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Old 01-08-2007, 10:15 PM   #21
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I think an awful lot depends on who you get at the window. During my excursion to get my aristocrat (14' sticky tin trailer) registered, the lady was kind enough to try to figure out how to get me a late renewal on a PTI so that I wouldn't have to pay penalties on the registration that had not been renewed by the former owner. The people at the two adjacent windows began having a discussion as to the limit of a PTI, whether it was 14 or 15'. Obviously it is 16, but had I been at one of their windows, we would have been looking it up.

When I went in to get a PTI for my other odd trailer, made from a pickup bed, meant for hauling stuff, I didn't get a title, did get a vin put on it, and they insisted on measuring, but they knew all the limits.

With my recently acquired Boler Honey, I got a new title, had the plates changed to PTI, and had no trouble at DMV. ( I just got the new title in the mail this weekend...It feels official now!)

The real glitch in this system seems to be all the folks that had trailers before the PTI law came into effect, and never requested a change in the type of plate.

Frederick, Im curious, did you get to keep your old plates and change the type to a PTI? Im sure that would be a consideration for folks with vintage trailers with vintage plates!
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Old 01-08-2007, 10:47 PM   #22
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The real glitch in this system seems to be all the folks that had trailers before the PTI law came into effect, and never requested a change in the type of plate.
That is exactly the case with my Fiber Stream. It was originally registered as a [b]Trailer Coach (CCH) which is specifically EXCLUDED from the PTI program.

Before this discussion I was unaware of the designation [b]Camp Trailer (CMP).

The previous owner of my Compact Junior had gutted it out for hauling use in his carpet laying business. He converted it's registration to [b]Cargo Carrier (CARRIER). Being naive, I never gave it another thought when I re-converted it back to camping use. Then, in 2001 DMV automatically enrolled it into the PTI program.

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Old 01-08-2007, 10:57 PM   #23
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Frederick, Im curious, did you get to keep your old plates and change the type to a PTI? Im sure that would be a consideration for folks with vintage trailers with vintage plates!
I was offered the choice to keep my old Blue/Gold plates... and use a "PTI" sticker where the year sticker would go...

But I chose to turn in my old plate for the new PTI plate shown in my updated AVITAR. I belong to another camping organization that has a fondness for meeting in upscale RV Resorts of the type that usually have a 10 year age restriction on the coaches they allow in.

That old plate would be an open invitation for discrimination.


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Old 01-09-2007, 02:57 AM   #24
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<<The real glitch in this system seems to be all the folks that had trailers before the PTI law came into effect, and never requested a change in the type of plate.>>

I never requested a change. My 13 Scamp was registered as "Body Type Model" CMP and when the license came up for renewal it was the DMV that sent me the information on the PTI which I never knew exsisted. When I read it I couldn't believe what I was reading....5 years for $20, how could that be.

I called my local DMV and was told that it's true. I said to them but it's not a utility trailer it's a camp trailer, you know a little home away from home on wheels, recreational vehicle. She said that didn't matter because it was a trailer 16 foot or under. Well, I still couldn't believe it so I called 3 other DMV offices and got the same answer.

I promptly wrote my check and checked the box for a sticker, keeping my original plates. I had the plate number memorized, part of it being JJ. I've been called Joy Joy all my life and the numbers were numbers that equate to 2 memorable years in my life.

Lizbeth, I was told by someone that the 5th and 6th characters in the VIN number are the length. Don't know if it's really true or not but the 5th and 6th characters in my Scamps Vin are 1 & 3. So it appears to be true in my case. Check the VIN number and see if yours equate on your Cardinals registration form to the length.
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Old 01-09-2007, 11:32 AM   #25
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Lizbeth, I was told by someone that the 5th and 6th characters in the VIN number are the length. Don't know if it's really true or not but the 5th and 6th characters in my Scamps Vin are 1 & 3. So it appears to be true in my case. Check the VIN number and see if yours equate on your Cardinals registration form to the length.
On mine it appears to be the first two numbers in the vin which are followed by the last two numbers in the year it was made.

I think it's interesting that neither the title or registration state the length of the trailer.
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Old 01-10-2007, 02:52 PM   #26
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I realized in reading back through these posts that I think part of the ease I had in my dealings had to do with it all being done at DMV. I tried to register the Boler at the Auto Club, but they were very concerned that everything had to be done just right. (I had made a mistake on the form and crossed it out neatly, and they said I'd have to get all new forms and start over) DMV was just more comfortable making an independent decision.

Frederick..thanks for the info. I have a funky little trailer with black and gold plates which I would like to keep when I register it.

I wonder about how they decide whether or not it needs to be measured. The trailer of mine which they measured did not have a vin number so there was no clue to the length. But they didn't measure the Boler Honey either and its vin number was 134. No 5th and 6th digits there. Do you suppose the 134 is a 13 foot trailer made in 1974? Maybe someone from Canada will know about that?
In retrospect it may have had a PTI registration before. Its registration was current according to DMV, but the last sticker on the plate was '93, and the owner didn't know where the current stickers were.

