F-150 3.5 EcoBoost? - Page 5 - Fiberglass RV


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Old 03-13-2019, 12:04 PM   #81
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Carl,

You make some very good points and clearly see my bias in some posts. I'll own up to it happily.

I don't want to whip a dead horse here, but I'll clarify a bit further.

These new turboed aluminum gas burners are a wonder. Performance with durability that was never available until recently. And only now because of several breakthrough achievements. I've carefully watched their development for a few years and think it's great.

I'm also an old diesel gearhead. I see so many people celebrating the new Ecoboost engines and eager to have one, but who have very little knowledge about how they work or their track record. That's fine too, as long as the engines do hold up under heavy use. They seem to be establishing a good record for themselves. Here's where my bias comes in and this is for full disclosure purposes only, so take it for what it's worth. I want to be cautious with this technology because it is new, is constantly being upgraded to fix it and make it better and I have a disappointing record with this manufacturer. As an example, I saw Ford rush their diesels onto the market under heavy competition and a desire to stay ahead in that field. The result was the largest warrantee disaster in Fords history and the eventual building of those engines under court order. These are facts and not speculation, and admittedly, they are not the Ecoboost. But the marketing strategy and development process is the same. Ford went through a major revision of the 3.5 in 2017 to improve it's durability and to get better mileage. So waiting until then to buy one was lucky.

I've had two bad Ford engines and two of my buddies did too. My neighbor just sold his Ecoboost after being stranded by it for the third time. Now, I realize that this is not a huge market analysis, but it is enough to make me pause. And it's enough to make me not jump on the band wagon and tell others how great they have proven to be. It reminds me of the diesel fiasco.

Finally, I hope they are great because this technology is the way of the future. Light, powerful, efficient. Excellent. And as far as Honda goes, if they make a car that suits my purposes, I'll buy it with confidence because my limited knowledge of them is that they do very good engineering, have a great reputation and their products are refined before they go on sale.

One of the things I, as a designer and tinkerer, appreciate, is simplicity of design. The best machines are the ones that do their jobs with the fewest parts. Not to give up any functions, but to achieve an elegance of design. Simplicity is both beautiful and difficult to achieve. Sometimes I'll marvel at a machine that performs duties in a way that is so simple I can't figure it out, and I know then I've found another fine example of this goal. One of my best friends is an accomplished mechanical engineer. He and I go round and round about how to keep it simple and what really works. He wants to design elaborate fixes for simple problems, and I point out ways to do it cheaper and and simpler.

I've been criticized for critisizing the V6 design. It's more that I look at them askance and wish for something better. I've owned two of them and have studied the design and the reasons for it. In-line fours are very simple. V6s package better than V8s, but are more complicated than 4s and have balance considerations. They also have better overlapping power strokes compared to four's. V8s are very well balanced and run very well, but are larger in dimensions. In-line 6s are balanced very well, are simple in design, easy to work on, but don't package well in front drive applications. BMW has used a lot of in-line sixes. The 5 cylinder in-lne is an interesting compromise and I've had a couple of those too. My Mercedes 5 cylinder turbodiesel has a lot of character and is just fun to have. A full sized luxury Mercedes that gets 30 MPG if driven reasonably. All while delivering it's own distinctive sound. Decisions, decisions.

At first, V6s were just attempts to reduce engine size, fit those smaller engines in tighter places, and maybe get better mileage. Manufacturers were able to just remove two of the eight cylinders from a V8 and they had a marketable V6. Chrysler did this with their 318 and it was terrible. It still got bad mileage, and had the added feature of vibrating like a paint mixer. Buick tried it and had an engine that fired unevenly. People didn't like it. Neither of those attempts were about good running. The inherent problem was that a 90 degree cylinder layout fires unevenly and a 60 degree layout is out of balance. Take your choice. This was worked on and improved by making offset crank throws, but the traditional counterweights don't work for total balancing. Next they came up with "flying arms" to educe the problems, and also balance shafts. Ford used a balance shaft in their 3.8 that was set in the engine valley. This worked but added weight, complexity and a parasitic loss. Now days, after lot of work on the subject, the combination of offset pins, flying arms, careful bore and stroke relationships, limited overall displacement and vibration dampening engine mounts, these engines are user friendly. But they are still buzzy. Then, in order to get higher performance they have overhead cams with phasers that are driven by a set of chains running frantically up to each head and back. So, bottom line, it's been a hard process to get them to be user friendly and they are complicated. They have twice as many heads, camshafts and turbos as an inline 6. They work well in their current form, but are complicated and difficult to work on.

