New Scamp 13 options regarding weight

[William Deak]

About cooking. We have the built in 2 burner propane. However, unless raining or very cold, we do the vast majority of our cooking outside using three sources:

1. Inexpensive portable butane stove; these are cheap.
2. Jet Boil system; not so cheap.
3. Campfire.

[Gompka]

FYI, i have a 13ft scamp big bed and front bunks with refrigerator, gray tank, and roof a/c, i do not have an awning. I have a water pump and water tank. I just went on a 9 day trip, so we were packed with a decent amount of stuff, we have a porta potty under the front bunk that was also full. I have a fiberglass propane tank that is 1/4 full and I have a large group 31 battery. I have a front plastic tongue box with the electric cord and wheel chocks etc. Our water tank was about 1/4 full also. I stopped at a CAT scale today and the weight of the scamp was 1720 & 320lb tongue weight.

[floyd]

Originally Posted by Gompka

FYI, i have a 13ft scamp big bed and front bunks with refrigerator, gray tank, and roof a/c, i do not have an awning. I have a water pump and water tank. I just went on a 9 day trip, so we were packed with a decent amount of stuff, we have a porta potty under the front bunk that was also full. I have a fiberglass propane tank that is 1/4 full and I have a large group 31 battery. I have a front plastic tongue box with the electric cord and wheel chocks etc. Our water tank was about 1/4 full also. I stopped at a CAT scale today and the weight of the scamp was 1720 + 320lb tongue weight.

I assume you mean 1720 including 320 tongue weight?

[Gompka]

Originally Posted by floyd

I assume you mean 1720 including 320 tongue weight?

Yes, that is what I meant 1720with a 320lb tongue weight.

[likeair2me]

What part of Illinois are you in?

[floyd]

Originally Posted by likeair2me

What part of Illinois are you in?

North central, just off I-80

[Gompka]

Originally Posted by floyd

I assume you mean 1720 including 320 tongue weight?

Sorry for the multiple posts, but going by the fiberglass weights in the real world spreadsheet I am at 1720 axle weight + 320 tongue weight for a total of 2040. Which matches up with some of the scamp 13s in that thread. My tongue weight would be lower if I had a full fresh tank, I usually tow with it full.

[Jon in AZ]

That's really heavy for that layout. Here are the S13's currently listed in the trailer weights database:


Still, it's a really small sample size given the number of S13's out there. Message your weights to Jon Vermilye and he will add your trailer to the spreadsheet.

[conniej]

we tow our Scamp 13 (standard, no bath) with our CRV and it pulls beautifully. We have several options - roof fan, extra cabinets, grey water tank, water heater, plus several little options. We are still under our 1500 lb towing limit - we have weighed it twice at a certified weigh station and keep the paper in the glove compartment. We put all of our extra gear in our car and have weighed the car to make sure we are within our gross vehicle weight rating limit, which includes the axle rating. Trailer brakes are essential, so make sure you have those installed. We live in the rockies and go up and down mountain grades all the time and are really happy with our choice. We will definitely keep our transmission serviced regularly! PS we pull with an empty water tank.

[JessicaJ]

Carbondale, southern Illinois

[JessicaJ]

That Mr. Heater Buddy is pretty neat.

We live in Carbondale, southern Illinois.

We put our deposit down for a 13' without bathroom last week. Any later and we would have been inside the school year for pickup in 2021, which is not doable for us.

We are leaving the AC off for sure and plan to spend the year looking at how to lighten the load. I was told the weight for the 13' with bathroom is 1410 lbs so we are expecting it will be a bit under that and then you add on the few items we got. We've left the cabinets and plan to take off cabinet doors, bunk cushion support/backing, change the battery to a lithium and get a smaller propane tank or a light one. I didn't know fiberglass was possible, will look into that. I will also probably design a different table top that is lighter but still structurally sound. When we tow, we'll leave the table stanchion at home and most items off the trailer save what is necessary for balance.

Also, our 2012 CRV is an AWD EXL so it is rated for 100 lbs more payload (every little bit counts) at around 4,550. The car weighs about 3,550. There is no way we will ever load it with enough to exceed the 1000 lb allowance (including tongue and gas, etc). We are already adept in lightweight travel.

Regarding r-value, I'm still pursuing that with Scamp. Their brochure still states R15!, which I agree is impossible. The photo (floating around) of the core sample of a scamp, with a note of the type of insulation is not accurate from what I can tell. If you look at the photo is it actually not reflectix, rather a batt insulation. The current models are insulated with a reflective bubble barrier only, according to the salesperson.

[Jon in AZ]

Originally Posted by JessicaJ

Regarding r-value, I'm still pursuing that with Scamp. Their brochure still states R15!, which I agree is impossible. The photo (floating around) of the core sample of a scamp, with a note of the type of insulation is not accurate from what I can tell. If you look at the photo is it actually not reflectix, rather a batt insulation. The current models are insulated with a reflective bubble barrier only, according to the salesperson.

Reflectix is a foil bubble radiant barrier. Scamp uses Rayfoil, which is a similar product. A single piece of the stuff has two interlocking sheets of bubble wrap (bubbles offset so one layer fills in the voids of the other) with shiny foil front and back. That is confirmed by the core sample pictures I have seen.

