Is a 5000lb capacity enough to take a 16'-17' anywhere?

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by bill&sandra

The Honda Pilot is not the same as the 2010 Honda Ridgeline. pg 295 from the 2010 Ridgeline:

# occupants Max Trailer Weight Max Tongue Weight
2 5,000 lbs 600 lbs
3 4,750 lbs 600 lbs
4 4,750 lbs 570 lbs
5 4,500 lbs 516 lbs

The Ridgeline is BASED on the Pilot, but weighs less, main reason I bought it, the combined load is better

Forgive me for giving a wrong impression. I wasn't suggesting a Pilot is the same as a Ridgeline or any other vehicle. I was only using it to illustrate a general point applicable to all vehicles, namely that carrying additional payload in the vehicle reduces available towing capacity. Whether that is a problem depends on the vehicle, the payload, and the trailer.

I am a fan of the Ridgeline (the older ones; I'm not as keen on the new ones). Unfortunately, we need the extra seats and enclosed cargo space of the Pilot for other reasons besides towing.

[dlroyer]

We are two, with a dog and some gear, as we like to boondock. But not a lot of gear, as I used to backpack and feel less gear means less chores in camp.

The Scamp is new this spring. We pull with a 2016 4 Runner, bought used from Hertz Car Rental. Found out online and in person that they have the best deals around here for used, sometimes thousands below Blue Book. Came with a 12 month, or 12,000 mile warranty from Hertz in addition to the remaining one on the drive train from Toyota. It is in very good shape, appearance and mechanicals.

We have done our Rockies nearby and a lot of flat and hilly on the way back from Backus, Minnesota to New Mexico. It is quite enough power and size, on climbs as well as high altitude. It came with a tow package, so all we had to do was plug in the brake controller.

We are not usually doing more than 65 with this rig, but could, and have, on good road. We get about 21 mpg without the Scamp, about 15 mpg towing it. It weighs 2400 dry weight, with 250 tongue weight.

Pulls like a dream, especially compared to the dual axle horse trailer (steel, not ultralight) we used to pull, with or without horses, behind a full size 350 V8 pickup.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by vintageracer

...Buy a tow vehicle with the tow capacity that will tow anything or any weight safely you think you might ever want to tow and then buy a tow vehicle one step bigger as you will in all likely hood need it!...

We clearly come from different schools of thought. I am willing to accept some limitations on undetermined future possibilities in order to have a vehicle that I actually need and want to drive today. Knowing yourself helps to narrow down the future possibilities.

You really don't need to think in terms of forever, just the lifespan of a vehicle (whatever that means for you).

[thrifty bill]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

We clearly come from different schools of thought. I am willing to accept some limitations of future possibilities in order to have a vehicle that I actually need and want to drive today.

You really don't need to think in terms of forever, just the lifespan of a vehicle (whatever that means for you).

Knowing yourself helps to narrow down the future possibilities.

Given the durability of molded fiberglass trailers, if we can avoid two foot itis, I fully expect our Escape to last through several generations of tow vehicles. I've been putting 30,000 miles a year on our F150 since we bought it used two years ago. (Good thing we bought it with just 12,000 miles on it.) I figure we will be closing in on 150,000 miles in another three years, which is usually about the time I look for a replacement.

At the same time, knowing my propensity for another two feet, I try to have enough vehicle to easily handle the current trailer and at least one model up. That made the move from a 17 foot Casita to a 19 foot Escape easy.

[Byron Kinnaman]

Originally Posted by RobTs

i

Anyway, will a 5000lb tow limit be enough to pull this dream rig through some mountains?

To pull a 16' or 17' trailer you should have at least double that.

[Jim Bennett]

I towed an Escape 19 for over six years, mostly with a 2009 Honda Pilot with a 4,500 lb tow capacity, and only felt under powered a few times. It did just fine, and we loved having it when camping for running around.

I currently am down to 3 trailers, 2 are for work, and have never once had insurance concerned about the weight, either actual or GVWR. Even when in an accident with one of my work trailers 10 years ago, it was never questioned. I know of one accident where the holiday trailer was totalled, insurance came through for them with full replacement, and never once questioned the tow capacity.

With commercial vehicle licensing, you have to be licensed for the weight of the truck and trailer combined, but not for non-commercial use.

[Glenn Baglo]

Originally Posted by Byron Kinnaman

To pull a 16' or 17' trailer you should have at least double that.

You are kidding?
I've towed my Escape 17B with my 2008 RAV4 V6 Sport ( tow prep ) for more than eight years without any issues.
The RAV4 has 3,500 lb tow and 350 lb tongue limits. The trailer comes in at 3,100 loaded with 320 lb. tongue weight. I use a weight distribution hitch for a more comfortable, secure ride.

[steve dunham]

Just because vehicles have equal tow ratings does not mean they tow equally . We haul firewood in the fall in our utility trailer
(Approx 5/8 cord of oak--2500 lbs) We have towed the trailer with 3 different trucks, a Ford F150 , a Ram 1500 and a Nissan Frontier
all which have tow ratings that well exceed 2500 lbs.
All it took for me was to hit a couple large bumps in the road or having to swerve to miss a deer or make a couple panic stops to realize that tow ratings have very little to do with how well a vehicle tows. I would not attempt to tow my Casita with one of the above named trucks and I will end my post right here.

Some vehicles just tow better than others !

[Glenn Baglo]

Perhaps that has more to do with the suspension ( or lack of it ) on your utility trailer than the tow vehicle?
Anyway, I'm glad you agree that my RAV4 tows better than some other vehicles.

