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Old 04-12-2018, 10:17 PM   #1
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Solar Plan, What do you think?

After plenty of research we have narrowed down our "solar plan." We are open to all comments, ideas, and changes. The only parts of our system we already bought are the fuse box and the MaxxAir fan.

The only things we plan on using our batteries for are what is pictured, but with maybe 3 LED lights, not just the one in the diagram.

Thanks everyone!
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Old 04-12-2018, 11:01 PM   #2
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There are probably many controller designs out there. Our controller only has the solar and battery ports. Our "load" circuits come directly off the battery. The installer didn't fuse anything, but I added a fuse block to the positive battery terminal.

From my perspective, you seem to have a workable plan
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Old 04-13-2018, 03:52 AM   #3
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I run a Zamp dual battery charger controller and as Dave said the load comes direct off battery. My problem is, where I have to charge each battery on separate line, I can not hook my batteries together. In doing so, I create just one big battery.
I do not have 2 batteries on trailer anyway but plan to take extra battery along and keep it charged up just in case my main battery gets too low.
I will have to change it but that only takes a minute or 2.
If there is a way to hook 2 batteries together but charge them separate please, anyone, let me know.
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Old 04-13-2018, 05:54 AM   #4
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Yes, loads on the battery. The load on the controller is usually pretty limited but I dont see the info on your controller so cant be sure. Loads (fuseblock) connected to the battery avoids those limitations. Basically wire it the same as you would with a converter, with the solar controller taking the place of the converter (or wired in parallel with a converter).
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Old 04-13-2018, 06:09 AM   #5
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Do you have a converter?
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Old 04-13-2018, 07:03 AM   #6
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Thank you all for the input! We really appreciate it!

The controller I was looking at was something like this one with the load option. If most think it is better to run directly off the battery I can adjust that for sure.

I've been looking around this morning and this one also seems like a good option and is available in the bundle pack for the solar panels. With this option, I would run the fuse box directly to the batteries.

I do not have a converter. We may end up getting a converter down the road, but we do not plan on connecting to shore power. We have never stayed in an RV park or a campsite with hookups and we don't plan on doing that anytime soon. We also will not be taking her out for more than a couple days at a time. This is very much a starter plan for our electricity and eventually, we may add an inverter as well, but right now since we were originally backpackers and campers, any kind of electrical upgrades like having lights and a fan is not a necessity, but a luxury. We know it would be helpful to have the option to connect to shore power, but for the near-term, we are sticking with a solar only setup.

Do you all think the 30amp fuses are appropriate/needed? I've seen some systems use them and others do not.
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Old 04-13-2018, 01:30 PM   #7
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solar plan, what do you think?

Very workable and well thought out.. However take all of your loads off the battery as the load terminals on your controller probably will only handle about 5 Amps at best. The 30 Amp capacity refers only to the solar input to the batteries. For a small set up like this a PWM controller is more than adequate, just buy a good one! The controller terminal is usually used to to control a relay for a yard light or similar. Use suitable fuses or breakers.

I see that you have no provision for an inverter and that's OK. If you don't plan on any AC consumption then you don't need a converter either. Schumacher makes a couple of great "smart" chargers that can be plugged into shore power to supplement your Solar as required! Way less expensive than a converter and considerably kinder to your batteries. Make sure that all of your cables have tinned connectors and use grease, you will considerably reduce the inevitable corrosion.

While gel cells are maintenance free that only applies to the battery itself and unfortunately you end up tossing a battery that just needs a pint of water. No, you don't have to carry battery acid. I've been using bottled water for years! For the same price and the minor inconvenience of maintaining the the cables and electrolyte you could get a couple of GC2 6 volt flooded units that will give about double the performance. Cheers. W.
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Old 04-13-2018, 01:41 PM   #8
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workhorsed,

Thank you! Great advice on the "smart charger"

I'm looking at this charge controller now and will plan on running the load straight from the batter to the fuse box.

I'm also playing with the idea of using a 12V battery instead of two 6V to save on weight and space, but I still need to work on a pro/con list for that decision.
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Old 04-13-2018, 01:46 PM   #9
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Looks like over kill to me.
I get by easily with a 74 map hour battery and a 65 watt solar panel that I use about every 4 days when I'm out more that 4 days.
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Old 04-13-2018, 02:19 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Byron Kinnaman View Post
Looks like over kill to me.
I get by easily with a 74 map hour battery and a 65 watt solar panel that I use about every 4 days when I'm out more that 4 days.
I agree. We have a group 24 AGM battery, 60 watt solar, a 6 amp Morningstar PWM controller and a charge line from the truck. Load is a few LEDs, a fan, a water pump, and we might charge a few things. Less than 10 AMP-HRS per day. The trailer came with a converter we only use if we are forced to take a site with power. If it died tomorrow I would not replace it. We camp at least 50 days a season with no issues.

