Newbie needs Tow Vehicle help

[Vicki Hale]

Floyd,
This is good to hear because I did see a few of these at the used car lots.
Yes sir, I am very much behind the times about the improvements that have been made in the auto industry and it has really hit home now that I am looking for a vehicle that will be capable of doing a specific job.
If you don't mind me asking, has your Ford done well with long hauls, say 10 hour nonstop (except for gas) drives? Any troubles with engine or transmission overheating or anything like that?
I may be being overly concerned about the amount of strain the Scamp 13 will put on a tow vehicle. I know they are considered "a light weight and easy to tow camper" but I have a zero knowledge-base on the TV end of that statement.

[Radar1]

I second the Subaru Outback recommendations. It works well with the 13' Scamp. We pulled our 16' Scamp with ours, but you have to really want to cut back on weight to meet the 200 lb tongue weight limit with the 16'. The 13' Scamp is able to achieve the tongue weight limit easier.
Extra benefits of the Outback are the outstanding safety record, plus good MPG while out touring the area, plus plenty of room for camping supplies. The all wheel drive is also very handy in wet slippery conditions found on many back roads in the South, or snowy roads in the North.

[Raz]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

A cheaper truck alternative is a Nissan Frontier. It has good reliability but mediocre gas mileage.

Just to put some numbers on it, last trip west I got 17+ mpg doing the speed limit (65-70). Drop down to 55 and I get 18 to 19 mpg. The worst was 15 mpg in city traffic with lots of stop and go. All towing my Trillium (1800 lbs). Mediocre, perhaps. But if I have to get out of the way, I can.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Vicki Hale

Floyd,
This is good to hear because I did see a few of these at the used car lots.
Yes sir, I am very much behind the times about the improvements that have been made in the auto industry and it has really hit home now that I am looking for a vehicle that will be capable of doing a specific job.
If you don't mind me asking, has your Ford done well with long hauls, say 10 hour nonstop (except for gas) drives? Any troubles with engine or transmission overheating or anything like that?
I may be being overly concerned about the amount of strain the Scamp 13 will put on a tow vehicle. I know they are considered "a light weight and easy to tow camper" but I have a zero knowledge-base on the TV end of that statement.

Before I had my Transit Connect, I towed with a 2.3L Ford Escape 4CYL. Several trips over a thousand miles, one trip was 5800 miles to the west coast, a few trips were to Florida, and the rest all over the Midwest, often exceeding 500miles one way.
Fuel mileage was consistently in the twenties and never an issue.
My son now has the 2008 Escape with 120,000 miles so far without adding oil between changes.

With our Transit Connect, we have made one trip so far to Sebring FL ScampCamp (3000 miles round trip)... Michigan twice, Minnesota, Iowa, Illinois.
Each trip over 1000 miles except the Illinois trip.

We are heading to Sebring next month with the Transit Connect, towing our Scamp13D front bath. Last year was 25MPG @ 59MPH.


Full disclosure... I also have a V6 and a couple of V8s.

[Vicki Hale]

"Dealer lots, new or used, are the worst places to start! Go there once you have a very clear idea of what you're looking for. "

Jon, you must have been watching me on the lots yesterday! LOL, It did not take me long to realize my mistake and go home. I needed more information. I also needed to know what things like turbo-boost, eco-boost mean and what-liter engine, and what-wheel drive...like I said...I was a deer caught in headlights...
I don't need to go and look at what they have; I need see if they have what I'm looking for.

In great part from the help on this forum, I'm getting things sorted out a little. I am compiling my short-list for the TV and also the add-ons I need to have.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by Raz

Just to put some numbers on it, last trip west I got 17+ mpg doing the speed limit (65-70). Drop down to 55 and I get 18 to 19 mpg. The worst was 15 mpg in city traffic with lots of stop and go. All towing my Trillium (1800 lbs). Mediocre, perhaps. But if I have to get out of the way, I can.

To clarify, I meant mediocre non-towing fuel economy.

Those towing numbers sound pretty typical for a 13' egg. My Pilot/Scamp is about the same. Towing is what it is. Speed, trailer size/weight, terrain, and wind matter more than what you pull it with.

[Civilguy]

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

A wee moderator note. Please use real words in the title, as a TV is primarily known as a television and I came in here to recommend a Samsung.

BTW, fixed the title.