Combine all of that development to make a complicated design acceptable, then make it as light as possible, then make it into a turbocharged gas burner, and you have quite an animal.

The reason gas engines and turbocharging have been so hard to match up and get a lot of reliable power is that gas is mixed with air and compressed before being ignited with a spark. The fuel mix has traditionally been ready to burn before being compressed. So if you turbocharge the engine you force more air and fuel into the cylinder before compression. Then when compressed there is much higher pressure, and much more heat. This leads to pre-ignition and severely limits the power you can get with this process. Direct injection solved this by adding the fuel during compression instead of before compression.. That leads to it's own set of problems, and so a port injector was also added to help keep the valves clean and to limit the time required to add sufficient fuel at high RPM. Each solution leads to a new problem. As you know, diesels never had the problem of pre-ignition, so they can be boosted to the physical limits of the pistons, rods and cranks, etc. Diesels are a perfect match for turbocharging and can be done with old school technology, especially if they have direct injection where the fuel is injected into the combustion chamber instead of into a pre-combustion chamber. Cummins does this and was a leader in this field. Mercedes and International used the pre-combustion tech, and the result was lower power and harder starting. This is why Ford 7.3 diesels are hard to start and must have glow plugs. Great engines, but not real powerful. And it's part of the reason they had to go all-in in the diesel wars with new designs. That lead to the warrantee disaster I mentioned.

Sorry to be so long winded.
I'm a retired fleet mechanic with lots of diesel experience as well as a pretty good understanding of how EcoBoost engines work and their track record, having followed them from their beginnings.
I also have some gasoline turbo experience back as far as the late '70s.


While I respect your conclusions about small diesels, I have not been able conflate them with the "over the road" trucks or heavy equipment.
At best they are competitive with their gasoline counterparts.


My conclusions are different from yours ,but I am glad that both diesel and gas engines are available so that we can both have that choice.
I have no use for diesel engines in cars or light trucks even though they are very popular both here and obviously in Europe.
With the advances brought on with EcoBoost, I feel that diesel has been trumped and its use in cars and light trucks obviated.


No worries, the demand is still strong and plenty of diesels will be available for those who are eager to have one but who have very little knowledge of how they work or their track records...that's fine too, of course.
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Old 03-13-2019, 12:58 PM   #82
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floyd,

I have completely lost interest in buying a modern car with a diesel. And pickups with diesels are looking more and more uninteresting for light to medium service.

For me, they have shown to be more trouble and expense than what I wished they had proven to be. I'm driving a Cummins now, but seriously looking at a new Hemi.

My Mercedes is an antique at 36 years old and the second one I've had. It's just for fun and because I like diesels for their manners and personality, generally.

My Passat TDI, that I had wanted for years, turned out to be less refined than I wanted and prone to balance shaft failures. If not started just right it would give a fault code and the transmission was tuned for a gas engine's power band.

Cummins has been very well proven and I've had three. The simple torquey and durable nature of them is appealing, along with their mileage. But the new ones have become just another complicated and expensive truck. The water pump, for instance used to be a one hour job that was easy. Now, it's nearly impossible to even see it in there, much less get to it. There are so many possible belt routings, that it would be nearly impossible to replace one that broke on the road. I know this because my water pump bearing went out, threw the belt off and destroyed it. I found myself unable to make a repair that would normally be easy, and was about 500 miles from home. The EGR cooler is a huge maintenance project to clean and the DEF system is so expensive and complicated that even the dealers have problems.

