Is my axel on backwards?

[AlanKilian]

From: https://www.caranddriver.com/volvo/x...olvo-xc40_2021

Maximum Trailer Weight, dead weight hitch (pounds) 3500
Maximum Tongue Weight, dead weight hitch (pounds) 350

That seems ample for out 13' Scamp

Also, that wonderful hitch is only available in Europe. (Go America!)
So I'll probably have to go with a UHaul or Curt hitch:
https://www.etrailer.com/hitch-2021_Volvo_XC40.htm


The factory Volvo hitch is US$1200 without wiring, so that seems a bit steep.

2021 XC40 wheelbase is 106"
2005 CRV wheelbase was 103" and we towed fine with that.
Our current 2004 V70 wheelbase is 108" and we can't really feel the trailer behind that one.

ALSO, we're going to now have both brakes and a working suspension, so I'm excited!

What do you think?

[AC0GV]

Originally Posted by AlanKilian

I wrote to Scamp and gave them the trailer serial number and just got back a link to their replacement axle without brakes and a note saying I "might" be able to use the newer axle with brakes if I modified some things It was a bit of a disappointment.

The fire (2006 ?) distroyed all the records. The history was lost.

[EllPea in CA]

Originally Posted by AlanKilian

From: https://www.caranddriver.com/volvo/x...olvo-xc40_2021

Maximum Trailer Weight, dead weight hitch (pounds) 3500
Maximum Tongue Weight, dead weight hitch (pounds) 350

That seems ample for out 13' Scamp

Also, that wonderful hitch is only available in Europe. (Go America!)
So I'll probably have to go with a UHaul or Curt hitch:
https://www.etrailer.com/hitch-2021_Volvo_XC40.htm


The factory Volvo hitch is US$1200 without wiring, so that seems a bit steep.

2021 XC40 wheelbase is 106"
2005 CRV wheelbase was 103" and we towed fine with that.
Our current 2004 V70 wheelbase is 108" and we can't really feel the trailer behind that one.

ALSO, we're going to now have both brakes and a working suspension, so I'm excited!

What do you think?

I think it sounds great. But I worry the spec you are finding of 350 lbs hitch weight is the spec for the hitch, not the car. This is exactly what happened to me! My car can TOW 3300 pounds. But is limited to a hitch weight of 165 pounds. INSANE.

Yet, the Thule towbar specifically made for my car is "capable" of supporting a hitch weight of 350 pounds. But the car is not. INSANE.


I realize that these are tow bars made specifically for each model of Volvo, and they are very strong, but that doesn't change the limitations of the vehicle itself, (or so I have been somewhat verbally battered into believing elsewhere on these forums).

If I'm wrong I would seriously consider getting rid of the XC60 (which I LOVE with a passion) and looking into a XC40, because the whole idea was to step up to a larger trailer. (But I still can't imagine that little 40 pulling something bigger!)

Again, I realize that you are towing a Scamp, which is light like my 13'. You may be fine... so long as the XC40 is happy with the hitch weight.

(and I was quoted $2000 parts and labor to get the tow bar on the XC60, with all of the software, etc. I think the Volvo setup for the V70 was about $1800, with no software.)

[AlanKilian]

Originally Posted by EllPea in CA

I think it sounds great. But I worry the spec you are finding of 350 lbs hitch weight is the spec for the hitch, not the car.

How about a link to Volvo directly?


https://www.volvocars.com/en-ca/supp...-tongue-weight

https://az685612.vo.msecnd.net/pdfs/...GB_TP32876.pdf

[EllPea in CA]

Originally Posted by AlanKilian

How about a link to Volvo directly?


https://www.volvocars.com/en-ca/supp...-tongue-weight

https://az685612.vo.msecnd.net/pdfs/...GB_TP32876.pdf

I'd say you've done your homework, you are fine, and I am now nearly suicidal. Am posting this question to the XC60 group!

[AlanKilian]

Originally Posted by EllPea in CA

I am now nearly suicidal.

Please let us know what you hear from them.

