Towing a 13' with a turbo 4 cyl.

[John in Santa Cruz]

Originally Posted by Wayne Collins

Way Back When… we towed our 13 DLX Scamp with a VW Vanagon 4 cylinder, non turbo, Manual shift. As long as you're not the kind that has the always lead the pack, and drive judiciously, any car/van/suv/truck will pull a 13 footer no problem.

a VW Van, including the T3 "Vanagon" had a 2000 lb payload if its stripped and qualifies as a 1 ton vehicle. sure, its hopelessly underpowered.

[Wayne Collins]

Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz

a VW Van, including the T3 "Vanagon" had a 2000 lb payload if its stripped and qualifies as a 1 ton vehicle. sure, its hopelessly underpowered.

Maybe so, but it made good mileage,. You had to know how to shift down on the grades, and we did not mind being a bit slower than al the gas gushers and lead foots.

[RJM]

Originally Posted by Wayne Collins

Way Back When… we towed our 13 DLX Scamp with a VW Vanagon 4 cylinder, non turbo, Manual shift. As long as you're not the kind that has the always lead the pack, and drive judiciously, any car/van/suv/truck will pull a 13 footer no problem.

Way Back When...........now we know better. And should. It's not all about fuel economy and speed.

[John in Santa Cruz]

Originally Posted by Wayne Collins

Maybe so, but it made good mileage,. You had to know how to shift down on the grades, and we did not mind being a bit slower than al the gas gushers and lead foots.

hey, we had a T2 camper (conversion, not westy) with an aircooled 1600 single carb. it got us all over the western states. my son had a T3 Vanagon westie til the engine blew right after we finally sorted out the fuel injection (it had a Tiico conversion with a 2.0L audi inline engine, using some diesel T3 components).

[Stephen_Albers]

When considering tow vehicle size, consider this. Internal combustion engines produce power most efficiently at near their maximum output. Aircraft typically cruise at 70-75% power. To push your tow vehicle down a flat road at 55 mph takes roughly 35 hp. So an engine of - say - 150 hp would be operating very inefficiently at about 30% of rated capacity. Add to that, towing a trailer increases needed hp by maybe 10 hp. So the need for a high hp tow vehicle for highway towing is a marketing fiction. Where the situation changes is in mountainous terrain. As any big rig truck shows, hauling heavy loads over mountains requires increased torque, not RPM. Gas engines are mostly about rpm, not torque. Diesel engines are about torque, not rpm. So diesels can happily downshift to produce continuously their rated hp and torque for mountain driving and deliver economical highway cruising. The turbodiesel in my tow vehicle is 76 hp and delivers about 27 mpg highway.

[JamesML]

G'day: I tow a 13" 1976 Boler, with a 2009 Hyundai Santa Fe GL 3.3L V6, loaded for camping including 2 kayaks and gear. On my long haul trips to the US southwest, I've averaged around 15 L/100 kM0 roughly equiv to 15 mpg US. Note that the US gallon is approximately equivalent to 1Litre. Litre=33 oz, Us gallon=32 oz , with some minor allowance for a slight difference between US and Imperial oz.
Boler tows well, although I have electric brakes, added after a near mishap from brake fade after long downhill around Denver.

[pedalmike]

Hi, Tom.

My tow vehicle is a 2009 VW Tiguan. 2 liter turbo 4. I have a 6 speed manual. The engine produces 206 ft lbs. of torque at a low 1,700 rpm. I think the fact that it makes max torque at such low rpm really helps when towing. The turbo also helps at high altitude when compared with a normally aspirated engine.

From 2011-2016 we towed a 13' Scamp Deluxe. No problem at all. Now we tow a 16' Airstream Bambi International CCD. We had the hitch reinforced to support weight distribution towing.

Towing mpg for me is 16-17. When not towing, I routinely get 27-29 mpg driving around town and short runs on the highway. This is well above the EPA highway estimate of 24mpg.

The Tiguan has a very short distance from rear axle to the tow ball. I think that really helps towing stability.

Unfortunately, I would not recommend the current generation Tiguan for towing. Towing capacity dropped to 1,500 lbs.

[Grant J.]

We tow our 17ft Boler with a 2014 Santa Fe Turbo 4cyl which tows much better then the 2007 6cyl 3.3 we used to have.We bought the Santa Fe new knowing that it could handle this trailer and we have taken it through the Rockies,prairies and the eastern hills of Canada and U.S.

[Anachron]

Originally Posted by JamesML

G'day: I tow a 13" 1976 Boler, with a 2009 Hyundai Santa Fe GL 3.3L V6, loaded for camping including 2 kayaks and gear. On my long haul trips to the US southwest, I've averaged around 15 L/100 kM0 roughly equiv to 15 mpg US. Note that the US gallon is approximately equivalent to 1Litre. Litre=33 oz, Us gallon=32 oz , with some minor allowance for a slight difference between US and Imperial oz.
Boler tows well, although I have electric brakes, added after a near mishap from brake fade after long downhill around Denver.

I think you might have mistyped in your comment. 1 US gallon is close to "4" litres. 3.78L actually. Through a twist of math, 15 MPG is almost the same as 15 L/100km. But they diverge in opposite directions. Higher is better in MPG, but higher is worse in L/100km. It's kinda like temperature. Fahrenheit and Celsius converge at -40.

