift. I had one break on a car driving down to Florida, did not matter how tight the axle bolts were clamped to the spring if that alignment pin was broken the axle would shift and dog track. I would drive backwards into a curb to knock it forward for the next couple of hours of driving, until the next morning when we could get into a dealer.

Just an FYI - watch a medium sized dog with fairly long legs run. The back end of the dog shifts over to the side so the rear legs don't run into the front legs. Thus the term dog tracking for a trailer or rear end that is off set to the side rather than directly behind the front tires.

Toe in can cause outside wear, and if there is something loose toe in can be excessive but straighten out as you speed up. Think how a wobbly wheel on a toy wagon will wobble until you get it going fast then it sort of straightens itself out. Have seen that before. Tire scuffed at low speeds but as speed increased it straightened out and rolled smooth. Straight was the path of least resistance for a rolling tire. Toe in was the natural position of the loose assembly. Ate the outside edge of the tire but was not especially rough feeling at speed.

Excessive positive camber causes wear at that location but too much load tends to cause negative camber, wear on the inside edge. At least on a torsion axle which is arched so that under weight the arch flattens and the tire camber shifts to the correct amount.