How much solar do you have?

[Raspy]

Originally Posted by Shocksll

I tested how long I could run my 13.5k btu A/C. Spoiler alert, it was over 3 hours.

https://youtu.be/q_xuuSf26eg

That's nice. But since your batteries went clear down to low voltage shutoff, and did shut off, you have zero available power for any other loads. And then what will you do the next day with your batteries already depleted and the solar slowly recharging them? No AC for sure on the second day.

The kind of numbers that make sense to me are sustainable numbers. For instance, mine will very conservatively run for three hours, day after day, after day. While still running all other loads including the microwave and electric coffee maker, Starlink, lights and charging two laptops and two phones. Actually, in one day, with a 50% duty cycle, it should run for 18 hours total if I didn't mind running the batteries all the way down. So, for practical AC, day after day, you need a much larger system. Sometimes though, it's nice to stop on the road for lunch and a break. In that case an hour or two of AC is very nice to have.

[Gerry]

Originally Posted by Raspy

It is fun to camp more minimally than most. I like the 100 watt portable panel I have too. But to be fair, 100 watts of portable power, that can be aimed directly at the sun during the day, is not the same as 100 watts of panels mounted flat on the roof. The portable will easily outperform the flat panels. Test show it will produce about twice the power per day if aimed carefully. So, 100 watts of portable can be roughly equal to about 200 watts of flat roof panels, in overall performance per day. It would be a mistake for someone to think they can mount a 100 watt panel flat on the roof, and have the same performance as a 100 watt portable that gets aimed at the sun.

In New England I think the only way we can get away with just the 100W is because it is portable. So many trees. A fixed panel may work out in the deserts out west or in some of those "parking lot" campgrounds.

Don't get the idea that we are stuck to the campsite, constantly running over to the panel to turn it 10 degree this way or that, at one campground we go to, we do know which site to reserve that does get the most sun during the day and only need to readjust the angle once or twice as the sun moves from SE to the SW to get the best sun between the large pines.
Get the panel in good morning sun and head down to the pond for fishing.
Come back and move panel to where I have learned where the afternoon sun comes in and maybe leave for the day and do what ever.
Works great for us .... but all said we are camping ... do not have AC or other Electric devices for cooking and do 99% of our cooking outside on campstove. NO Kerigs for us we perk our coffee on stove.

[AlanKilian]

For those in the north east of the USA, there's a solar company that went out of business and is selling off everything.

https://www.bidspotter.com/en-us/auc...id-bscpau10224

They have PILES of solar panels, inverters, couches, plants etc for sale.

I have no idea if any of this is suitable for those who want to have LOTS AND LOTS more solar than the average camper, but if you know about this stuff, you might be able to get a heck of a deal.

I see a pile of 16 325 Watt panels currently bidding at US$425

Bidding closes February 16

[hghsl]

This is a nice concept and I am sure the awning can be built in a smaller size, but I think it is way too expensive.


https://xponentpower.com/

https://www.motor1.com/news/545603/r...-solar-panels/

[Tom Panning]

Originally Posted by hghsl

This is a nice concept and I am sure the awning can be built in a smaller size, but I think it is way too expensive.


https://xponentpower.com/

https://www.motor1.com/news/545603/r...-solar-panels/

If that works reasonably well, there will be tons of competitors entering that space. As for the price, try and build something similar that can handle moderate amounts of abuse, and see how much you spend in the process

That being said, even if it’s successful, I imagine it would be a long time before anyone makes one small enough for a Scamp

[Casita Greg]

How much solar do you have?

None! I stay at sites with hook-ups, and I'll use their electricity from the "power bush" at the campsite. If I'm paying for "full hook-ups", I'm gonna use them. I'll let the power bush provide my electrical needs, and I'll also bet that the electricity was generated somewhere by a fossil fuel burning generating facility. Keep turning them dinosaurs into smoke! Long live fossil fuel!

[Raspy]

Originally Posted by Casita Greg

How much solar do you have?

None! I stay at sites with hook-ups, and I'll use their electricity from the "power bush" at the campsite. If I'm paying for "full hook-ups", I'm gonna use them. I'll let the power bush provide my electrical needs, and I'll also bet that the electricity was generated somewhere by a fossil fuel burning generating facility. Keep turning them dinosaurs into smoke! Long live fossil fuel!

That's fine, if you like "camping" in a parking lot, or paying for a camp site in a crowded "park". Not sure why dino electricity is better than solar electricity. But I am sure why solar is better than dino. Because you can camp off the beaten path, with plenty of power, for free. No reservations, quiet, no check-out times and no list of rules you must agree to before being allowed to stay. It's fun to be self sufficient. And the views are spectacular. Solar opens the door to silent luxury and convenience, in the wild. That's how you really get your money's worth. That is, unless you like the parking lot experience.