Some turn this into a hobby. Both Byron and I are retired EE's and did it for a living. We tend to keep things simple.
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Old 04-13-2018, 02:44 PM   #11
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I agree. We have a group 24 AGM battery, 60 watt solar, a 6 amp Morningstar PWM controller and a charge line from the truck. Load is a few LEDs, a fan, a water pump, and we might charge a few things. Less than 10 AMP-HRS per day. The trailer came with a converter we only use if we are forced to take a site with power. If it died tomorrow I would not replace it. We camp at least 50 days a season with no issues.

Some turn this into a hobby. Both Byron and I are retired EE's and did it for a living. We tend to keep things simple.
Ya any my solar system is probably the simplest and easiest system I've ever designed.
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Old 04-13-2018, 06:54 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wxmixte View Post
After plenty of research we have narrowed down our "solar plan." We are open to all comments, ideas, and changes. The only parts of our system we already bought are the fuse box and the MaxxAir fan.

The only things we plan on using our batteries for are what is pictured, but with maybe 3 LED lights, not just the one in the diagram.

Thanks everyone!
Ashley,

Although the batteries may be more than you need as Raz and Byron noted, the Fantastic and MaxAir fans consume a fair amount of power. I suggest looking into a little PWM motor speed controller for the fan.

This is not a PWM controller for the solar charging circuitry, but is something that allows the fan to run at a slower speed with a lower current draw. They run about $10 or so on eBay; you can search there for "pwm speed controller".

Running the MaxAir at a lower speed can provide adequate ventilation or cooling in some conditions, especially if you are strategic in arranging how the air enters the trailer so it can flow where it will do the most good.

I believe a PWM drive would help you conserve your battery capacity. That might give you the ability to use or perhaps even install less. It can also result in the fan running quieter, and extend the mechanical life as the fan will sometimes be able to run at a slower speed.
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Old 04-14-2018, 12:36 AM   #13
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Ashley,

Although the batteries may be more than you need as Raz and Byron noted, the Fantastic and MaxAir fans consume a fair amount of power. I suggest looking into a little PWM motor speed controller for the fan.

This is not a PWM controller for the solar charging circuitry, but is something that allows the fan to run at a slower speed with a lower current draw. They run about $10 or so on eBay; you can search there for "pwm speed controller".

Running the MaxAir at a lower speed can provide adequate ventilation or cooling in some conditions, especially if you are strategic in arranging how the air enters the trailer so it can flow where it will do the most good.

I believe a PWM drive would help you conserve your battery capacity. That might give you the ability to use or perhaps even install less. It can also result in the fan running quieter, and extend the mechanical life as the fan will sometimes be able to run at a slower speed.
The fan only consumes power if you run it. I purchased a Constant Breeze fan (fantastic fan not permanently installed) which I've owned for almost as long as I've owned the trailer (12+ years). It's been used maybe twice for a couple hours. No problem with the battery. With the 3 windows over the bed open there's enough air circulation to keep it cool at night. The only time that didn't happen was once in Death Valley when low at night was all the way down to 80°F.
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Old 04-14-2018, 01:00 AM   #14
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There's always several ways to approach things. One way is the over kill way which can be expensive in both money and time. My preferred way when it comes to trailers is camp for a while and evaluate the results in the needs and wants area. Progress in this manner until you have the complete system that works well for you.
I can tell what works for me, but we are a retired couple that heads south in the winter and back north in the summer. Usually our camping stays are minimum 4 nights and a maximum 100 nights. We've found that 4 days or less the solar panel isn't needed.
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Old 04-14-2018, 03:12 AM   #15
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In our 17' Boler we did the following.
100 watt solar panel, roof mounted.
2 trojan T 105 golf cart batteries.
1500 watt Cobra inverter. with remote on off.
inverter supplies 2 dedicated outlets close to galley and dinette.
for computer small vacuum cleaner & her majesties elec coffee maker.
batteries supply all original lighting converted to LED's
We also put a separate charging circuit directly from the tow veh batts to the trailer batts with 30 amp fuse at each end, incase we have more than three or four cloudy days consecutively.
This past winter from Portland to Gilmore Ca driving alternate days. Then between Tucson and El Centro & Death Valley and Lake Mead we found that we do not need to use shore power at all.
What I would change in your diagram.
Would add the inverter with 6ga stranded welding wire with copper connectors, as close to the batts as you can get it.and would use 14ga extension wire to connect the outlets to the inverter and for the remote on off switch.
I would use 14 ga extension wire between the PV panel and controller, with the controller as close to the batts as possible.
The balance of 12 volt wiring I would leave as original. Our 10 interior and 1 porch lamps, are all LED warm white (her majesty likes that color as it is closest to incandescent). I find the best source of wires for new work is 3 wire extension wire 14ga. I cut the ends off and use as required, it is cheap, double insulated and I ignore the green ground wire.
Use a pc of the same welding wire between the batts.
I take all loads directly from the batts not from the charge controller, for a number of reasons. Convertor needs much more power than controller can handle.
Some times we may plug into shore power, or leave the tow veh connected overnight or at tea time and lunch.
We used the roof A/C wiring to run the shurflow hatch fan connected to 12V. PS shurflow quality control has slid, use another brand, same for water pump.
Your wiring is overkill, fine if money is no object. You could have many more LED lights.
I read extensively at night, and when there is internet we use it lots, the only time we concern ourselves with power use is on cloudy days.
This set up has worked for us now for 7 months full time in winter, a year ago in Mexico and this year 3 months as noted above. We only plug in because we paid for it in campgrounds, & never more than a week per month. Coffee maker is the max draw for her majesty and she has had no problems with having power in the morning.
Hope this helps.
Have many many years experience RVing and Sailing off grid.
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Old 04-14-2018, 06:36 AM   #16
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While I used to go up to 3 nights in my Escape 19 with temps at night near freezing with dual 6V batteries, we really had to manage things closely, with only running the furnace and lights. We also set our thermostat down to 9-10°C at night to minimize the furnace run time. The furnace fan is the worst culprit, but one you should have little issue with where you live.