I was so glad to leave behind all the problems with the previous generation Ram related to the steering, transmission and heating system, that I allowed myself to ignore the obvious problems with the new one.

I left pickups with gas engines alone for many years because I was not going to put up with 8-10 MPG all the time. Out of the question. Cummins settled that concern and I watched the carnage of GM and Ford diesels from the grandstand.

Now, new technology, much better engine management and pollution controls have brought gas engines back into consideration.

Nobody really needs to understand how their car works, but I think it's a good idea to go into a purchase with eyes wide open, or put another way, not just driven by loyalty.
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Old 03-13-2019, 05:26 PM   #83
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John,

I understand and don’t mind long windedness. I respect your opinions which are based upon your personal experiences, even though they may differ from mine. What I truly appreciate is the civility in your and everyone else’s responses. I don’t believe anyone has been offended, and that is a good thing. I have seen far too many discussions here degenerate into “thread rage” (the forum equivalent of road rage!).
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Old 03-29-2019, 05:39 AM   #84
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So... 3or4 mechanics in some unnamed garage somewhere preferred the V8?? No surprise, with all great choices!

At least it was the right brand with all good choices!
I saw the same or similar video. It was a large dealership. Looked to be 20+ machanics. One said he would pick the 3.5 EB. The rest said the 5.0 V8.

Reasons stated were the 5.0 would likely have less problems and live longer.

That was a couple of years ago.

I'm not a great fan of gadgets and gizmos. So I prefer to keep it as simple as possible. The 5.0 V8 would be my choice, if I was buying a F-150.

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Old 03-29-2019, 06:16 AM   #85
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I think Iím finally coming around to the anti-turbo point of view and the fact that gadgets and gizmos should be avoided. I wish I could still buy a new vehicle with a crank starter, no power steering, springs instead of struts and shocks, and without disc brakes. And be able to drive it only on dirt roads rather than paved roads. Around home, I am distressed that I have a water heater. Things were much better when we had to heat water on the kitchen (wood) stove and have a bath every other Saturday. Donít get me started on indoor plumbing. Its inventor should get a swirly. Much better to use chamberpots and outhouses, especially when it is 20į below zero. And trains and planes should be outlawed. Why would anyone want to travel across the country in less than a day in one of those new gimmicky flying machines when it could take 4-6 months in a Conestoga wagon. Get rid of the cell phone and itís predecessor, the landline; the pony express was much better, way better than email. And Wozniak and Jobs should have been tried and convicted of a crime for even thinking people should have new-fangled personal computers........
Hey, wait. If it were not for all these innovations, I wouldnít be writing this post.
Maybe I am going down the wrong path. Perhaps innovation is good. It is my understanding that the EcoBoost was the most tested engine in Fordís history. Perhaps Iím wrong. Then again, I donít put much credence in the opinion of a bunch of ďmechanicsĒ at some dealership. Very few automotive technicians are mechanics anymore. They typically plug the vehicle into a scanner (another gadget) and it tells them what assembly to replace (not fix). But like everyone else, they are entitled to their opinions. Iím just not sure if their opinions are based in reality or conjecture.
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Old 03-29-2019, 07:04 AM   #86
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Without weighing in on the EB vs. V8 debate, I will point out the error of over-generalization. Just because one technological change is good doesnít mean all are. And just because an innovation does some good doesnít mean it is all good. Many of these life-enhancing technologies have come with human and environmental costs that only become apparent long down the road.

Air conditioning is perhaps the poster child. Funny you left that one out!
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Old 03-29-2019, 07:22 AM   #87
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CPW,

GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR QUEST!
Hope you find just what you are looking for.

I'm still not a big fan of gadgets and gizmos. Which in my mind is making something way more complicated to achieve the same basic result.

I prefer to keep it as simple as possible. Therefore if I was buying an F-150, it would be the 5L V8.

