12v lithium battery thoughts

[Niall]

Hi guys,
I am working through planning and laying out all of the electronics we will need for our Boler.

Our trailer tongue does not have a lot of space, so being able to house the battery in the trailer is important.
I am looking at using a 12v 100AH lithium battery as our power source but just wanted peoples thoughts on whether the 100AH will suffice?
The only major power draw, outside of the LED lighting, will be the occasional laptop hook up and charge. I want to be able to boondock as much as possible ideally, and not be tied to campgrounds.

Please let me know your thoughts.

Regards,
Niall

[Raspy]

How will you be charging the battery? A 100 AH battery will go dead eventually even with a very small load. If boondocking, you'll have to match the charging to the loads, more than the battery to the loads. The battery will have to at least get you through the night until the solar can begin to re-charge the next day. If you plan to use solar, a 100 watt suitcase system might be the right choice for your stated small demand.

If you decide you need a bit more battery, but are limited on space, you can get a 120 AH battery that is almost the same size as the 100 AH battery.

Mounting the battery inside, as opposed to on the tongue is a good idea if you will ever be camping in cold weather, as the lithium batteries should not be charged at temps below freezing.

I think that demand will usually rise to meet supply on battery and solar power, so if anything, go larger than the minimum you think you'll need.

[Jane P.]

Originally Posted by Niall

Hi guys,
I am working through planning and laying out all of the electronics we will need for our Boler.

Our trailer tongue does not have a lot of space, so being able to house the battery in the trailer is important.
I am looking at using a 12v 100AH lithium battery as our power source but just wanted peoples thoughts on whether the 100AH will suffice?
The only major power draw, outside of the LED lighting, will be the occasional laptop hook up and charge. I want to be able to boondock as much as possible ideally, and not be tied to campgrounds.

Please let me know your thoughts.

Regards,
Niall

You should have no problems meeting your power needs with one lithium battery.

I dropped a Battleborn 100ah battery in my BF 21 and dry camped for about a year with that battery before adding a solar system. It worked perfectly for me. In addition to LED lighting, it powered my CPAP unit, 12 volt stereo system, and Fantastic ceiling fan, and recharge our mobile devices. My refrigerator and stovetop used propane.

Forum members who add additional lithium batteries, do so in order to have a more powerful inverter. They want to use their microwave ovens, TV sets, coffee makers, and computers.

If you boondock in one spot for more than a few days, you’ll need a small backup generator to recharge your battery. You may even want to consider installing solar system. Obviously, you’ll need to adopt strong energy conservation techniques to maximize the number of days between charges.

Hope this helps.

[Johnny M]

Here are some things you might want to consider:
Vent fan
Furnace
CO2/Propane/Smoke detector
Water pump
Water heater
TV or DVD player
radio

These things can add up, for instance if camping in a hot environment with no a/c you may need that fan all day and/or night. A fan furnace can draw some batteries down overnight in cold weather. I use a Buddy heater as opposed to a furnace for that reason to save on battery draw. Water pump can be a big draw depending on the pump but since it is usually used very little in 24 hrs its usually not a big deal. Laptop charging depends on the laptop model, some can be power hogs like gaming computers vs a chromebook. I have 3 LED lights (0.3 amps each), a SeaFlo series 42 water pump (7.5 amps running not startup) a tankless propane water heater (uses battery to ignite the burner and run the led control display), a vent fan (1.6 amps running) and a high efficiency chest type compressor refrigerator freezer (5 amps). Add in about 1 amp for each phone charger (we have 3).
With our (2) 6 volt Trojan T-105 deep cycle lead acid batteries in series for 12 volts we have 225 amp hours but at 50% that's only 112.5 amp hours. We are using about 97 amp hours per day or 1164 Wh per day based on our estimated usage of each of the above devices. I am looking to switch to 2 100 ah lithiums or 1 200 amp hour as I can go down to about 10% as opposed to 50% with the lead acid. As far as charging them I am looking at about 400-500 watts of solar to keep them topped off. I installed this $15 meter off amazon to keep up with the voltage, current in amps, power in watts and energy in Watt hours.

Here is a great tool by Trojan battery for sizing a system Trojan Battery Company | battery capacity calculator

Originally Posted by Niall

Hi guys,
I am working through planning and laying out all of the electronics we will need for our Boler.

Our trailer tongue does not have a lot of space, so being able to house the battery in the trailer is important.
I am looking at using a 12v 100AH lithium battery as our power source but just wanted peoples thoughts on whether the 100AH will suffice?
The only major power draw, outside of the LED lighting, will be the occasional laptop hook up and charge. I want to be able to boondock as much as possible ideally, and not be tied to campgrounds.

