Towing with an electric vehicle

[Steve Hague]

We towed our 1978 Trillium 4500 to the Brown County Rally this past week.
Since there is a long stretch between Fort Wayne and Indianapolis, we left home with 100% charge. I'm glad we did, as we were able to skip several lower powered Superchargers and made it to the 250 kW Southport Supercharger with 6% battery, in spite of a 16 mph headwind. We still achieved 491 Wh/mile during that 141 miles.
We were fortunate that this Supercharger was not busy, so we took a chance and pulled into the charger without unhitching. We were in and out in about 15 minutes with plenty of charge to make our destination. Sure wish there was a pull-in charger though.
It was 54 miles to our campsite, which we made easily. The last segment was at 483 Wh/mile, total trip down was at 489 Wh/mile despite the headwind.

[Travellers]

Originally Posted by Steve Hague

We towed our 1978 Trillium 4500 to the Brown County Rally this past week.
Since there is a long stretch between Fort Wayne and Indianapolis, we left home with 100% charge. I'm glad we did, as we were able to skip several lower powered Superchargers and made it to the 350 kW Southport Supercharger with 6% battery, in spite of a 16 mph headwind. We still achieved 491 Wh/mile during that 141 miles.
We were fortunate that this Supercharger was not busy, so we took a chance and pulled into the charger without unhitching. We were in and out in about 15 minutes with plenty of charge to make our destination. Sure wish there was a pull-in charger though.
It was 54 miles to our campsite, which we made easily. The last segment was at 483 Wh/mile, total trip down was at 489 Wh/mile despite the headwind.

Nice. The fall colours are gorgeous there as well.

[Steve Hague]

After setting up camp, we still had enough charge for a side trip (sans trailer), so we headed to the nearby town for shopping and sightseeing. When we returned to the campsite, we were down to 12%, so we started charging from the TT-30 electrical post. I'm glad that we had purchased a 30A extension cord, as the post would have just barely been in reach. The night before departure, we decided to charge to 95%. No sense charging to 100% for the short drive towards Indianapolis Superchargers, and nice to have good regenerative braking in the Brown County hills.

[Travellers]

Originally Posted by Steve Hague

After setting up camp, we still had enough charge for a side trip (sans trailer), so we headed to the nearby town for shopping and sightseeing. When we returned to the campsite, we were down to 12%, so we started charging from the TT-30 electrical post. I'm glad that we had purchased a 30A extension cord, as the post would have just barely been in reach. The night before departure, we decided to charge to 95%. No sense charging to 100% for the short drive towards Indianapolis Superchargers, and nice to have good regenerative braking in the Brown County hills.

Yah. We are always on 30 amp sites. Did you get the TT30 dongle for the MCU so you can charge at 24 amps?

[Steve Hague]

On our homeward journey, we again charged at the Southport Supercharger. This time it was busy, so we had to unhitch. We probably would have anyway, as we expected a long charge to get enough for the long stretch back to Fort Wayne.
We had arrived with 63% remaining, but were still surprised that it only took 30 minutes to get enough charge to get home (charging slows as the battery approaches full charge). We barely had time to grab lunch at the nearby Meijer Grocery deli before it was time to hitch up and head home with expected 12% charge remaining.
We had a slight tailwind on the way home, so we arrived with 15% battery. The 201 mile homeward trip was achieved at 429 Wh/mile.
I also attached the current monthly charging report. The gray bars are the charging events at the campgrounds, including the previous week's campout at Pokagon State Park. There were no problems charging at the campsite, just slower at Brown County with only TT-30 being available.

[Steve Hague]

Originally Posted by Travellers

Yah. We are always on 30 amp sites. Did you get the TT30 dongle for the MCU so you can charge at 24 amps?

Yes. I'm glad that I got the one from EVSE, as I had an earlier experience at a less-well maintained campground where the post started heating up. The adapter shifted the amperage down from 24A to 12A to protect the circuit. I'd rather get a slow charge than none at all.

[Travellers]

Originally Posted by Steve Hague

On our homeward journey, we again charged at the Southport Supercharger. This time it was busy, so we had to unhitch. We probably would have anyway, as we expected a long charge to get enough for the long stretch back to Fort Wayne.
We had arrived with 63% remaining, but were still surprised that it only took 30 minutes to get enough charge to get home (charging slows as the battery approaches full charge). We barely had time to grab lunch at the nearby Meijer Grocery deli before it was time to hitch up and head home with expected 12% charge remaining.
We had a slight tailwind on the way home, so we arrived with 15% battery. The 201 mile homeward trip was achieved at 429 Wh/mile.
I also attached the current monthly charging report. The gray bars are the charging events at the campgrounds, including the previous week's campout at Pokagon State Park. There were no problems charging at the campsite, just slower at Brown County with only TT-30 being available.