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Old 03-29-2019, 07:57 AM   #88
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Good Luck with your search . We tow our 17 ft Casita and our 21 ft SOB with a 1/2 ton truck which has a 5.7 liter V8 ,3.92 rear end & 8 speed transmission. It doesn’t tow with ease , I do know the trailers back there , it doesn’t just breeze over the mountains and it does shift gears on small hills . We are currently shopping for a new truck
Your expectations of what you want /need in a tow vehicle is probably different than mine. I know mine are different than most because for me fuel mileage is near the bottom of the list
My point is , take the tow vehicle advice from any forum with a grain of salt
Just because a vehicle can get a trailer from point A to point B
without destroying itself doesn’t make it a GREAT tow vehicle. IMHO

I’m with Kip if I bought an F150 it would have the V8 engine
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Old 03-29-2019, 10:17 AM   #89
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All good points made by the three posters above. Didn’t think of air conditioning but Jon, I’m sure you have foregone ever using A/C due to it being so detrimental to humanity. And electricity too, due to the carbon it’s production sends into the atmosphere. I am totally aware that innovation may have bad effects, but you all missed my point and that is you are NOT going to stop it. And Steve and Kip, if you want an F150 with a V8, I respect your desires. But I would suggest you buy one soon because I suspect non-turbocharged V8s are a dying breed that may not be an option in the not too distant future. Sometimes we don’t like change, but it is inevitable. And I do stand behind my comment that there a fewer mechanics and more parts/assembly replacers today. But that is just the way things are going. I, for one, have accepted the “future.”
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Old 03-29-2019, 10:17 AM   #90
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I miss DSO... Barring that, I'll take the best available choice... Ecoboost for now.


For an antique truck...

I like an I-6.
It is clear that a 292 was a better engine than any Chevy V8 and the 300 was a better engine than any Ford V-8.
V-6s are just a compromise for packaging and were heavily eschewed in their early days.
4CYLs were thought to be unbalanced, turned out that was only the customer base.


Fuel injection and electronic ignition were considered too complex to be reliable...Anybody want a carburetor and points?


I tried to write this post with a lead pencil and notebook paper but it just wouldn't "send" so I went to type it in my phone and the rotary dial didn't have "spellcheck"

It truly is a daunting world out there, but as we used to say...
Keep up or take notes!




It is human nature to fear the unknown... except nowadays the buyers don't want to know what's under the hood...
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Old 03-29-2019, 10:19 AM   #91
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If the OP is still looking, we got a good deal on a 2018 STX 2.7EB CrewCab 4x4. It was a few grand above your budget, around $35k. We have put about 20k miles on it and it pulls like a beast. I had to train myself to not use the right pedal so aggressively to get decent gas mileage, but after doing so I find that I easily get 17-19 mpg around town and 20-24 on the highway while not towing. The range is very speed dependent. We have stretches around here that allow 80mph and the mileage drops pretty quickly once you get over 70.

We have towed our 2000 Scamp 19' over 3000 miles with the 2.7 ecoBoost. It is sometimes hard to remember it is behind you on the highway. The ten speed tranny is so awesome in tow mode. It is really nice to drive over hills and down the other side. It will hold your speed on the downhill grades without requiring a lot of breaking. I set the cruise control at about 65 and get 14.5 mpg pretty reliably. If we are on smaller roads and going a bit slower I can get over 15, but I don't think I've ever completed a drive with an average over 15. The standard tank provides over 400 miles per tank unladen and about 300 miles per tank towing.

If the previous owner is towing with that big dodge you should have no trouble with the F-150. We had to raise our Scamp axle a bit as the previous owners towed with a much lower truck. The Reese hitch is very nice so I would grab that off the PO. We had an off-road shop install the rails in the bed for the hitch and the 7-pin connector in the bed, and you will want to do that before picking up the trailer. The dealer may offer you a good deal on that, our didn't. I would also remove your tailgate for your first hook up and drive. On steep inclines the F-150 tailgate gets very close to the frame of our 19. You will want to practice that someplace where you can stop and get out a lot to look. It has a weird aero duck tail element that just stretches out and up right where the biggest frame member is.