I'm certainly unsure since I sometimes get to the non-USA Volvo sites, and the towing capacities are completely different "out there".

I guess they have different mass, friction and inertia than we do here.

Anyway, I think we're going to be OK.
(US$45K lighter in the wallet should help towing also.)

[EllPea in CA]

Originally Posted by AlanKilian

Please let us know what you hear from them.

I'm certainly unsure since I sometimes get to the non-USA Volvo sites, and the towing capacities are completely different "out there".

I guess they have different mass, friction and inertia than we do here.

Anyway, I think we're going to be OK.
(US$45K lighter in the wallet should help towing also.)

Well, EXACTLY. XC60 owners in Europe and Australia are towing HUGE caravans, and they are quite within the specs for their country. Several of us have been in contact with Volvo which continues to maintain we stick to the manual... for our country. We believe the car is quite capable of handling 350 lbs hitch weight, and many owners do so (taking the hitch specs at face value and ignoring the car specs).

But as has been pointed out in other threads, if there were to be an accident there might be serious liability issues... so, some of us do and some of us don't.

Well, that $45K lighter certainly gives you more room for extra weight! Maybe I will wait a year or two before looking into the XC40 as a TV (my 2017 was around $29K out the door last August).

Enjoy, if the 40 is as fabulous as my 60 you're going to LOVE IT.

[Alex Adams]

According to the US owner's manual, the XC-40 can tow 3500 pounds with brakes or 1650 pounds without while limiting tongue weight in either case to 350 pounds.
https://volvornt.harte-hanks.com/man...US_TP32898.pdf

[AlanKilian]

The axle plus electric brakes turned out to be US$600 including shipping, so I think that's pretty fine.


It might ship by Friday so I'll post photos when it arrives.


Now on to ordering 5 on 4.5" trailer tires and rims.
(Too many to choose from!!!)

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by AlanKilian

The axle plus electric brakes turned out to be US$600 including shipping, so I think that's pretty fine.


It might ship by Friday so I'll post photos when it arrives.


Now on to ordering 5 on 4.5" trailer tires and rims.
(Too many to choose from!!!)

Don’t forget you need zero offset. That may narrow the field a bit.

Thanks for the update. Progress is good!

[EllPea in CA]

Originally Posted by Alex Adams

According to the US owner's manual, the XC-40 can tow 3500 pounds with brakes or 1650 pounds without while limiting tongue weight in either case to 350 pounds.
https://volvornt.harte-hanks.com/man...US_TP32898.pdf

Alex, yep, that’s where I got my info. I’m mystified, as the XC40 is smaller than my XC60, which can tow 3500 pounds, but can only accept 165 lbs on hitch in US.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by EllPea in CA

Alex, yep, that’s where I got my info. I’m mystified, as the XC40 is smaller than my XC60, which can tow 3500 pounds, but can only accept 165 lbs on hitch in US.

Just speculating... J2807.

Europeans tow with as little as 5% tongue weight. North Americans typically tow with 10% or more , and that 10% figure is codified in the J2807 tow testing standards.

The Subaru Outback is a popular compact tow vehicle long saddled with an unusually low tongue weight rating (2700/200#). Subaru’s latest 2020 redesign of the Outback brought tongue ratings up to the 10% mark, likely indicating they are now designing and testing to J2807. It may be that Volvo is doing the same for their NA-spec vehicles as they go through major redesign cycles.

Compliance with J2807 is voluntary. Smaller manufacturers and manufacturers for whom towing is not a big part of their market in NA have been slower to adopt the standards.

[Alex Adams]

Originally Posted by EllPea in CA

Alex, yep, that’s where I got my info. I’m mystified, as the XC40 is smaller than my XC60, which can tow 3500 pounds, but can only accept 165 lbs on hitch in US.

Remember that part of the limit on the tongue weight is what the structure of the backend of the vehicle is. That may be the limiting factor for your XC60. A Toyota Corolla manufactured before 2011 had a towing capacity of 1500 lbs but when they redesigned the body, it lost towing capability completely.