How about "tug" then, oh wee moderator?

[Civilguy]

Originally Posted by Vicki Hale

The original plan was to buy a used camper and a new TV. That has flipped since I cannot find a used camper. Now, the camper will be new and the TV will be used.

Welcome to the forum Vicki. You are getting some good information on this thread. There’s probably nothing we enjoy more than spending other people’s money on big-ticket items like a vehicle or a trailer!

First off, I believe that Scamp is pretty forgiving if you place a deposit and you are then successful in finding a used trailer and cancelling the order. This would allow you to go back to the “new” tow vehicle approach.

Originally Posted by Vicki Hale

This week, I've walked around three used car lots with only a vague idea of what I'm looking for. "A 6 cylinder vehicle with a tow rate of 2,000 or more" was the only criteria I was trying to match. I felt like a deer caught in headlights...
There was a LOT matching that criteria and I was trying to narrow things down on site while beating sales people off with a stick. This method of TV shopping was not going to work. I didn't have enough info yet. I need to know what specific qualities the vehicle should have to do the job.

Yes, you will benefit greatly by researching first. No one else has the same interest in the long term results of your decision. You might consider shopping for a 3,500 lb tow rating as a minimum.

Originally Posted by Vicki Hale

I plan to buy a used vehicle to help with the price.
I have only owned Honda, Nissan and Toyota but willing to try other brands. (used American made seems to be a little cheaper in price)

First, recall what Jon said if you buy used; tow ratings vary for different years, models and trim lines, so be sure you know what specific capacity rating applies to the exact vehicle that you are purchasing. Consult the owner’s manual for the specific year and model, and consult information such as payload labeled on the vehicle.

A potential disadvantage here of buying used is that it may take some consultation with a dealer to determine if your target vehicle has been factory-fitted with items necessary to achieve a given rating, such as a transmission cooler. A manufacturer’s dealership should be able to determine this if you give them the vehicle’s VIN. However, if you are buying used from a private party, or buying used on a different manufacturer’s lot, you might have to ask them to wait while you determine this. The vehicle manuals tend to retreat into vague language like “when properly equipped” when discussing vehicle tow ratings, which can leave you with a nagging sense of uncertainty.

Originally Posted by Vicki Hale

My vehicles have always been 4 cylinder cars and trucks because I was only interested in gas mileage and reliability.
Now I need to know what type/size engine and transmission handles towing well.
What add-ons need to be on the vehicle to make it a good TV. (Jon, the info on the 7 pin wiring was VERY helpful, thank you!)

Vehicles and their reliability have in general improved greatly over the years and decades. Many of the vehicles which are rated as being relatively unreliable compared to their peers today are actually quite reliable. And, as always, there are a (very) few genuine stinkers mixed into the bunch. Though some here will disagree, I think that using Consumer Report’s reliability ratings is beneficial as one source of information. However, it can be difficult to determine if a specific model vehicle has “borderline-poor” reliability, or if it’s real stinker. It seems that staying out of the bottom of their five ratings should be sufficient to avoid this.

Finally, you may have some risk in buying a vehicle that won’t accommodate an upgrade to a larger, heavier trailer. Buying another trailer can often be done cheaply at present as demand for used molded fiberglass trailers currently remains very high. However, replacing a tow vehicle can be very expensive if you just bought a new one which immediately depreciated when you drove it off the dealer's lot.

[redbarron55]

To save time just buy a Diesel 3/4 ton dually, it will tow the 13' trailer.
Anything less and someone will say you are trying to kill yourself and eveyone you share the road with

[Vicki Hale]

LOL, that's a good one.

[thrifty bill]

Sadly many car lots have one goal in mind, selling you a car. Whether it will work or not, they often don't really care. Study up first on the key attributes on a tow vehicle. I bet there is a thread out there already on someone towing with a Subaru Outback.

Going to need a brake controller and seven wire plug. Rare to find an Outback or similar with that set up, so you will have to do that after you have the vehicle.

Smart to order the trailer first. Now you know for sure EXACTLY what you are going to tow, and suitable used tow vehicles are more plentiful than used Scamps. Its also easier to get a used car inspected. I bought my truck long distance (three hours away, one way). I had no interest in driving over there and THEN deciding whether it was OK. So I had the seller drop it off at the local Ford dealer, and I arranged for a complete inspection at my expense. Came out prefect, so we drove on over with cash and finished the deal. One nice thing about arranging for the inspection and paying for it, was it was MY inspection, not the sellers. So I got the report. No worries about it being shaded or getting an incomplete report.


