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Old 09-22-2013, 08:56 AM   #21
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I too an a fan or 2" receivers. There is a currently active discussion going on right now at Airforums.con that I have been following.

To WD or Not.... Sport 16 - Page 2 - Airstream Forums

New Ford F150 pick up. To use or not to use a WDH for a 16' Airstream?

Considering the glass eggs are lighter the wind may want to blow them around.

The 2" receiver costs just a few dollars more and you then have the option of going with a WDH which will smooth out the overall ride and provide an extra degree of safety/stability.
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Old 09-22-2013, 09:02 AM   #22
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I too an a fan or 2" receivers. There is a currently active discussion going on right now at Airforums.con that I have been following. To WD or Not.... Sport 16 - Page 2 - Airstream Forums New Ford F150 pick up. To use or not to use a WDH for a 16' Airstream? Considering the glass eggs are lighter the wind may want to blow them around. The 2" receiver costs just a few dollars more and you then have the option of going with a WDH which will smooth out the overall ride and provide an extra degree of safety/stability.
you cannot use a WD hitch on a Subaru (or most other modern cars). It puts too much stress on the unibody structure. Also, many trailers are not rated to take the additional frame torque that WD hitches apply.

Still, I would also recommend a 2" hitch because it will not limit your choice of ball mount, bike rack, hitch silencer, or other accessories.
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:19 AM   #23
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you cannot use a WD hitch on a Subaru (or most other modern cars). It puts too much stress on the unibody structure. Also, many trailers are not rated to take the additional frame torque that WD hitches apply.
Modern unibodied vehicles are quite stout. Stronger than most folks think.

I am aware of a number of Subaru's that are taking advantage of a WDH. I always recommend a towing professional to be involved with this type of installation.
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:32 AM   #24
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Modern unibodied vehicles are quite stout. Stronger than most folks think...........
I think there is something to this whole unibody thing. I've heard that a lot of the newer airplanes are going away from steel frame rails.
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:43 AM   #25
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Modern unibodied vehicles are quite stout. Stronger than most folks think.

I am aware of a number of Subaru's that are taking advantage of a WDH. I always recommend a towing professional to be involved with this type of installation.
When I spoke to Subaru regarding the reason for their not wanting a WD used I was told it was due to their AWD system. It may impact handling in not a good way... No mention if it having anything to do with weak attachment points. Having said that i am aware of a number of people on this forum who have put WD on their Subaru and some have towed thousands of miles over a number of years & no reports of hitch failure, which does not support the notion by some here that the issue is the vehicle isn't stout enough to use a WD.
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:46 AM   #26
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I think there is something to this whole unibody thing. I've heard that a lot of the newer airplanes are going away from steel frame rails.
For sure TG. Even "incomplete", unibody vehicle have success using a WDH.

*Note this rig was set up by a towing setup professional.
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mustang andy trailer.JPG   mustang Stang hitch.JPG  

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Old 09-22-2013, 10:49 AM   #27
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When I spoke to Subaru regarding the reason for their not wanting a WD used I was told........
All info regarding towing should be noted/investigated.

I am interested in the Subaru response but have questions.

Is this info from a document we can review or was it an of the cuff remark from a Subaru salesman, service rep etc????

thnxs C
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Old 09-22-2013, 03:48 PM   #28
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*Note this rig was set up by a towing setup professional.
Professional (in this context) = anyone paid to do something, in contrast to an amateur, who does it free of charge

There is not, to my knowledge, any certification standards or process for a "towing professional", other than
  • licensing of drivers, who operate rigs with trailers
  • professional engineers, none of whom are found at the most popularly referenced RV dealership

You are responsible for your rig. If you disregard the manufacturer of the tow vehicle on the advice of someone selling and installing hitches (or someone in a forum like this), that hitch dealer will not take responsibility for your rig, and their advice does not absolve you of your responsibility.
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Old 09-22-2013, 04:10 PM   #29
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Definition of a professional.......

"a person engaged or qualified in a profession."

Works for me
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Old 09-22-2013, 04:36 PM   #30
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Definition of a professional.......

"a person engaged or qualified in a profession."

Works for me
When I worked in the auto industry, I only met a few engineers that were PEs. Most didn't bother to take the PE exam, though others thought it might help them if they decided to branch out and do some consulting. In any case, those with the PE certificate were not any more qualified or smarter that the others, IMHO. The big difference that I saw in competence was experienced based.

I guess if one was sued, the PE might be something to cling to, to claim competence.
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Old 09-22-2013, 06:27 PM   #31
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Definition of a professional.......

"a person engaged or qualified in a profession."
It's amusing that by this definition, someone who is absolutely unqualified and incompetent can claim to be a professional!

Ever looked at what constitutes a profession? There is no "towing" profession, except by the most minimal definition of something for which you need some skill... by that standard, the kid who sells you an oil filter at Walmart is an automotive maintenance professional. Real professions - medicine, law, engineering, teaching, accounting - require accredited training and working subject to a governing authority (such as a medical board, professional engineering association, etc.)