I guess, the important thing is that it is worth the effort to get those trailers under 16' registered with a PTI tag! It gives us more money to fix up the eggs or to go camping.
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Old 01-10-2007, 03:41 PM   #27
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Throw this in the mix.

When i bought my Bigfoot 5th wheel in California last month the previous owner had lost the title. We went to the dmv and they issued a new title with the pti registration.

I have a pti plate and a California title with my Colorado address on it.

BONUS

It shows me as owner in Colo. with my Colo address and perm. tags from Cal.


Harv in Colo.
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Old 01-10-2007, 05:42 PM   #28
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... I was told by someone that the 5th and 6th characters in the VIN number are the length. Don't know if it's really true or not but the 5th and 6th characters in my Scamps Vin are 1 & 3. So it appears to be true in my case...
There are international standards for the construction of a [b]Vehicle Identification "Number", and the fifth and sixth positions are in the vehicle attributes section, which is dependent on the manufacturer.

In other words, if Scamp chose to describe their trailers by length (which seems likely, because that's what they normally use for model names), they might set those digits to "1" and "3" meaning a 13-foot model, but that doesn't mean that any other trailer manufacturer is required to follow the same practice. I would not expect a registration office person to be able to extract the length from any VIN.

I can't use my Boler for an example, because it has a [b]serial number which predates the use of the standard VIN pattern for trailers.

Quote:
...But they didn't measure the Boler Honey either and its vin number was 134. No 5th and 6th digits there. Do you suppose the 134 is a 13 foot trailer made in 1974? Maybe someone from Canada will know about that?
This is only a guess, but based on previous discussions of Boler serial numbers (mostly in another forum), the "134" probably just means it was the one hundred and thirty fourth trailer made in that plant. A real VIN is much longer, and the (standard) VIN of a Canadian-made vehicle would start with "2".

For example, the Escape which I examined in a local RV showroom (see photo in a post in the Escape Trailer topic) carried a VIN of 2E9TF6A276C068070 (what, you can't read that in my photo?)...

2 = Canada
E = ? (this would be part of the identification of the manufacturer, for makers of more than 500 vehicles per year)
9 = ("9" is used by manufacturers of under 500 vehicles per year, see Manufacturer Identifier near the end)
TF6A2 = vehicle attributes: meaning unknown, defined by Escape
7 = check digit
6 = model year: 2006
C = plant code: there's only one Escape plant, in [b]Chiliwack.
068 = Manufacturer Identifier: presumably this is the number for Escape Trailer Industries
070 = sequential number: the serial number

Canada follows the same VIN standard as the U.S., but I think 1974 is way too early to expect the current standard to be applied to a trailer made in either country.
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Old 01-10-2007, 08:57 PM   #29
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I guess, the important thing is that it is worth the effort to get those trailers under 16' registered with a PTI tag! It gives us more money to fix up the eggs or to go camping.

$52.00 = My Fiber Stream's [b]Trailer Coach (CCH) annual plate renewal fee for a fully depreciated 29 year old vehicle.
x5

$260.00 = 5 year cost of (CCH) plate
-10.00 = 5 year cost of (CMP) plate

$250.00 = net savings after 5 years
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Old 01-10-2007, 11:27 PM   #30
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Money, like everything else, is relative. $250 over 5 years may not sound like much, but to me, raising 3 kids, one in college, one a senior in high school headed to college and the last a teenage girl, every $1 I can get hold of looks good!. Hmm...$250 is about $250 more than I paid for my trailer. It would probably buy new tires, and hopefully, a bottle or two of mold killer!
Alternatively, after 5 years of cleaning and fixing, I should have at least one kid out of college and can use the $250 to pay for a few days of campsite at MacKericher State Park on the beach.
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Old 01-02-2008, 03:10 PM   #31
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The Illinois Toll road sees any trailer/car combo as three axles thereby making it a medium commercial vehicle.
Which of course jacks up the toll at least three times.
Gotta love bureaucracy. Which if you change one letter you get bureau crazy.
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Old 01-03-2008, 03:41 PM   #32
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Wow!

This is great info!

I bought my 1990 16' Scamp last spring and paid $72.00 for a years registration due in August. Had I known . . . . I would have requested the PTI.

So how do I "correct" this? I'm guessing a trip to DMV or AAA is in my future. I don't supose they'd give me a refund . . . at the time I bought the trailer, I'd filed the paperwork at AAA and nothing was said about PTI being possible?!

Thanks for posting this . . . $72 x 5 = $360.00 ! ! ! . . . now I can get those new cushion covers!