Here's one thread on this topic (there are many, many more). On towing capabilities, specs for the same model vehicle can change year to year. So knowing which years to look for is important. Fortunately, in this world with the internet, you can quickly check ratings, so you are not stuck believing car salesman.


http://www.fiberglassrv.com/forums/f...3-a-65128.html

[Vicki Hale]

I heard that about Scamp while researching their campers. I haven't given up hope finding a used 13' molded fiberglass camper but after months of searching for one in this region of the US and wading through Craigslist scams, things started to look pretty dim. And it was a blow realizing part of my budget for the TV will have to be rerouted into the budget for the camper. But, it is what it is...
One good thing about getting the tow vehicle first, if I do find a used camper, I will be able to haul it home without imposing on friends and borrowing their trucks.
I'm starting to get my feet under me with what to look for in a TV. In the beginning, I thought I could just buy a little 4 cylinder truck, install a hitch, and hit the road.
LOL, I'm such a newb...

[Lee Senn]

One more piece of advice , you probably have already figured this one out but just in case . Never , I repeat never , take the word of a car salesperson as to what a vehicle will tow . Most of them have absolutely no clue about towing anything but will state towing capacities as though they wrote the book. Lee and Norma

[steve dunham]

Originally Posted by redbarron55

To save time just buy a Diesel 3/4 ton dually, it will tow the 13' trailer.
Anything less and someone will say you are trying to kill yourself and eveyone you share the road with

Thank You !!!!!!!! My sentiments exactly .

[Tom 72]

I read many, not all preceding posts. You are getting great advice.

If no one has mentioned it, go to the library and look for the April issue of Consumer Reports. They tell you how to buy a vehicle and have it down to a science. I have not checked in a while, I'm sure you can read up on Subarau Outbacks, and many SUVs, including reliability.

They may cover small pickups, I don't recall big pickups, but it would not surprise me, as SUVs & trucks are what sells. Ask GM.

I think it was Floyd that said small engines are a big deal. 2.0 liter engines with turbos are everywhere.

The new Mercedes Sprinter van has a 2.0 turbo as its stock engine. Not prepared to recommend for towing. Just interesting. Amazon just bought 20,000, I don't know which engine.

PS, some questioned the 2.0 liter turbocharged gas engine, citing the 2018's. I am referring to the 2019. Once available, stock will be a 2.0 turbo.

https://www.tfltruck.com/2018/09/201...s-tech-review/

[Vicki Hale]

Bill, Thank you for giving me this link. I am reading through it now and finding lots of useful information.

[Keith2000]

Once you get down to a workable list of two to four vehicles I recommend going by a CarMax and test driving them. They don't have the best prices, but they are relatively low pressure and they typically have a good selection of vehicles in good condition for you to test drive.

While most new cars will be good, finding the one that best fits you will be great.

[Vicki Hale]

Thank you Keith for the good advice.
I just got back from looking around 2 more used car lots.
The first one on my list is a 6 cyl. Nissan Frontier. I do like driving trucks so this may be a good fit. The only used 6cyl. in my area has 120,000 miles and that's just too many miles. Searching Auto Trader, but the only other ones I've found are in TN., about 50 miles away (I'm in AL). I did look at a new one just to get an idea of truck size and interior. There are some used 4 cylinders here but oddly no 6cyl.

Right now I only have 2 vehicles on my list:
1.Nissan Frontier
2. Ford Escape (maybe also a Ford Edge but have not researched it yet)

The other SUVs recommended are out of my price range, the Santa Fe, Pilot, and Outback.

[redbarron55]

I test drove a lot of cars etc and found that in the 3500 lb range we liked the Chrysler Town and Country the best overall.
Good mileage and comfortable.
Short trips and long trips we enjoyed the space, power etc.
Recently finished a tour of 9300 miles averaging 16 mpg towing a heavy 16' Scamp.

[Vicki Hale]

Thanks JD, I haven't thought about mini vans. Just checked Auto Trader and there is a nice one listed. They sure are roomy! While looking at the pics I was thinking there's more room and storage space in this car than in the 13 Scamp!