[AlanKilian]

Originally Posted by EllPea in CA

Alex, yep, that’s where I got my info. I’m mystified, as the XC40 is smaller than my XC60, which can tow 3500 pounds, but can only accept 165 lbs on hitch in US.

The XC40 is a new "platform" that started in 2019 so it's completely different from the platform for the XC60 and XC90 models.

This is where the difference in towing comes from.

XC40 is the CMA platform.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compac...cture_platform


XC60/90 is the SPA platform.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volvo_...cture_platform

[EllPea in CA]

Originally Posted by Alex Adams

Remember that part of the limit on the tongue weight is what the structure of the backend of the vehicle is. That may be the limiting factor for your XC60. A Toyota Corolla manufactured before 2011 had a towing capacity of 1500 lbs but when they redesigned the body, it lost towing capability completely.

Alex,
Sometimes I think drivers should have to take a class and a driving test for a license before towing. I can't tell you how many discussions I've had in other groups, where a driver will brag his vehicle can tow 5000# but has no idea what the hitch weight limit is, or even what a hitch weight is. Sometimes I've asked about this and have received the answer "5000 lbs." Then you see a photo with the trailer and the TV sagging and the hitch way too low. So obviously there's a problem there.

And explaining the difference between what the engine can pull and what the backend structure can support is sometimes a nightmare with a brick wall involved. Add to this the complications of the specs for the aftermarket towbar (like for my car) which has double the capacity of the vehicle. The TOWBAR does NOT increase the capacity of the vehicle... although I wish it did.

[EllPea in CA]

Originally Posted by AlanKilian

The XC40 is a new "platform" that started in 2019 so it's completely different from the platform for the XC60 and XC90 models.

This is where the difference in towing comes from.

XC40 is the CMA platform.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compac...cture_platform


XC60/90 is the SPA platform.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volvo_...cture_platform

Alan,
Thank you for this. You have provided answers I haven't even received from Vovo. And they came from WIKIPEDIA! (When I was teaching English, we wouldn't accept Wikipedia as a source in a bibliography, but it has come a long way since then!)

Additionally, since our discussion, I'm (sadly) seriously considering trading the XC60 in for a XC40. If any of my Volvo discussing groups, or even initial research on the web, had made this difference in platform clear, I would have made a different choice in the first place (although I love my car with a passion).

But to put a proper Volvo towbar on with electronics and software is going to run around $2000 (and I can't get that sexy retractable hitch that's available in Europe). I was all in for doing this until accidentally discovering the difference in towbar and vehicle hitch weights.

Before making any rash moves, however, more hefty research on weights of the dream trailer is in order.

Thanks again for posting the video which got all of this started. I hope I haven't been too much of a pest.

[AlanKilian]

Mmmmmmm......

New Flexiride axle arrived today!
Waiting for three new tires/wheels and then it's a trip to drop it off at the welding shop.

I can't WAIT!

[Jon in AZ]

Progress is good!

[AlanKilian]

She's back on her feet!

Tows like a dream (no surprise there) with 50 PSI in the tires.

Ended up replacing the coupler to get a 2" ball and two safety chains so I can be Massachusetts-legal.

Amherst Welding did a great job chopping out the old one and the old modifications, adding new reinforcement and lowered the axle, welded on the coupler and chains, modified the rear spare tire holder, wired up the brakes and left me a nicely supported dead-end wire so I can hook up the rest.

US$800 but super well worth it (to me) to have professionals do all this work for me.

Now on to the Tekonsha Prodigy RF brake controller installation, the breakaway switch installation, house battery+solar charger and all the rest before a first test outing somewhere close.

[AlanKilian]

The Tekonsha Pridigy RF brake controller installed quite easily.
People complain about not being able to pair the remote, but it want just as in the instruction manual the first time.

I only had to wire the 7-way in the Scamp twice to get it right. :-)

The brakes click when I hit the brake switch on the remote-control, but we can still push the trailer around, so maybe I need to adjust the brakes. Or maybe since it doesn't sense any acceleration it doesn't brake very much. I'll read some before I take it for a test drive.