[Anachron]

Thanks Pedalmike. I'm starting to regain faith that I can have a 13 footer AND keep a fuel efficient vehicle as my daily driver.

[Garyscamper]

I have an even smaller 4 cylinder that I use to tow my 1987 Scamp 13. I have used both a Mazda CX-5, and a Hyundai Tucson. Both with about 180ftlbs torque. Average between 20 and 21MPG when towing. Only time I know the Scamp is there is on long uphill climbs, and shorter more severe climbs.

[Green Frog]

When I bought my '83 Burro about 7-8 years ago, I towed it back from the Chicago area to Central VA behind my V-6 Astro AWD with no problem (except increased gas consumption!) For the next 6 years I used either that or my S--10 Blazer which had the same Vortec V-6 engine. Unfortunately both vehicles wore out and I ended up replacing them with a 2003 Honda CRV with fuel injected 4 Cyl... BIG MISTAKE!!

That poor 4 cylinder is overworked on anything beyond moving it around slowly on level surfaces. Taking it up through the Shenandoah Valley on I-81 is a life changing experience, and not for the better! There may be four cylinder vehicles out there that will do the job for you, but my next tow will definitely be a 6 cylinder.

Froggie

[Jon in AZ]

If you think the CR-V 2.4L is overworked beyond level ground, you need to find the correct pedal. It’s the one on the right. Get it up around 4000 RPM and it will sing up a grade.

I use ours regularly to commute with 3-4 people from 5300’ to 7000’ up and down 15 miles of winding mountain grade. I don’t always push it hard, but if I need to pass, it’ll get going. It’s a very rev-happy engine that doesn’t mind being pushed.

The only difference between your ‘03 and my ‘06 is the 5-speed transmission in mine for better highway fuel mileage. 12 years, 185K miles, and going strong. Oil remains clean and full between changes.

We don’t tow with it due to its limited rating, our family size (4 people), and its relative lack of low-end torque. We have a Pilot for towing.

[Green Frog]

I might agree about pedals, but which one I use isn't my problem, it's that I don't have enough of them! With an automatic transmission I really don't have the control you mention, and after throwing a relatively new fan belt and other indications that it wasn't happy with me, I've relegated my CRV to more moderate usage. Yep, I don't have any problem with using a lower powered engine with the proper set up, but in my dotage, I'm not going to do that much work for myself... I like to have enough power in reserve to let the vehicle do the work.

JMHO, YMMV.
Froggie

[Conrad S.]

I tow my Scamp 13 (no bath, no air) with a 2001 V6 Ford Escape. With factory tow package it is rated at 3500 lbs. The new Escapes with turbo 4 are also rated at 3500 lbs, so should work for similar trailers.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by Green Frog

I might agree about pedals, but which one I use isn't my problem, it's that I don't have enough of them! With an automatic transmission I really don't have the control you mention...
JMHO, YMMV.
Froggie

Agree (about the third pedal). This CRV was for my wife, but at one point I was actually looking for another 2nd generation CRV with a stick shift for myself. The 5-speed auto does very well at nailing the right gear at the right time, though, so I find it pretty satisfying to drive. More fun around home than the Pilot, which shines as a long-distance interstate cruiser and tow vehicle.

[Anachron]

Originally Posted by Conrad S.

I tow my Scamp 13 (no bath, no air) with a 2001 V6 Ford Escape. With factory tow package it is rated at 3500 lbs. The new Escapes with turbo 4 are also rated at 3500 lbs, so should work for similar trailers.

Thanks Conrad. The Escape SEL with the upgraded 2.0 Ecoboost and tow package is one of my considerations.

[Anachron]

Originally Posted by Jon in AZ

Agree (about the third pedal). This CRV was for my wife, but at one point I was actually looking for another 2nd generation CRV with a stick shift for myself. The 5-speed auto does very well at nailing the right gear at the right time, though, so I find it pretty satisfying to drive. More fun around home than the Pilot, which shines as a long-distance interstate cruiser and tow vehicle.

We are a two car family as well, but living in Vancouver, my Rav4 is the BIG one. My other car is a Yaris with a 5-spd manual. That thing is amazing in the narrow downtown streets.

And with gas at $1.55 /L around here, it's efficient too. For you guys south of Canuckistan, that translates to over $7 USD per Gal. That's why I'm trying to avoid getting too big of a tow vehicle.

[Jon in AZ]

Right. I completely understand. Got caught up in a bit of thread drift toward the end there. As I said way back in post #2, you will be fine with any of the 3500# rated 4-cylinders you mentioned. Make the choice based on reliability, cost and availability, and driving comfort and feel. If any offer full 7-pin trailer wiring, I’d consider that a big bonus. Most will likely require an aftermarket upgrade from 4-pin to 7-pin.

Since you’re traveling light, you might consider the 2700# rated Subaru Outback (tongue weight limited to 200#) or even the 2000# rated Mazda CX-5. Both are used by a number of forum members for towing 13’ers.

[Anachron]

My apologies for the flawed math. We're paying the equivalent of ~4.40/gal. I converted the currency the wrong way.

Thanks Brian B-P