Getting conflicting info from VW on towing capacity

[kVox42]

Hello to All. I'm a NEWBIE!!!

I'm new to things but plan on taking an extended road trip later this year. I will be traveling solo and I'm perfectly comfortable with minimal amenities. With that said, here's (one of) the early questions I've run into and can't get a definitive answer to. It seems like a simple and VERY IMPORTANT question.

I have a 2010 Golf TDI with a standard transmission. The Volkswagen TDI is a fuel-injected turbo diesel. It has lots of torque and plenty of power (as compared to a straight gas model).

I’m looking at small, light-weight camping trailers and have come across some conflicting information.

My owners manual says the vehicle is rated to tow up to 1,000 lbs. However, in Europe, (including the UK), the same car is rated up to 725 kilograms - which is 1600 lbs, obviously a significant difference (60%). I’ve also come across reviews, articles and forum posts that say TDI models are the best towing vehicle for their size in the UK. So the question is ... what explains the difference? I have written (and called) VW-USA and although they're friendly enough, all they will say is that "there's a difference in the 2 vehicles". When I ask for specifics I get basically corporate stonewalling.

I have no desire or intention of “maxing out” what I will tow. In fact, I'm focused on keeping the trailer as light as possible. However, the 60% difference is confusing. Does anyone have any suggestions on howto proceed? Or perhaps know if there IS a difference between the European and USA versions of the vehicle? If so, what exactly is it?
Horsepower?
Engine size (displacement)?
Breaking system?
Suspension?
Is it an emissions issue?
Bottom line is, all I'm trying to find out is can my US golf pull up to 1000 or up to 1600 pounds?

Kevin
Raleigh, NC

[Larry Tenhage]

The difference is that in Europe, you're allowed to attach a trailer hitch directly to the car's chassis & bumper at-the-same-time. In Canada & the USA, you're not allowed to do that (liability factors into this too) but have to attach the hitch directly to the chassis or bumper only (NOT both). This is supposedly so that the bumper's impact absorbing qualities aren't bypassed, as they would be if you attached a hitch directly to the chassis & bumper simultaneously. Of course, the combined chassis & bumper mount is stronger than the "bumper only" or "chassis only" mount & that is where the difference in ratings is. You COULD get a combination Chassis/bumper hitch, but you'd be in violation of provincial / state regulations, as well as running afoul of your insurance provider. Don't go there!

[Bob Miller]

Hi Keven and welcome to the group....
Basically the answer is 1000 lbs because that's what the owners manual for your vehicle states.
Your quandary is an oft posed one, that of the differences in towing capacity between U.S. and European versions of the seemingly same vehicle.

Asking if there are differences is basically moot because towing over the manufacturers limit for your vehicle in the U.S. can leave you open to several problems, not the least of which is liability.

If you were to have an accident while towing, any second year law student would jump on the issue of operating a vehicle out of mfgs. specifications.

Next is the issue of warranty, but I suspect your car is well past that point.

And last is that there may well be lots of differences between your vehicle and the ones built for the European market, as well as the issue that European driving conditions and towing laws in general are different, all of which may allow a higher limit.

Your VW dealer isn't talking because they don't have anything to say. You are driving a VW of America vehicle and you are asking about VW GMBH vehicle specifications.

While there are a few out there that seem to see manufacturers towing limits as suggestive, you only need to ask two people about the risks of assuming the higher limit, your insurance agent and your lawyer. IMHO their opinion will trump all others here, there and everywhere, including those PM's that are sure to follow
P.S. Don't shoot the messenger....!

[redbarron55]

The UK VW site brochure list the unbraked towbar limit at 689 KG and the braked limit at 1500 KG. The tongue limit is 75 KG.
One of the best small tow car there is,
The DSG version is rated at 690 KG unbraked still 1599 KG with trailer brakes.
VW US basically says their cars van't tow.
I tow a 16' scamp with my 2009 JSW TDI. No problems.
Your mileage may vary.
My Scamp is insured by State Farm with the JSW listed ad the tow car. They were concerned that the towing might damage the VW. No mention of all the other concerns from other posters.
I suggest you ask your insurance company and get them to list your car and trailer on the policy.
I am not a lawyer, but evidently there are a lot of them who have reservations and I am not telling you to tow or not. It is your decision.
Do you want a legal opinion or a mechanical opinion?