[Perryb67]

Originally Posted by Casita Greg

How much solar do you have?

None! I stay at sites with hook-ups, and I'll use their electricity from the "power bush" at the campsite. If I'm paying for "full hook-ups", I'm gonna use them. I'll let the power bush provide my electrical needs, and I'll also bet that the electricity was generated somewhere by a fossil fuel burning generating facility. Keep turning them dinosaurs into smoke! Long live fossil fuel!

Originally Posted by Raspy

That's fine, if you like "camping" in a parking lot, or paying for a camp site in a crowded "park". Not sure why dino electricity is better than solar electricity. But I am sure why solar is better than dino. Because you can camp off the beaten path, with plenty of power, for free. No reservations, quiet, no check-out times and no list of rules you must agree to before being allowed to stay. It's fun to be self sufficient. And the views are spectacular. Solar opens the door to silent luxury and convenience, in the wild. That's how you really get your money's worth. That is, unless you like the parking lot experience.

Enjoy,

Perry

[Casita Greg]

Originally Posted by Raspy

That's fine, if you like "camping" in a parking lot, or paying for a camp site in a crowded "park". Not sure why dino electricity is better than solar electricity. But I am sure why solar is better than dino. Because you can camp off the beaten path, with plenty of power, for free. No reservations, quiet, no check-out times and no list of rules you must agree to before being allowed to stay. It's fun to be self sufficient. And the views are spectacular. Solar opens the door to silent luxury and convenience, in the wild. That's how you really get your money's worth. That is, unless you like the parking lot experience.

Well, you make several incorrect assumptions, and you obviously know nothing about my style of camping. I would more refer to it as "glamping." and it is by choice. I generally stay at State Parks, County Parks, and some privately owned facilities, including some Tribal Casino RV sites now and then. I don't camp in "parking lots," as you call it. I have never even over-nighted at a Walmart! I'm not against your "clean energy" lifestyle. If it works for you, that's fine and dandy.

My point was a bit of tongue-in-cheek wry humor directed at all the "climate cult" hypocracy, those who tout all their mandates for clean energy, but they themselves still get 99% of their electricity from the same power grid all the rest of us use. And most of that power I and all those eco-friendly folks consume to recharge their "save the planet" electric vehicles, while at the grocery store, or wherever else you think that you are "owed" free power just because you bought an overpriced EV, is all generated somewhere by fossil fuel burning power plants. The hypocracy never ends.

[Tom Panning]

Originally Posted by Casita Greg

Well, you make several incorrect assumptions, and you obviously know nothing about my style of camping. I would more refer to it as "glamping." and it is by choice. I generally stay at State Parks, County Parks, and some privately owned facilities, including some Tribal Casino RV sites now and then. I don't camp in "parking lots," as you call it. I have never even over-nighted at a Walmart! I'm not against your "clean energy" lifestyle. If it works for you, that's fine and dandy.

My point was a bit of tongue-in-cheek wry humor directed at all the "climate cult" hypocracy, those who tout all their mandates for clean energy, but they themselves still get 99% of their electricity from the same power grid all the rest of us use. And most of that power I and all those eco-friendly folks consume to recharge their "save the planet" electric vehicles, while at the grocery store, or wherever else you think that you are "owed" free power just because you bought an overpriced EV, is all generated somewhere by fossil fuel burning power plants. The hypocracy never ends.

Wow, this has gotten off topic. I was surveying how much solar people had because small fiberglass campers can’t fit as many panels as most other campers. I want to install solar because I believe it will meet my camping needs better than the other options (e.g., campsites with hookups, portable solar, generators).

You commented that you don’t have any solar installed because you camp where electricity is provided. Duly noted.

But just for reference, I don’t believe anyone brought any climate stuff into this discussion until YOU did. If you want to “discuss” that, please start your own thread. I’ve read a lot more than I’ve written on this forum, and found a ton of useful information that way. But it’s really annoying when I find a thread that discusses a topic that I’m interested in, only to have it go off the rails and then have to sift through post after post of irrelevant crud to get the information that the thread is supposed to be discussing.

I think this is a thread that will be useful to other people in the future, so I’m asking that people start different threads to discuss the merits and types of full hookup campsites or the environmental impacts of electricity production.

[Raspy]

Originally Posted by Casita Greg

Well, you make several incorrect assumptions, and you obviously know nothing about my style of camping. I would more refer to it as "glamping." and it is by choice. I generally stay at State Parks, County Parks, and some privately owned facilities, including some Tribal Casino RV sites now and then. I don't camp in "parking lots," as you call it. I have never even over-nighted at a Walmart! I'm not against your "clean energy" lifestyle. If it works for you, that's fine and dandy.