Be sure to get the brake controller installed at the dealership and make the deal contingent on them getting that done. Ours was a bit of a mess because of some changes Ford made to the fusebox in 2018 without telling the dealers, but they covered the extra cost. It took a few months to get straightened out, but it works great.

Remember that the dealer has a lot of room to negotiate on add-ons like bed liner's and side steps, so include them from the beginning and then beat them down on those prices. I wouldn't pay more than half of the list price on add-ons and you should be able to get 10-15k off MSRP price if you can find something in stock that meets your needs. I think the STX was the lowest trim we could find that had a center console which has air vents and plugs for back seat passengers. If that isn't something you want, you can go to a lower trim.
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Old 03-29-2019, 10:34 AM   #92
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I have taken Luddite positions in the past and likely will again, so I understand Chauvinism.(Of course the archaic and obsolete definition)


For instance... ABS
I hated it so much that it was always disabled on my cars, until I got my 2016 and WOW!, it grew up and filled out!
My new ABS is like Science fiction compared to the old , which was like poking a stick in the spokes of the wheels.
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Old 03-29-2019, 10:40 AM   #93
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The Only Ford dealer in our area / county closed his doors last week and went out of business ( The building is up for sale)
The two auto repair shops in my area do not service the Ford’s Eco-Boost engines
Floyd , Ford makes a great truck but having to drive 150 miles every time I need service or warranty work makes me think twice about buying a Ford F-150 Eco-Boost
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Old 03-29-2019, 12:13 PM   #94
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The Only Ford dealer in our area / county closed his doors last week and went out of business ( The building is up for sale)
The two auto repair shops in my area do not service the Fordís Eco-Boost engines
Floyd , Ford makes a great truck but having to drive 150 miles every time I need service or warranty work makes me think twice about buying a Ford F-150 Eco-Boost
Thatís a very legitimate concern, Steve, and a valid reason not to buy any Ford. I wouldnít want to drive 150 miles to get any vehicle serviced, regardless of manufacturer. Do you have a GM or Ram dealer nearby?
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Old 03-29-2019, 12:30 PM   #95
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That’s a very legitimate concern, Steve, and a valid reason not to buy any Ford. I wouldn’t want to drive 150 miles to get any vehicle serviced, regardless of manufacturer. Do you have a GM or Ram dealer nearby?
We have a Ram dealer 40 miles to the East of us and 40 miles to the west
We have a GM dealer about 20 miles away in the next County
The 150 miles I noted is round trip
The Ford dealership in our area was a family business and opened in 1921
The owner is 81 years old and Ford wanted him to do a major upgrade to his dealership , retirement was the best option for him

Living in a rural area has its’ advantages but your choices are limited .
My neighbor Bonnie recently bought a 1 ton diesel Ford F-350 from him for towing her horse / travel trailer . What a great truck and got me thinking .
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Old 03-29-2019, 03:17 PM   #96
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The Only Ford dealer in our area / county closed his doors last week and went out of business ( The building is up for sale)
The two auto repair shops in my area do not service the Ford’s Eco-Boost engines
Floyd , Ford makes a great truck but having to drive 150 miles every time I need service or warranty work makes me think twice about buying a Ford F-150 Eco-Boost
We had the same thing happen to a small local dealer in our area recently. I knew the owner well and his predecessor who inherited it from his father. The employees only got two days notice.
Of course that's no reflection on the F-150.

We can only hope that Jim Hackett's tenure is short, as he is better suited to selling office furniture and he is doing serious harm to a loyal customer base and the best and most extensive dealer network ever devised.


No one would smile at the prospect of driving 150 miles to buy a car, let alone driving that far for service.
In our case there are still at least 6 other dealers within 20 miles of my house.


When you go to your Chevrolet dealer, take a look at the new (Ersatz Ecoboost) 2.7L 4CYL TurboCharged full sized four door pickup! It has two four piece cams with variable valve timing. AND... Each piece of each cam for each cylinder slides front to back along its axis independently from cam lobe to flat cam lobe in order to shut down cylinders under light throttle and reintroduce lift every time you accelerate. YUM!
I think Rube Goldberg was chief engineer on that one!