[Donna D.]

Hummmm. You live in the US or Europe? Overtow your vehicles capacity in the US and get into an accident... good luck with that.

[Mike Magee]

Can-Am RV in Toronto uses a Jetta TDI to deliver Airstreams and other travel trailers all over Canada. They also set up VWs for towing for customers; they fabricate a custom hitch receiver that's much stronger and better attached. Two or three members of this forum see this as a good idea; Many others remain vehemently opposed. Personally I would not use the Jetta for such towing without the modifications (which can cost $1500 or more).

[Pam Garlow]

Kevin, I suggest that you use the search feature for the word 'towing', and read through the various discussions. Actually, I'd posted a link to that search result at the bottom of this post.

You will find those that say 'absolutely not', and those that say, 'why not, I've done it for years'. This discussion has been run into the ground on numerous occasions and there is never a solution that satisfies everyone. My personal choice is to use my manufactures' US recommendations because I am towing in the US. For example, I would not tow a 1500lb trailer in the US with a car that is rated to tow 1000#.

I've pulled up this link about towing with a vw jetta:
http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...tdi-59875.html

And this is the search result for 'towing':
http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/m...earch&q=towing

Be safe and be careful.

[honda03842]

Kevin,

Just so you know others have disregarded North American ratings.

I towed our Scamp 16 (2600 pounds) and other similar trailers for 7 years with a Honda CRV rated for 1500 pounds in the USA (and rated for over 3000 pounds more than in Europe). Over the years we drove all over the USA and Canada without a single issue.

Our Insurance company and Honda both know we tow a trailer (I've written to Honda about it often). We never had a single issue with the CRV, selling our 10 year old Honda with 250,000 miles on it.

Also we were hit in a small accident and the Insurance company did not blink.

We based our decision on the European ratings, in our mind recognizing that it's some kind of standard practice to de-rate vehicles for 'only God knows' what reason.

Over the many miles we have met a half dozen people happily towing with VW TDIs, some towing trailers heavier than my Scamp. I have seen TDIs set up by Can-AM, very impressive.

Asking you lawyer for legal permission to tow over the rating is like asking your mother if you can have a Red Ryder BB Gun.

The Can-AM web site is very informative.

[Carol H]

Whats to be confused about? I don't see any conflicting info.

a) Your owners manual states the car is rated to tow 1000lbs
b) VW USA has told you your car is rated to tow 1000lbs
c) VW confirmed they are NOT the same car as they sell in Europe. Nothing changes that fact even if you know what the differences in the build are. My best guess is the difference is in the back end components as it is with a few other VW vehicles as North Americans's like a softer ride. I posted a video interview awhile back of a German VW rep confirming the same thing.
d) You live in North America not Europe - North America does not have across the country the low towing speed restrictions that they have in Europe.

If you truly "have no desire or intention of “maxing out” what I will tow" then stick to what the folks that built the car have told you its towing capacity is.

[Bob Miller]

I am guessing that Bruce Jenner also drove for many years without problems, until yesterday. Watch and see what happens there.

[Glenn Baglo]

Originally Posted by honda03842

I towed our Scamp 16 (2600 pounds) and other similar trailers for 7 years with a Honda CRV rated for 1500 pounds in the USA (and rated for over 3000 pounds more than in Europe). Over the years we drove all over the USA and Canada without a single issue.
what reason.

I smoked cigarettes for more than 50 years, up to two packs a day, and I don't have lung cancer yet.
Got emphysema, COPD, circulation problems, but not lung cancer, I think.
Good luck.

[John Hussey]

A similar situation exists with the little, but very heavy, Jeep Wrangler, two door version. In the US they would have you drive it while towing a maximum of 2,000 pounds. But, in Europe, they are perfectly happy with you driving it in front of a 3,500 pound tow.