You will likely make good use of your ceiling fan, but your proposed solar should keep up with it. It would never work for me, but I have a larger space to heat and light, and camp in colder climates.

Like others already said, draw the power to distribution directly off the batteries.

I note that you have MC4 connectors, and while they work great, they are not a good option for regular connecting. Not sure where your batteries are located, but if inside I would use something like the Zamp inlet, and if outside I would wire some kind of connector to the batteries or just use a large alligator clip.

Though maybe not required that much in your lower current setup, I really like having breakers instead of fuses for disconnecting system components for any reason.

I have to say I am just loving my solar setup. Maybe would say with 240W mounted on top, and an 80W portable (which I haven't had need of in the first year of using the setup), but it sure is nice to keep the batteries maintained to full voltage each day. Gotta say, I just love making toast in an electric toaster as opposed to the stovetop method that really dries it out and takes much longer to toast.

Your diagram is done up much nicer than mine.

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Old 04-14-2018, 08:13 AM   #17
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don't need solar for couple days of use ...

Generally when doing a "solar plan" one includes sufficient battery capacity to get through two or three cloudy days. Since you said you only plan to use the camper a couple of days at a time, I (another retired EE) would suggest you don't "need" solar at all, or for that matter a tow vehicle charging wire. Just charge the battery back up with a good smart charger between uses. Then spend extra $$$ on other toys

I pack a free-standing solar panel (and DIY angle brackets) and solar charge controller when I know I might be boondocking for more than a couple of days. And I charge my little 12v AGM battery with a CTEK smart charger between uses.
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Old 04-14-2018, 11:12 AM   #18
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Ashley,

I'm not clear what MaxxAir fan you have, but it looks like you might be able to run it very efficiently without a PWM controller. I have posted a link to and a graphic from a web page comparing two fans.

Fantastic Fan vs MaxxFan Comparison, including amp usage - Truck Campers - Wander the West

We once ran a FanTastic fan all night at low speed in our teardrop trailer and it took a little 35 amp-hour 'wheelchair' battery down well past the limit you would normally want to allow.

A post on eTrailer notes different current draws for what I believe is a different model fantastic fan from the one linked above:
  • Reply: I spoke to my contact at Fantastic Vent and she informed me that the roof vent # FV801250, you were looking at motor will draw 36 watts. On low it will draw 1.86 amps, on medium 2.29 amps, and on high 3 amps.
Bottom line, the 10-speed MaxxAir this fellow tested looks pretty sweet for its ability to run at low speeds with low draws. Heck, you can even call it 11-speed if you count the 'off' position!
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Old 04-14-2018, 11:16 AM   #19
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This one goes to 11!
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Goes to 11.jpg  
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Old 04-14-2018, 12:16 PM   #20
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Not all controllers are created equal !

Ashley,
I think you've been getting some misleading advice. You CAN run your devices off the Load terminals by using a controller that can handle it, and there's a great advantage in doing so.
The Renogy controller you're looking at does not appear to have that capacity, and seems rather pricey for a 20A PWM unit. I use this one:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00JMLPP12...a-318232542706
What may be overkill for some can be neccessary for others. I run a compressor fridge, furnace blower, stereo amp, water pump, lots of lights, fan, and charge up some small devices.
By running everything off the Load Terminals (through a fuse box), I am able to see how much current(amps) each device uses by isolating them and reading the display. I'm also able to see cumulative amps in and amps out over time (amp hours). This lets me know if I'm gaining or loosing in the solar game, and whether I should get conservative or not worry about it. This is my third year using this set up. No problems. I have an inverter, and that's the only thing that is connected directly to the batteries. I've used it only once.

I can vouch for the controller I use, but whatever you decide, CHECK THE SPECS. See what is listed for LOAD current.

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