Please let me know your thoughts.

Regards,
Niall

[chrisblessing]

I am in my 2nd year using a 120Ah LiFePo4 (DIY) battery. It is mounted inside the Scamp, along with the charge controller, BMS and other associated hardware. I have a small Danfoss/Secop mini-compressor refrigerator with freezer, a furnace, two mounted LED lights and several charge ports. I charge with 200 watts of solar mounted to the top of my 13' Scamp, and I carry a 120 watt suitcase panel for use in shade areas. I always boondock, and have gone 3-4 days without sun but have always had sufficient power. It seems just about the perfect setup and meets all of my needs.

[AlanKilian]

I have two LED lights that take 0.1 Amps each, a water pump that's about 2 Amps for 2 seconds every-time I use it and a fan with a PWM controller that draws 0.5 Amps.

We camp in a tent, so AC is not an issue.

That means 30 Watts of solar and a $60 17 AH sealed lead-acid battery is plenty for us.

If we run out of power, we can use the water pump handle and flashlights.

Your mileage varies with the stuff you bring along for the ride.

[Eggcentric]

Nial a 100 amp lithium is almost double the useable amps compared to a lead acid.
Biggest difference is that you can discharge to 20% +/- compared to the 50% for LA.
I suggest that you do not charge it through the converter but use a dedicated lithium charger, although the new battery will have a BMS so will be protected from over charging.
If you can limit your max charge to 90% capacity and max discharge to 20% of capacity, never charge when the battery is below 32deg F (0 C) only charge the battery when it needs charging unlike LA batts. do those things & your battery will last your lifetime, no more terminals corroding yay.
These people have a 100 amp battery for $350 USD and have treated me well with a couple of purchases. https://www.batteryclearinghouse.com.

[jetalkington]

For the price of many LIPO4 batteries you can buy a SOK 206 AH.

I found 12v chargers for all my laptops and do not need 120V to charge them. You can also contact this company;

https://mikegyver.com/

and see if they can make a 12v Car charger for your laptop. They made mine.

My wife and I have gone over 8 days in Chaco Canyon with just 12v and had nights to 11 degrees F. Our 185 watt solar panel would charge our batteries by the time the sun went down and in the morning we were at 62% of our 206 AH FLA batteries. This mean a 12v LiPO4 100 AH would have done fine. Our limiting factor was no shower house and no dump station. So, we had to use ours. We did use the porta potty they had whenever we could. If you did the SOK you should have room to spare.

[parmm]

Originally Posted by Eggcentric

These people have a 100 amp battery for $350 USD and have treated me well with a couple of purchases. https://www.batteryclearinghouse.com.

Yep, great deal with a 30 day return period. My heated Battleborn with Built- in BMS (Battery Management System) has a 10 year warranty period. And as a military veteran, Battleborn gave me a heck of a discount.

[ShelbyM]

Renogy currently has some attractive pricing. https://www.renogy.com/12v-100ah-lit...y-w-bluetooth/

[EllPea in CA]

Originally Posted by Eggcentric

Nial a 100 amp lithium is almost double the useable amps compared to a lead acid.
Biggest difference is that you can discharge to 20% +/- compared to the 50% for LA.
I suggest that you do not charge it through the converter but use a dedicated lithium charger, although the new battery will have a BMS so will be protected from over charging.
If you can limit your max charge to 90% capacity and max discharge to 20% of capacity, never charge when the battery is below 32deg F (0 C) only charge the battery when it needs charging unlike LA batts. do those things & your battery will last your lifetime, no more terminals corroding yay.
These people have a 100 amp battery for $350 USD and have treated me well with a couple of purchases. https://www.batteryclearinghouse.com.

I followed your link and looked at this: https://www.batteryclearinghouse.com...ery-new-in-box

Which seems like a great option... is this an actual lithium battery? The price seems too good to be true?

I need to replace my LA battery. I currently do not have a converter, so it would not confuse things to move to lithium... anything else I should think about? I have a 35w solar panel...

[Eggcentric]

Yes it is a liefe po 4 Lithium iron, probably a discontinued line there were quite a few made, if u do a little research you will find they are respected as being quite rugged and stable.

My history with the company is I bought 2 of the bafang $45 wheels one of them was a bit marked up and stiff but tried one on my own ebike and found that it fit, (Bought the original 2 for a freighter trike am building, anyway once I knew that it fit I wanted to buy another, but I sent them an email and mentioned that one was a bit sketchy and would they replace it if I bought another and paid the freight for both, they shipped two and would not takethe money for the freight of the replacement, so now I have 4 one for parts or repair.