Maggie
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Old 01-03-2008, 09:16 PM   #33
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So how do I "correct" this? I'm guessing a trip to DMV or AAA is in my future.
Go back to the office of your choice.
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I showed the clerk the definition of "Camp Trailer" I printed off of the DMV website
I suggest you take a printout off of the actual DMV website with you, and have an attitude of being helpful...
(Oh, gee. Look what I just found.)
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Old 03-07-2008, 02:04 AM   #34
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This is an awesome site. Thank you all. After reading this post re PTI, when we go to register our "soon to be ours" Scamp, I will be sure to ask to have a PTI instead of annual registration. This will definitely save us some $$$. We'll be able to get some solar panels a bit sooner now!!! Thanks again all! Gail & hubby
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Old 03-07-2008, 09:13 AM   #35
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That's the ONE thing the DMV has not given me any trouble about- the PTI part. At least not so far (knock on wood.)

Bobbie
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Old 03-10-2008, 12:24 AM   #36
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Hi fellow PTI and potential PTI members. I've got an extension of this topic you might be able to help me with. This site has helped tremendously in my search for the perfect FGRV and I thought I was finally going to pick up a '96 16' Casita that I happened across on craigslist, with my cashier's check in hand, but have run into a slight glitch.

The "owner" couldn't find the title and vaguely remembers the DMV telling him he didn't have to purchase a new title in order to register the vehicle. Pretty sure it's registered PTI, as the plates on the trailer have no place for registration decals and he's owned the trailer for almost two years and never received a registration renewal. I think at this point, I will just have to anxiously wait and hope that he doesn't find someone who will buy it without a title. We do have a handwritten purchase contract and his wife is an attorney, so I hope he will manage to contact DMV in his "spare" time this week and figure out how to get hold of some sort of transfer of title and, hopefully, the PTI registration...

Anyone sold a PTI-registered trailer in CA, since this program started?

Thanks for any suggestions...

Emi
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Old 03-10-2008, 12:37 AM   #37
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I have sold 3 of them, but I had a title for all of them.

I recall the DMV telling me with all my trailers that a title is NOT required in California for a PTI registered trailer, but if you opt not to pay the title transfer fee, a new title is difficult to acquire.

I would wait until he had some official paperwork before handing him the money, just to avoid problems. Lawyer wife or no.
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Old 03-10-2008, 08:28 AM   #38
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I see the problem for you is if you go to resell and don't have the title. Not all states have PTI like California, here in Oregon you must have a title to register the trailer. As an Oregonian, there's no way I'd purchase a trailer without a title.
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Old 03-10-2008, 07:19 PM   #39
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Anyone sold a PTI-registered trailer in CA, since this program started?
I sold my 1971 Compact Jr., which had PTI plates, Title, and Identification Card while I owned it, to a friend of mine. I took him into the AAA office and we conducted the whole transaction there in front of the clerk at AAA's DMV desk. The clerk patiently explained to my friend that PTI was a totally different transaction than registering a trailer coach:

A Trailer Coach is similar to an automobile, in that there is a Title, a [b]Registration card, and Month/Year tabs for the License plate. The latter 2 must be renewed every year.

A Camp Trailer gets a [b]Permanent Trailer Identification. Not a Registration, The [b]Identification card goes with a Permanent License Plate. A title is no longer required for trailers in this program, and the identification card is good for 5 years. Since the program is new, if a trailer comes into the program with a pre-existing title, the purchaser has the option of paying a separate [b]$17 fee to renew the existing title with the new Identification.

[b]BUT, the clerk said, emphatically, if that purchaser declines the title option, the title record is PURGED from the state computer system, and CANNOT be reinstated. <<cue Theatre Organ Dissonant Chord!!!>>

My friend said, "Ten dollars for five years? And I don't HAVE TO pay the extra $17? Forget the title."

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Old 03-10-2008, 10:38 PM   #40
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Oh noooooo,

(Beware, ongoing drama...)

Now I KNOW this is what the previous owner did! I wondered why he couldn't just fork out the $17 for the title if he was going to be getting a ck for over $6K? Kept saying that the DMV claims I only need the bill of sale to "register" and would be able to obtain a title if I paid the $17 fee, but also let it slip that he didn't have a title from the original owner when he registered the trailer, exactly as your friend did, and then mentioned soemthing about his registration possibly being late...

So, I assumed possible penalties for a late registration(?), or that he didn't have his PTI identification card with him, and asked him to just mail back my deposit check.

Forgetting that he had given me his "cover," he called back, an hour later and says he'll go to the DMV, again, early in the am and tow the trailer to work to obtain the title and avoid storage problems, practically demanding that I pick it up from his office, which is in an inconvenient part of town, and went on about his financial hardship and his wife needing her car, and the fact that he needed his cover back... I just listened, silently, and said why don't you call me when you have the title, tomorrow morning and we will get the cashier's ck and arrange to pick up the trailer, tomorrow. Now I know he will have difficulty obtaining a title! Oh well, as Donna says, "...if it was meant to be," the title will magically appear, or another, better trailer will present itself...
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