Looks like it was a great trip

We sometimes choose slower 50 or 100 kw stations for lunch charges as it allows for a more leasurely lunch.

Safe travels.

[Travellers]

Originally Posted by Travellers

Looks like it was a great trip

We sometimes choose slower 50 or 100 kw stations for lunch charges as it allows for a more leasurely lunch.

Safe travels.

Handy things. We got the 20 amp dongle from Tesla as well. Now we have the 15, 20, 30 and 14-50 dongles.

[Steve Hague]

Originally Posted by Travellers

Handy things. We got the 20 amp dongle from Tesla as well. Now we have the 15, 20, 30 and 14-50 dongles.

We purchased the TT-30 and 14-50 adapters, but have only had the chance to use the 14-50 at one campground so far. I installed a back-up 14-50 outlet in my garage, but we only use the hard-wired Tesla charger on a regular basis. I've never used the standard adapter that came with our car. I'm assuming it is either a 15A or 20A. Might be fun to try to see how fast (slow) it charges.

[Travellers]

The standard dongle is 15 amp (so max 12 amp charging).

We also got the 20 amp as it charges at 16 amps. We have some of those up here.

[Steve Hague]

Our first outing of 2023 was to Gunter Hill COE. It was a chilly 27 degrees leaving home, but we were still able to achieve acceptable range for the trip. We towed 725 miles on the way down and stopped to charge six time over the two days. We used 350 kWh for an average of 483 Wh/mile. We paid $69.32 for charging and $25 for a campsite which included charging overnight at a 50A post.
Overall, the trip down was very relaxing. We were able to coordinate our charging stops with lunch breaks. Our only less than optimal charging stop was in Birmingham where Tesla located the Supercharger in a crowded shopping center parking lot well off the interstate. Fortunately we were able to avoid charging there on the way home.
It was most enjoyable to see the first blooms of spring in southern Indiana and see the progress of the season as we traveled to our destination.

[Travellers]

Great report. Thanks.

[Steve Hague]

While we took two days on the way down to Gunter Hill, we decided to drive straight through to home. We stopped to charge six times, which were for the most part the same charging stations that we used on the way down. We logged 710 miles and used 390 kWh for an average of 549 Wh/mile. We paid $127.88 for charging. The air temperature was about the same both ways, but I drove a little faster heading home.

[Jon MB]

I crunched some numbers from those 2023 trip posts and think I have these summary data: Total tow distance: 1,435 mi. Total energy: 740 kWh. Days travel: 3. Stops to charge: 12. Energy cost*: $197.20.
Using a 33.42 kWh per (us)gallon conversion factor indicates about 22 gallons has the equivalent to 740 kWh.
With that 22 gallon equivalent estimate you averaged 65 mpg(e), at $0.137/mi. That's great!
You took three days and stopped an average of every 120 miles. That's not how I prefer to get to a destination, whether it's a camp site or it's home.


*charge cost at the camp site can't be separated out from a combined site rental and power cost.

[Travellers]

Originally Posted by Jon MB

I crunched some numbers from those 2023 trip posts and think I have these summary data: Total tow distance: 1,435 mi. Total energy: 740 kWh. Days travel: 3. Stops to charge: 12. Energy cost*: $197.20.
Using a 33.42 kWh per (us)gallon conversion factor indicates about 22 gallons has the equivalent to 740 kWh.
With that 22 gallon equivalent estimate you averaged 65 mpg(e), at $0.137/mi. That's great!
You took three days and stopped an average of every 120 miles. That's not how I prefer to get to a destination, whether it's a camp site or it's home.


*charge cost at the camp site can't be separated out from a combined site rental and power cost.

Kudos for the math analysis. Good info. We have never analyzed our trips from that context but it’s interesting.

We also stop to charge every couple hours or so when we pull our trailer behind our tesla. Initially we thought that would be a pain in the butt but it was actually the opposite. A 20 to 30 minute charge break after a couple hours towing is kinda nice. Radar our chihuahua loves the extra walks and we are fresher at the end of the day. Our longest travel days are around 600 kilometres though, and really the way we tour many days are only 100 kilometres. Especially if we are travelling in BC or Quebec. Lots to see etc.