All that and it takes 9 seconds to 60mph with the truck empty!
You might just buy their V8!
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Old 03-29-2019, 07:31 PM   #97
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CPW,

GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR QUEST!
Hope you find just what you are looking for.

I'm still not a big fan of gadgets and gizmos. Which in my mind is making something way more complicated to achieve the same basic result.

I prefer to keep it as simple as possible. Therefore if I was buying an F-150, it would be the 5L V8.

kip
🤔The v8 will absolutely work for you if properly configured, the right rear axle and payload configuration. Mileage will be close to Ecoboost also. The motor will have to rev higher as peak torque comes in at higher rpm, thatís right rev higher than the smaller Ecoboost motors. Thatís not a problem itís designed to work there but many donít feel comfortable with the motor turning 4K +. My little 2.7 rarely goes over 3k while effortlessly towing my 50TA.
By the way, over 60% of F150 s sold are equipped with Ecoboost motors, less than 25% are equipped with the v8. Donít know how all those service managers still have jobs bad mouthing Fords most popular power plants.
Not a fan of bells and whistles, you do know the v8 is 32valve dual over head cams with variable cam timing right?🤨
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Old 03-29-2019, 09:07 PM   #98
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It's not so much about being afraid of new tech just because it's new, it's about making sure it really is all it's cracked up to be. New stuff makes life much easier, safer, more fun and overall, better.

It's about taking responsibility for those new gadgets. The cost to repair and the unknown reliability. I don't care if an engine was tested more than any other in history, we have been told that over and over. Several new diesel models were sold the same way, with disastrous results. A number of new gas engines have seen problems to and some have barely made it through the warrantee period before needing serious repairs. They were the new thing, and then they were the reviled thing. People that were cautious avoided the problems. People driven by brand loyalty paid the price.

Manufacturers are always in a very competitive environment and getting new stuff out the door ASAP is critically important. So is cost. Cost constraints and delivery schedules drive design. The public becomes the beta tester and too often have to pay for repairs. Just because an engine was tested and many ore out there, doesn't mean they are the last word on the subject. The Ecoboost, for example was redesigned and reprogrammed in 2017 to enhance reliability and efficiency.

The best thing, if these issues are a concern, is to see how their track record goes and then get on the band wagon, if all is well. Small turbocharged engines are definitely the way of the future, as far as piston engines go. But I'm really hoping for some serious breakthroughs, as current engines are terribly inefficient. They are better than what we've had in the past, but still not very good.

People also understand V8s, the sound they make, their balance, reliability and the power they are famous for. Who doesn't like those things? The Eco was developed to get better efficiency. Some people, in this upside down political world we live in, are turned off by efficiency and simply want what they've always had, a rumbling V8. They aren't necessariiy simpler these days, but their reputation lives on.
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Old 03-30-2019, 04:49 AM   #99
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It's not so much about being afraid of new tech just because it's new, it's about making sure it really is all it's cracked up to be. New stuff makes life much easier, safer, more fun and overall, better.

It's about taking responsibility for those new gadgets. The cost to repair and the unknown reliability. I don't care if an engine was tested more than any other in history, we have been told that over and over. Several new diesel models were sold the same way, with disastrous results. A number of new gas engines have seen problems to and some have barely made it through the warrantee period before needing serious repairs. They were the new thing, and then they were the reviled thing. People that were cautious avoided the problems. People driven by brand loyalty paid the price.

Manufacturers are always in a very competitive environment and getting new stuff out the door ASAP is critically important. So is cost. Cost constraints and delivery schedules drive design. The public becomes the beta tester and too often have to pay for repairs. Just because an engine was tested and many ore out there, doesn't mean they are the last word on the subject. The Ecoboost, for example was redesigned and reprogrammed in 2017 to enhance reliability and efficiency.