I have used the latter maximum specs for my decision making since 2008 with a 16' Casita and have been quite happy with the decision. Seven years of auto plus Casita insurance over 4 insurance companies who have been happy as well knowing what I was doing while taking my money. I calculate I have driven around 40,000 miles with the Casita in tow and those miles have been all happy as well. Its strange how so many opining naysayers raise their heads whenever this topic pops up.

[kVox42]

... for apparently stirring up an old debate. Before my post I had looked at the forum a bit to see some of this debate already but the posts I saw didn't focus on this specific dilemma I'd run into, namely the manufacturer of the same car providing two radically different specifications.

I understand both arguments provided here, and both have merit. I will continue to do my homework, check with my insurance provider, dot all my i's and cross all my t's before I do anything, so thanks for the input.

I've already discovered - since yesterday - that (at least according to Can-Am), a hitch-is not a hitch-is not a hitch. Now I have to find someone locally who can install a hitch on MY vehicle to pull MY trailer and do it to provide the least wear on the car and the trailer AND the greatest efficiency and safety. As I might have suspected, this is turning into a less simple process than I was aware of.

Thanks for the help and guidance.

[jokra]

Kevin,

if I was planning on travelling solo, I would use a van like a westy (VW Westfalia) or similar. You can park it much easier in cities. Take a bike for local travel. This makes solo travel much more convenient and practical than towing a trailer.

[redbarron55]

If you decide to tow with the TDI please get one of the euro hitches that is rated by TUV for the car. Tha would be Westfalia, Bosal, or one of the others listed by the manufacturer. The US made hitches are rated for considerably less and mount differently.
If you drive in the US and want to go by the best practices listed my the very cautious you need at least a 3/4 ton pickup truck.
If you believe that the mechanicals of the VW are weakened just for the US market then you probably shouldn't buy a VW at all.
By the way the Westfalia wiring kit has the selection in the software for North American light control so perhaps Westfalia recognized that theat kit might be used here.
The Westfalia is not DOT approved, but then perhaps they don't want to make the hitch system weaker than the TUV regulations that it does meet.
The TUV seems to be a more stringent standard than DOT.
If you GCVW is over 10,000 lbs then DOT regulations apply.
Less than 10,000 then there are gray areas depending on the state and if state lines are crossed.
Not being a Philidelphia lawyer I have not checked on all of the legal ramifications, however the VW TDI does a great job for me.

[Steve L.]

Europe vs. America Towing:

The laws are different.
The regulations are different.
The customers are different.
The expectations are different.
The cars and trucks are different.

And it's not a vast conspiracy by US manufactures to trick us into buying larger tow vehicles.

And hey, I tore the label off my mattress and pillows so it's not like I drank the manufacturer's Kool Aid and sometimes I drink milk after the expiration date so it's not like I don't take risks sometimes.

[Bob Miller]

Originally Posted by redbarron55

"If you drive in the US and want to go by the best practices listed my the very cautious you need at least a 3/4 ton pickup truck."

Now, how is that totally incorrect statement adding to the discussion?

[honda03842]

Originally Posted by Steve L.

I drink milk after the expiration date so it's not like I don't take risks sometimes.

Steve,

Isn't the stamped date on milk the "purchase by date" and not the expiration date"?

I just cooked breakfast for 80 with an unopened gallon of milk dated Feb 1.

[Bob Miller]

Originally Posted by kVox42

...
"I've already discovered - since yesterday - that (at least according to Can-Am), a hitch-is not a hitch-is not a hitch."

Keep in mind that Can-Am's opinion, one that promotes ignoring manufacturers weight limits, and is basically telling the entire population of North America that what we are doing for towing is wrong, doesn't seem to be supported by many (if any) others in the business, at least not openly.

But their business is that of selling Airstream trailers and said hitching systems.

To paraphrase the old Packard motto: "Ask the man who sells them" ?

[Steve L.]

Originally Posted by honda03842

...I just cooked breakfast for 80 with an unopened gallon of milk dated Feb 1.

There you go...Even the tolerance for risk varies around here.