Anyway, thanks for the numbers.

[DeanCHS1980]

Hi Steve,

I saw you guys in Bowling Green, KY (our hometown) on your way home. I was at the intersection of Campbell Lane turning right to pickup groceries. You were in the left lane turning left onto Campbell Lane. As I approached the intersection, I was surprised to see a Trillium. I then saw the Tesla. At that point, I knew it was you guys!!! I assume you had been to Meijer grocery store using their charging station?

If you ever need anything traveling through, let us know. FYI, we don’t have a Tesla docking station, but do have 30 amp on the house! We live about 1 mile from Meijer.

Take care,

Dean

[Steve Hague]

Originally Posted by DeanCHS1980

Hi Steve,

I saw you guys in Bowling Green, KY (our hometown) on your way home. I was at the intersection of Campbell Lane turning right to pickup groceries. You were in the left lane turning left onto Campbell Lane. As I approached the intersection, I was surprised to see a Trillium. I then saw the Tesla. At that point, I knew it was you guys!!! I assume you had been to Meijer grocery store using their charging station?

If you ever need anything traveling through, let us know. FYI, we don’t have a Tesla docking station, but do have 30 amp on the house! We live about 1 mile from Meijer.

Take care,

Dean

As soon as we took the exit for Bowling Green, we talked about whether we might see you and Laura. You live in a beautiful place.
Since we arrived at Bowling Green in late afternoon, we picked up dinner at the Meijer deli and by the time we finished, the car was fully charged.
Wish we had seen you!
Steve and Beth

[DeanCHS1980]

Originally Posted by Steve Hague

As soon as we took the exit for Bowling Green, we talked about whether we might see you and Laura. You live in a beautiful place.
Since we arrived at Bowling Green in late afternoon, we picked up dinner at the Meijer deli and by the time we finished, the car was fully charged.
Wish we had seen you!
Steve and Beth

Hi Steve,

We have lived in BG since 1995. It was been a nice community to raise the girls and to work (WKU). Maybe next time, we can visit!

Take care,

Dean

[Raspy]

Originally Posted by Jon MB

Using a 33.42 kWh per (us)gallon conversion factor indicates about 22 gallons has the equivalent to 740 kWh.
With that 22 gallon equivalent estimate you averaged 65 mpg(e), at $0.137/mi. That's great!

Jon,

While the energy content of gasoline is about 33.42 KWH/US gallon, gasoline engines are only about 35% efficient (fuel consumed vs power produced at the crankshaft). Maybe less while working hard. And the drivetrain causes more losses through friction. So for an equivalent amount of work done, towing a trailer for that distance in those conditions, by a gas driven vehicle, it would take about three times the 22 gallon figure. Or approximately 66 gallons of gas depending on several factors. I don't know what the efficiency of the electric vehicle is, but it must be far higher considering there is far less waste heat.

Stopping every 150 miles or so does not seem like a deal breaker to me. Being on vacation, instead of being late to work, makes those stops a good chance to stretch and feel great at the destination. I don't think the average length of the stops was mentioned, but with the fast charging systems now, it seems one can add about 200 miles of range in under 20 minutes. Of course towing range would be less than that. Thoughts?

[Travellers]

Originally Posted by Raspy

Jon,

While the energy content of gasoline is about 33.42 KWH/US gallon, gasoline engines are only about 35% efficient (fuel consumed vs power produced at the crankshaft). Maybe less while working hard. And the drivetrain causes more losses through friction. So for an equivalent amount of work done, towing your trailer for that distance in those conditions, by a gas driven vehicle, it would take about three times the 22 gallon figure. Or approximately 66 gallons of gas depending on several factors. I don't know what the efficiency of the electric vehicle is, but it must be far higher considering there is far less waste heat.

Stopping every 150 miles or so does not seem like a deal breaker to me. Being on vacation, instead of being late to work, makes those stops a good chance to stretch and feel great at the destination. I don't think the average length of the stops was mentioned, but with the fast charging systems now, it seems one can add about 200 miles of range in under 20 minutes. Of course towing range would be less than that. Thoughts?

I’m not good with numbers but we generally stop to charge every couple hours and a typical charge stop for us when towing is closer to 30 minutes as opposed to 20 minutes when not towing, and they’d because we suck the battery down further and charge it higher than when not towing.

That’s our experience. We towed over 15200 kilometres last year.