My point was a bit of tongue-in-cheek wry humor directed at all the "climate cult" hypocracy, those who tout all their mandates for clean energy, but they themselves still get 99% of their electricity from the same power grid all the rest of us use. And most of that power I and all those eco-friendly folks consume to recharge their "save the planet" electric vehicles, while at the grocery store, or wherever else you think that you are "owed" free power just because you bought an overpriced EV, is all generated somewhere by fossil fuel burning power plants. The hypocracy never ends.

When I mention "camping" in parking lots, I said nothing about Walmart, that is your interpretation. A KOA is a parking lot. Most organized RV parks, or State Parks are basically parking lots. If you like that, fine, no problem. Second point: Using solar is not a statement about "clean energy". This is not the forum for trying to convince people to steer away from fossil fuels. After all, I tow my trailer with a fossil fueled truck. I am not trying to make a point about being "clean" or avoiding the use of fuel. Solar is about not being plugged into the grid and the freedom that comes from that disconnect. It is about not paying someone to supply me power in a parking lot. It is about not carrying or using a generator. It is about being independent and self reliant. It opens the door to camping anywhere, with no noise, while having plenty of power to use as you would if you were plugged in. This is really not rocket science, or hard to understand. For anyone that likes to be off grid in beautiful places, for an extended period of time, and camp for free, while still having plenty of power, solar is the answer. Batteries are a constant concern when camping, and lead acid batteries are easily damaged if discharged. Maybe you don't realize how nice it is to see your state of charge rising during the day, while not plugged in, silently from the sun. I don't feel the need to burn fuel to charge batteries, it works perfectly well to do so, but why do it if you don't have to? Unless you like the noise and smell of a generator, or want your money's worth for your parking fee, that you didn't have to pay in the first place. I will admit that going to a rally, or meeting friends at a destination RV park, is fun, but the purpose there is slightly different than camping in the forest or desert and enjoying what those places have to offer. Oh, and be sure to turn off your generator during quiet hours, get your money's worth of power and be ready to go before check out time in the morning.

[oldwave]

Originally Posted by Tom Panning

Wow, this has gotten off topic. I was surveying how much solar people had because small fiberglass campers can’t fit as many panels as most other campers. I want to install solar because I believe it will meet my camping needs better than the other options (e.g., campsites with hookups, portable solar, generators).

You commented that you don’t have any solar installed because you camp where electricity is provided. Duly noted.

But just for reference, I don’t believe anyone brought any climate stuff into this discussion until YOU did. If you want to “discuss” that, please start your own thread. I’ve read a lot more than I’ve written on this forum, and found a ton of useful information that way. But it’s really annoying when I find a thread that discusses a topic that I’m interested in, only to have it go off the rails and then have to sift through post after post of irrelevant crud to get the information that the thread is supposed to be discussing.

I think this is a thread that will be useful to other people in the future, so I’m asking that people start different threads to discuss the merits and types of full hookup campsites or the environmental impacts of electricity production.

Exactly

[oldwave]

300 watts on the roof, 412 amp hours of lithium with a Victron Multiplus. I may add another 400 next year and expand my alternator charging system.

[Raspy]

I realize it is hard to get very much solar on top of a molded fiberglass trailer. But here is some information about what different amounts of solar can do for you. Also remember that a ground system that is aimed at the sun will produce approximately twice the overall watts of the same size system, flat mounted on the roof. This fact is useful when sizing and wondering what different sized systems will do. A ground system can also be placed in the sun when the trailer is in the shade.

I started out with a 100 watt ground system powering my Oliver and it was helpful. I had lead acid batteries that should never be discharged below 50%, so the available power was limited.

Then I had a Black series HQ19 with 450 watts flat on the roof and 400 amp hours of AGM batteries. This was better, but still somewhat limited. One of the reasons it was better was that it charged anytime it was in the sun and not just when camped after setting it up. The batteries were still a weak point in the system.

Next came my Xplore X22. The original 380 watts of solar was not installed correctly and barely performed. I removed it and installed 660 watts of glass panels that were not shaded by any roof equipment. It also had 480 amp hours of lithium batteries. This system was wonderful! Only partial sun days would top off the batteries. We used lots of power and always had enough unless we were camped in cloudy weather for a week or so. That trailer had a compressor fridge that was always on and a microwave. I watched movies, charged computers, ran the Starlink and even ran the AC for periods of up to about three hours per day. Excellent. That system was a game changer and worked very well.