Have lots of experience with batteries and charging but am a little new to lithium batteries but converted my electric garden tractor to lithiumlast year and ambuilding a lithium pack for the frreighter trike.
Parden the writing, first day out on a new (to me_) laptop.
If you go lithium will tell you some of the things you need to change in the way you handle the battery, less work than with lead acid, and simple just a lttle different.

[EllPea in CA]

Originally Posted by AlanKilian

I have two LED lights that take 0.1 Amps each, a water pump that's about 2 Amps for 2 seconds every-time I use it and a fan with a PWM controller that draws 0.5 Amps.

We camp in a tent, so AC is not an issue.

That means 30 Watts of solar and a $60 17 AH sealed lead-acid battery is plenty for us.

If we run out of power, we can use the water pump handle and flashlights.

Your mileage varies with the stuff you bring along for the ride.

Alan… you camp in a tent???

[Eggcentric]

Originally Posted by EllPea in CA

I followed your link and looked at this: https://www.batteryclearinghouse.com...ery-new-in-box

Which seems like a great option... is this an actual lithium battery? The price seems too good to be true?

I need to replace my LA battery. I currently do not have a converter, so it would not confuse things to move to lithium... anything else I should think about? I have a 35w solar panel...

Just got a flag from the vendor, they are down to 60 units.

[Eggcentric]

Originally Posted by parmm

Yep, great deal with a 30 day return period. My heated Battleborn with Built- in BMS (Battery Management System) has a 10 year warranty period. And as a military veteran, Battleborn gave me a heck of a discount.

If the battery works the day you get it, it is not likely to fail anytime soon if treated properly.
Battleborne make good batteries but they are far from the only game in town.

[EllPea in CA]

Originally Posted by Eggcentric

Just got a flag from the vendor, they are down to 60 units.

I am interested in these, but it does not look like they have built-in battery management like the Battleborn does?

So I'm wondering with BVM in addition to this battery, am I approaching in $ just buying a Battleborn?

[Perryb67]

Originally Posted by EllPea in CA

I followed your link and looked at this: https://www.batteryclearinghouse.com...ery-new-in-box

Which seems like a great option... is this an actual lithium battery? The price seems too good to be true?

This battery is from a clearinghouse. In other words if something happens you lose your money. Yes, "The price seems too good to be true".

There is no free lunch!

Perry

[Shannon Thompson]

Where inside the Scamp did you mount the battery?

[Shannon Thompson]

Originally Posted by chrisblessing

I am in my 2nd year using a 120Ah LiFePo4 (DIY) battery. It is mounted inside the Scamp, along with the charge controller, BMS and other associated hardware. I have a small Danfoss/Secop mini-compressor refrigerator with freezer, a furnace, two mounted LED lights and several charge ports. I charge with 200 watts of solar mounted to the top of my 13' Scamp, and I carry a 120 watt suitcase panel for use in shade areas. I always boondock, and have gone 3-4 days without sun but have always had sufficient power. It seems just about the perfect setup and meets all of my needs.

Where inside of the Scamp did you mount the battery? I have a 13', front bunk beds (now converted into a single bed with the storage still underneath). I'm starting the research upgrade to lithium as well.

[Jane P.]

Originally Posted by Shannon Thompson

Where inside of the Scamp did you mount the battery? I have a 13', front bunk beds (now converted into a single bed with the storage still underneath). I'm starting the research upgrade to lithium as well.

I assume your current battery is located in the tongue area.

I have a much larger trailer with the dinette located in front section of trailer. We moved battery from tongue to storage area under the port side dinette seat.

If you have storage under your front bunk, that may be easiest placement. If you can run wiring to your rear dinette area, under that seat makes sense as well.
Obviously, the lithium Ned’s to physically fit in the space.

Depending on where your trailer resides during the year, and whether you camp in extreme cold, you could also consider leaving it on your tongue.

BTW, lithium batteries are coming down in price and the quality has improved. Battleborn is no longer the only high quality lithium on the market. SOK has become the lithium battery of choice for Will Prowse. He has torn this battery down & finds it to be well built. Here’s his latest YouTube post. But he has others.

“SOK Battery: Best budget 12V LiFePO4 is back in stock”

http://https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SU86EJXcTMM

Several members of this Forum and the Escape Forum have recently bought SOKs. Check out their posts.

Other reviews compares SOK favorably to Battleborn (my battery). It has a 7 year warranty (vs 10 for Battleborn), costs less. SOK offers 3 battery models. If you locate your lithium inside your cabin, you do not need to purchase the more expensive Marine version.