[Jim Bennett]

I have owned a 3/4 or 1 ton diesel for over 25 years now, having to tow heavy construction trailers, which they did with ease. After buying my 2015 Ford F-150, a few months back I sold of my F-350, and was actually glad to not have to go with such big pickups.

I was a bit concerned with my dump trailer, and towing it with the F-150. The trailer dry is 4,500 lbs and it does not take long doing renovation work to put a lot of weight of rubble in it. I made sure it was not all that heavy the first few loads, which it towed like a dream, lots of power even on hills. I then quit worrying and towed heavier loads with no problem. I am looking at a weigh bill for 2,340 kg (5,150 lb) in dump fees, for a total trailer weight of 9,650 lbs. I could tell the weight was there for sure, but I had no issue with it at all. My biggest concern is the tongue weight, as I have no idea what that was, but the truck squatted at least 2 inches when hitched but not much more, and there was no indication of potential for sway, so all seemed good.

So I can without reservation say that an F-150 would tow any moulded fibreglass trailer out there, let alone a 16-17 ft one. So yeah, most any mid-sized SUV will tow up to 17 ft with no problem, and those with 5,000 lb capacity will easily tow an Escape 19 or 21. Folks are having success with this combination a lot. It is what I would be doing with one of those trailers, for sure.

Fortunately, the "big is better" attitude I have witnessed over the years is dwindling. Right sized is slowly making it's way to the norm. Heck I knew a few folks that drove full sized Chevy Suburbans not because they needed the capacity at all, they did so because they felt safer, which is mostly a fallacy, and one that wastes a lot of fuel.

In no way am I condoning a vehicle that does not have the rated capacity to tow the trailer intended, but as long as you stay within the tow vehicle limits AND have properly set up trailer brakes, all is good.

[The x kid]

Try to find a v8 4runner. Towing and a little offloading in one.

[Franswa]

20%....

find the tow rating in your owners manual....take 20% off

don't tow anything heavier than that

[Franswa]

20%....

find the tow rating in your owners manual....take 20% off

don't tow anything heavier than that....carry on....

[Franswa]

don't type in the dark......

[Jim G. - Ohio]

It is much better to have a towing safety margin than to max out your capacity.

[goalie39]

Love my 2015 4Runner with 2010 Escape 19'. The 4Runner is a great all-purpose vehicle. Haven't towed with it in the Rockies yet, but no problems in the Sierra Nevada mountains of California.
My Escape does weigh less than the newer 2nd generation Escape 19's, and it also has a 3" frame (not 4") which makes it lighter too.
I highly recommend adding a transmission cooler. I also towed with a standard hitch with sway bar initially. It was ok, but much prefer the Equalizer WDH -- much smoother and rock steady.

[brendadave]

Just be careful with capacities and ratings, I just went through this before I chose my new TV. Some auto makers have a posted tow rating of 5000, but when you add curb weight, cargo rating, and tow capacity it went way over the GCWR. The only way to achieve 5000lbs was to be just a driver and no cargo. Just make sure to look at all numbers and do some math before you make a choice. I also looked at rear GAWR to see what kind of weight it can handle.

[floyd]

If you max out your capacity, it will break... but then the subject is ratings.

So... are we building a consensus that the manufacturers should not be trusted to set the ratings, even with the help of the Society of Automotive Engineers and the new SAE J2807 standard?

I tend to agree with the premise, but with a twist... I always want to know WHY before making new rules. ( trust but verify?)

Platitudes notwithstanding...
Who is the person who made the 20% rule? What are his credentials?
What facts were used to arrive at his conclusions?

[vintageracer]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

We clearly come from different schools of thought. I am willing to accept some limitations on undetermined future possibilities in order to have a vehicle that I actually need and want to drive today. Knowing yourself helps to narrow down the future possibilities.

You really don't need to think in terms of forever, just the lifespan of a vehicle (whatever that means for you).

Jon,

I guess "I" do think in terms of "Forever" when it comes to trucks, trailers and equipment. My primary TV turns 23 years old this month since my purchase when it was new in September 1994. It's the only vehicle I have ever purchased new. I still have it and USE it almost ever week to tow something!

My newest trailer is a 1997 model I purchased new. All my other trailers (cargo and travel) are much older than that, were all purchased used and were considered "High End" when sold new to the original purchaser.

With the exception of that one 1995 F350 I bought new I have always purchased "High End" used trucks, trailers and equipment rather than "Lower End" new trucks, trailers and equipment. Generally spend I the same amount of money or more buying "High End" equipment used than "Lower End" equipment new however I get a much better piece of equipment/trailer that will last for years and retains it's value much better than cheap trailers/equipment.

For these reasons I have always made sure the truck I pull a trailer with has no issues whatsoever concerning that trucks ability to tow, control, pull and more importantly STOP that trailer and its cargo safely. The best part of this is that newer trucks do all the above MUCH better with each generation of truck!

Below is a pictures of that 1995 F350 truck pulling my 1957 Avion trailer.

Witness our older fiberglass trailers as an example of a trailer that holds it value very well.

Good to hear from you!

[stevebaz]

The makers don't use the new standards on all vehicles and are not required to. Towing capacities are manipulated to push people out of one car model to another to increase sales of particular models. I wish all cars were required to use the new standards and that those ratings were posted for every model then you would be comparing apples to apples. I believe it would really compromise the newer small displacement engines manufacturers are using to meet mileage goals.