I now have an ROA Roamer 1 with 1,100 AH of lithium and 1,240 watts of solar. I just got it, so I have not tested it fully and the weather has been terrible. But here is the thing: It has an induction electric cooktop instead of propane, can do space heating from electric or gas, has a gas or electric water heater (run from the batteries), and it has a 12 volt AC system that can be run for many hours each day from the solar and batteries. This trailer is truly an off-grid solar trailer. It never needs to be plugged in to grid power and it operates mostly like a grid powered apartment.

The Xplore was an extremely practical system and was almost completely independent of grid power. One of my operating theories is that usage will always rise to meet supply, so it is always a good idea to install more than you think you need, room permitting, if possible. And lithium batteries work marvelously with solar because they can be run way down to about 5% if needed without damage.

One sizing technique is to add up all your loads and the times they will be used to arrive at a number of amp hours needed. I don't buy this with fiberglass trailers because the roof area is limited. Install as much as you can. It will not do everything, but it will be very useful. And adding more later is much harder than doing it all up front. Remember: usage will rise to meet supply. If you want more power later, you can always add a ground system and run them at the same time as needed.

With a molded fiberglass trailer, there must be compromises as the shape of the roof is not the best for solar. But getting as much as you can, within reason, makes life so much better when camping without hookups. If all you need is some lighting and to charge a computer and phone, and run the propane fridge, and maybe some furnace use, you can get there with the limited roof space. And with lithium batteries, you don't have to watch the state of charge so much. This means you can use more than you produce in a given day and make it up later.

As far as panels go, look for glass panels with a good output per square foot and a size that can be fitted to your roof. Use panels that all have the same maximum voltage output (different manufacturers make panels with different maximum voltages) Different size panels can be used in the array if needed. Find a good MPPT solar controller to manage the charging. Get a battery monitor, with shunt, that reads in percentage. A Victron 712 is a good example, but Go Power makes very nice units too. Run the proper size wiring to the controller that is mounted inside near the batteries. If there is a chance of shading, run the panels in parallel, so one does not shut the whole system down when shaded.

Solar work is about not introducing any deficiencies, like shading, small wire size, or poor controller design, that can limit performance. It has limited power, so give it the best chance to give you all it can. Careless work can cost a lot of performance. It is also a very simple concept and not rocket science. What it gives you can be one of the most satisfying aspects of your trailer: Freedom from hookups and generators. Freedom to camp anywhere, for as long as you'd like, with silent, free power.

[oldwave]

Nice write up and excellent advice. Thanks

[Mike Magee]

I just bought a 2012 Escape 19 that has a 95W panel on the roof. I doubted that the 95W would be enough to keep the two 6V batteries charged, but the seller assured me it has been plenty for them. Sure enough, on the way home I camped several nights with temps in the mid-20s and despite having the furnace run almost nonstop each night (thermostat set for 70 degrees) which took the batts to around 68%-70%, by mid day the panel got them back to 100% each day. I was also running the fridge and a couple of lights, plus recharging a laptop and phone, but that's all. Just providing another data point for you. I did take my portable 70W panel just in case, but I never needed it.


This summer I expect to be recharging my ebike, which will use quite a bit of juice. But the weather won't be cold enough to make the furnace run so much. I think I've got enough solar for my needs.

[highlander1]

I have 700 watts of solar with 280ah of Lithium on my scamp 16'. I can run my a/c direct off solar during the day and i use about 60ah overnight. I basically have unlimited A/C.

[Mike Magee]

FWIW, here's my brief experience. Last month I bought a 2012 Escape 19 with a 95W solar panel mounted and two 6V Trojans "under the hood" (in the front storage box). It was in Idaho. I stopped in Moab for some hiking in Arches on my way home. With 4 nights dipping into the mid-20s the furnace ran almost nonstop at night, draining the batteries to around 68-70% by morning. 3-way fridge (on LP) and lights were also running during the trip. And by mid day the panel had brought them back to 100%. Full sun most days, although part of one day was cloudy. I am tickled pink with this result.



I do have a 70W unmounted panel at the ready if needed due to shade, though. Of course, heavy overcast combined with lots of cold weather could cause me to need electric hookup or a generator (which I don't own). For my personal camping pattern, that situation should be rare.

[Tom Panning]

Originally Posted by highlander1

I have 700 watts of solar with 280ah of Lithium on my scamp 16'. I can run my a/c direct off solar during the day and i use about 60ah overnight. I basically have unlimited A/C.

Do you have a picture of how you got 700 watts of solar on the roof of a Scamp 16?

[mariaandskip]

Before I bought the panels and system for our Bigfoot 21, I cut out pieces of cardboard to the size of the various solar panels, then l laid these out on the roof to determine the best layout and the max number of panels that I could fit on the roof (5- 100Watt panels) and still be able to move around the panels.