The R15 comes from the product spec sheet, which assumes it is used as a radiant barrier with one side facing an open space. It is designed to reflect heat back into the space. Using it as a thermal layer in a sandwich is a hack and its insulating value minimal. The extend to which the headliner and adhesive (both of which are somewhat porous) allow for reflected heat is uncertain and debated. It isn't R15, and Scamp is not a winter trailer.

But it is inexpensive, relatively easy to work with, and works about as well as any other very thin insulation (1/4" or so), so I have no problem with it. I figure the fuzzy headliner adds some value by trapping dead air in the fibers. The factory furnace is pretty strong, so most people can be comfortable a bit below freezing. Much beyond that and the plumbing cannot be used anyway.

[Civilguy]

Originally Posted by JessicaJ

We are leaving the AC off for sure and plan to spend the year looking at how to lighten the load.

As mentioned, you will find a number of assemblies which can be removed and/or replaced to reduce the weight.

The 8' Fiamma awning is some 43 lbs or so. It's a very nice unit, (in contrast to the Dometic power awning we currently have). However, there are a variety of lighter and more versatile awning options that you could consider.

There was a composite propane cylinder which was recalled in 2013.

https://www.passagemaker.com/trawler...pany-insolvent

Today you can buy a Viking brand composite cylinder, or an aluminum cylinder from Worthington or Manchester, who are also the two major steel cylinder suppliers.

It sounds like you'll be engaged by the project. Best of luck with your new trailer.

[steve dunham]

I’ve read this whole thread twice and

[Sunrisetrucker]

Originally Posted by floyd

Without contesting that which you have alleged about R-Value, A Mr. Heater Buddy with a 1lb propane disposable bottle can do the job very well without electricity.

Catalytic heaters are great when used in the right way. But the last thing you want in a small enclosed space like a Scamp 13 is a catalytic heater, using up your oxygen and giving off dangerous carbon monoxide as well lots of water vapour fogging up your windows.

[rdickens]

Jessica,

The exact R-value may not be very important (IMHO). From our pop-up trailer days (and a few tent camping trips), we have sleeping bags that are good to 20 degrees or below? We can "sleep comfortably" with little to no heat at all. A ceramic heater or propane heater is mostly useful for taking the chill off (or warming the whole trailer) in the morning. If we are out of the wind, in a fiberglass trailer, we can usually manage to stay warm enough.

Our CRV was a 2011 model. IIRC, you have about 5 hp more in your 2012 CRV.

When it is time to get a new tow vehicle, as I've mentioned in other posts, I think tow vehicles with turbocharged engines (like our 2014 Ford Escape 2.0L Ecoboost) or diesel engines are the very best for towing due to their high torque at low RPMs.

The hatches in our current 2017 Scamp 16 Deluxe are chipboard but, I think that the table (36x30) and the filler board (16x30) are probably heavier MDF? Our filler board weighed just under 13lbs. Since the table is over twice that size, I'd guess it to be about 26-30 lbs. Combined total would then be around 40+ lbs.

I used 1/8" plywood (Menards) glued to the top and bottom of 1/2" EPS/XPS foam with Gorilla Wood Glue (the cream colored stuff like TiteBond II - not the yellowish Gorilla Glue that expands a lot). For good measure, I then painted both sides with Glidden Gripper (now PPG Gripper? - Home Depot) and embedded a layer of fiberglass screen on both sides. The resulting filler board weighs 3.2 lbs. That is roughly 25% of the original weight and it is super strong.

I've constructed (but not yet used) a similar table; only I used a 1/4" oak plywood Handi-panel (Menards) for the top surface of the table (with Minwax Natural 209 stain and Minwax Polycrylic protective finish) that matches the rest of the oak interior in our Deluxe. Total weight is approximately 7.7 pounds or less than 30% of the original table top.

For the large chipboard hatch covers under the bed/dinette, I just used the EPS/XPS foam and a couple of layers of fiberglass screen on each side. Without the 1/8" plywood, those hatches probably probably weigh 20% (or less?) of the original chipboard hatch weight.

For your doors and shelves, you might consider using the 1/4" oak panels, coating the unsanded side with the Gorilla Wood Glue (it dries clear), and then laying in some fiberglass screening to seal up the somewhat porous wood and hopefully prevent any warping?

A very lightweight and inexpensive wind deflector could probably also be created with the composite construction technique (maybe 1/8" plywood on the top side and fiberglass screening on the bottom side ... or maybe fiberglass screening on both sides?)

When we first brought our Scamp 13 home, we were driving into a 20+ mph headwind and it almost cut our normal CRV highway MPG in half. About 30 minutes out, I turned around and went back to Backus to make sure that our trailer brake shoes weren't too tight and dragging or that our new brake controller wasn't malfunctioning and applying some braking. (That was before I knew about possibly using the D3 button to lock out the higher transmission gear and/or slowing down a bit ... especially going into a headwind)

Not to worry! ...
You are asking the right questions and you've got some time to figure lots of things out!

Best of luck with everything!

Ray