It would be nice if there were some authority related to services involving towing equipment.
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Old 09-22-2013, 06:49 PM   #32
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When I worked in the auto industry, I only met a few engineers that were PEs. Most didn't bother to take the PE exam, though others thought it might help them if they decided to branch out and do some consulting. In any case, those with the PE certificate were not any more qualified or smarter that the others, IMHO. The big difference that I saw in competence was experienced based.

I guess if one was sued, the PE might be something to cling to, to claim competence.
I don't think there are a lot of engineers working in the auto industry with no education.

So did anyone review the work of those guys? At an auto manufacturer or supplier, my guess is yes.
If their work turned out to be faulty, does the manufacturer take responsibility? Again yes - it happens every day.

So when your hitch guy says "yeah, you can use that", who reviews the decision and does the hitch place take any responsibility? I didn't think so...
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Old 09-22-2013, 07:04 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by MC1 View Post
All info regarding towing should be noted/investigated.

I am interested in the Subaru response but have questions.

Is this info from a document we can review or was it an of the cuff remark from a Subaru salesman, service rep etc????

thnxs C
Well for starters its documented in Subaru's owners manuals that they don't recommend the use of a WDH.

For whats its worth in regards to who told me the reason, it was the service manager (about 20 years with Subaru) for one of the largest Subaru dealers here on the West Coast and he actual tows with his Subaru's as well. Was very helpful in getting my car set up correctly for towing when I first got it and Subaru wasnt offering any of their own hitches etc. Told me he has a trailer thats a bit heavy on the tongue as well, so he did some investigating of his own as why and spoke with some powers that be inside Subaru about the reasons for not using a WDH. I would take his word for it over a hitch installer any day as he knows Subaru's far better.
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Old 09-22-2013, 11:55 PM   #34
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What is the rating of the Subaru factory hitch? Is it any lower than the car's ratings?
From what I know, they don't have a 2 inch. So that's why I was leaning toward an independent.
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Old 09-23-2013, 12:03 AM   #35
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When I spoke to Subaru regarding the reason for their not wanting a WD used I was told it was due to their AWD system. It may impact handling in not a good way... No mention if it having anything to do with weak attachment points. Having said that i am aware of a number of people on this forum who have put WD on their Subaru and some have towed thousands of miles over a number of years & no reports of hitch failure, which does not support the notion by some here that the issue is the vehicle isn't stout enough to use a WD.
I am concerned about voiding my warranty, by doing anything Subaru recommends against ( hitch weight > 200, or WDH). This is the main reason I feel I can't go with with 16 ft Scamp with my Outback 3.6. It would put me over the hitch weight. I've also been told that it could enable insurance to deny any claim. I feel the Scamp is actually smaller than I want but can't pull 16 ft because of the warranty/insurance constraints.
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Old 09-23-2013, 12:05 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by MC1 View Post

All info regarding towing should be noted/investigated.

I am interested in the Subaru response but have questions.

Is this info from a document we can review or was it an of the cuff remark from a Subaru salesman, service rep etc????

thnxs C
The WDH issue is addressed in the manual.
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Old 09-23-2013, 12:08 AM   #37
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From what I know, they don't have a 2 inch. So that's why I was leaning toward an independent.
The reason I was asking about the hitch rating was to confirm that no other hitch - other than the factory hitch - is required to use the full capabilities of the Subaru. While the 2" size is desirable, that size is not the only relevant factor.
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Old 09-23-2013, 12:13 AM   #38
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The reason I was asking about the hitch rating was to confirm that no other hitch - other than the factory hitch - is required to use the full capabilities of the Subaru. While the 2" size is desirable, that size is not the only relevant factor.
I'm still learning all this. But I was under the impression the Scamp required a 2 in. And if Subaru doesn't make that, then I have no choice but to go to a hitch installer, regardless of other factors.
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Old 09-23-2013, 12:20 AM   #39
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I'm still learning all this. But I was under the impression the Scamp required a 2 in.
Learning is good!

The Scamp requires a 2" diameter ball; that can be mounted by a receiver of any size. The ball size and receiver size are unrelated; the receiver size is the size of the square box opening in the receiver.

There are some hitch parts which are only available for a 2" receiver, but none of them are needed to tow the Scamp. Some members are convinced that a weight-distributing hitch (WDH) system is desirable; if you decide it is (even though Subaru says not to use one), then you need a 2" receiver.
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Old 09-23-2013, 02:50 AM   #40
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We tow our 2009 Trillium 1300 with a 2000 Subaru Outback 2.5L.
Our owner's manual also says no WDH because of the effect it has on the AWD system.
We had our hitch installed by our dealer. We bought the car new with a hitch. It turns out that the dealer, Auburn Subaru, had it installed by Torq Lift. Torq lift also installed our electric brake controller when we got our Trillium.
All have been working fine. Our weight, according to Fred Simpson is 1840#.
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