The best thing, if these issues are a concern, is to see how their track record goes and then get on the band wagon, if all is well. Small turbocharged engines are definitely the way of the future, as far as piston engines go. But I'm really hoping for some serious breakthroughs, as current engines are terribly inefficient. They are better than what we've had in the past, but still not very good.

People also understand V8s, the sound they make, their balance, reliability and the power they are famous for. Who doesn't like those things? The Eco was developed to get better efficiency. Some people, in this upside down political world we live in, are turned off by efficiency and simply want what they've always had, a rumbling V8. They aren't necessariiy simpler these days, but their reputation lives on.
Well said, John! I will say, however, that in my 50+ years of driving and vehicle ownership which has included all types of engines (4, 6, and V8) not a one of them has been so reliable that it never had to go to the repair shop because something malfunctioned or ceased to function. But the truth is, it was almost never for a drivetrain problem that could not be blamed on age and/or wear from normal usage. I never had to replace an engine or a transmission in any of my vehicles. I have had to replace ďcomponentsĒ (water pumps, alternators, belts, etc.). Did have a head gasket go on my daughterís Saturn if you want to call that an ďengine problem.Ē I bought my first EcoBoost F150 in 2012. I am now on my second, primarily because I wanted a different color and the larger fuel tank and in those seven years I have not had a single issue/problem with the EcoBoost. I spent more on repairs not on a Dodge Omni (my spouse purchased new) not related to its engine in 16,000 miles and 1-1/2 years (I insisted at that point she get rid of the POS) than I have spent on the two F150s in @150,000 miles and almost 7 years. First F150 had a fuel pump relay fail, second had the brake module fail and it was covered under warranty. The bottom line is that I believe that problems with electrical (power window motors, relays, etc.) or electronic components are more likely to result in problems and add up to far more repair costs than engine problems, regardless of the engineís configuration. It is for that reason I only smile or chuckle when someone posts that they would buy a V8 F150 rather than a turbocharged F150. Nothing mechanical is reliable; reliability is, at best, a myth or a hope. One could have a V8 that is still running after 250,000 miles while another could have the identical V8 that self-destructs at 30,000 miles. It happens.
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Old 03-30-2019, 06:50 AM   #100
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Name: Cliff
Trailer: 2017 Escape 5.0 TA
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Originally Posted by Raspy View Post
It's not so much about being afraid of new tech just because it's new, it's about making sure it really is all it's cracked up to be. New stuff makes life much easier, safer, more fun and overall, better.

It's about taking responsibility for those new gadgets. The cost to repair and the unknown reliability. I don't care if an engine was tested more than any other in history, we have been told that over and over. Several new diesel models were sold the same way, with disastrous results. A number of new gas engines have seen problems to and some have barely made it through the warrantee period before needing serious repairs. They were the new thing, and then they were the reviled thing. People that were cautious avoided the problems. People driven by brand loyalty paid the price.

Manufacturers are always in a very competitive environment and getting new stuff out the door ASAP is critically important. So is cost. Cost constraints and delivery schedules drive design. The public becomes the beta tester and too often have to pay for repairs. Just because an engine was tested and many ore out there, doesn't mean they are the last word on the subject. The Ecoboost, for example was redesigned and reprogrammed in 2017 to enhance reliability and efficiency.

The best thing, if these issues are a concern, is to see how their track record goes and then get on the band wagon, if all is well. Small turbocharged engines are definitely the way of the future, as far as piston engines go. But I'm really hoping for some serious breakthroughs, as current engines are terribly inefficient. They are better than what we've had in the past, but still not very good.

People also understand V8s, the sound they make, their balance, reliability and the power they are famous for. Who doesn't like those things? The Eco was developed to get better efficiency. Some people, in this upside down political world we live in, are turned off by efficiency and simply want what they've always had, a rumbling V8. They aren't necessariiy simpler these days, but their reputation lives on.
Does this look like a simple uncomplicated motor that people understand? It was designed in 2011 and undergone several revisions since then. If the sound a motor makes has anything to do with how well it tows then I want a Rolls-Royce Merlin under the hood. And you know what, reputation doesnít tow anything.
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